Why all terrorists are Pashtuns?

[BarakzaiAbdali]

We also then report Karzai,the olasi jerga, Loya jerga , all the governors of all the provinces of Afghanistan, all the ministers, the supreme court, all the Afghan police and forces, more than 90% population of Afghanistan, all who belong to the legislative, execucive and judicial machinery of Afghanistan. Can you ban them from Afghanistan! All of them support the international forces in Afghanistan.

If you dont support the fighters against the terror and you suppoirt the Taliban, the Alqaida then please continue supporting them but dont terrorise others who dont support Alqaida and Taliban. Please dont take all this emotionally. Read and comment on the contents and never on the one who writes it. Just refute what is said not targetting who says it. let there be freedom of expression and not taliban tactics to ban, stop, control and punish. Yes those who insult some one personally then disciplinary action may be taken.

Lets have free exchange of ideas and view. Lets learn, share, criticize , analyze in a friendly way.

Osho, we argued this before and you have no evidence based information to offer. Each and every argument you make is based on pure emotion. As an example you made the statement: "They are there at the behest of the legitimate government of Afghanistan."

How so Sir? Even the backer of that legitimate government questions the legitimacy of it based on the democratic process (i.e. Obama questioning the corrupt vote and its outcomes... the recent parliament vote etc).

Its deceptive of you to continue to use missionary logic (i.e. recycle the same arguments that were thoroughly debunked elsewhere) solely because you believe that repeating a false statement or propaganda makes it the truth. You are required, first and foremost to provide a thorough evidence based rebuttal and provide data... none of which you have done:

http://www.pashtunforums.com/politic...nalists-12516/

Illegitimate Afghan Vote for the Presidential Election:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125375338620236147.html

And Now the parliament;

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/MA25Df02.html

[Toramana]

BarakzaiAbdali, the problem with you is, that now as the Islamo-fascists and Islamo-sadists like Al-Queda and their Afghan buddies e.g., Mullah Omar have brought it upon themselves by serving as toilet papers to the West during the whold Cold War era and later fighting like rabid dogs (Gulbuddin versus Rabbani, and you name it), you are laying the blame at the door steps of nationlists and secularists.

Eevn now every Islamist is like a minefield implanted in some Muslim society that can be detonated anytime to destablise societies and reverse the wheel of time backward in an attemp to take things back to some stone age era of barbarism.

[ScimitarXEdge]

Toramana, you have to admit secularists like Najibullah laying back as Russians annihilated 1.5 million Afghans, wasn't really much to their credibility. But what does human life matter to you? Your measure of progress are Appeals to Novelty and any false dogma of modernity you blindly enslave yourself to without question.

[graveyardofempires]

BarakzaiAbdali, the problem with you is, that now as the Islamo-fascists and Islamo-sadists like Al-Queda and their Afghan buddies e.g., Mullah Omar have brought it upon themselves by serving as toilet papers to the West during the whold Cold War era and later fighting like rabid dogs (Gulbuddin versus Rabbani, and you name it), you are laying the blame at the door steps of nationlists and secularists.

Eevn now every Islamist is like a minefield implanted in some Muslim society that can be detonated anytime to destablise societies and reverse the wheel of time backward in an attemp to take things back to some stone age era of barbarism.

"islamo-fascism"
the joke is on you

[BarakzaiAbdali]

BarakzaiAbdali, the problem with you is, that now as the Islamo-fascists and Islamo-sadists like Al-Queda and their Afghan buddies e.g., Mullah Omar have brought it upon themselves by serving as toilet papers to the West during the whold Cold War era and later fighting like rabid dogs (Gulbuddin versus Rabbani, and you name it), you are laying the blame at the door steps of nationlists and secularists.

Eevn now every Islamist is like a minefield implanted in some Muslim society that can be detonated anytime to destablise societies and reverse the wheel of time backward in an attemp to take things back to some stone age era of barbarism.

Salamoona wrorre,

As we will be showing here in the coming days and as we have already demonstrated with some evidence, this charge is invalidated and nonevidence based:

http://www.pashtunforums.com/politic...upation-13535/

We will contribute more in the coming days as I have been a bit slow with it and I want to carefully digest Scheuer's magna opus.

The bottome line appears to be that this was the war of the barefoot, the starving, the simple Afghan, who grabbed his grandfather's Lee Enfield rifle to fight the Soviet invasion. Back then, Achekzai and his ilk in KP with their rat (red) hats were backing Najib to kill us... and now they have jumped on the new boat of secular capitalism to kill us some more. One would hope that they begin to wish onto their brothers as they wish for themselves.

However, here is his answer to your charge... I suggest you write this doyen if Terrorism and Security Studies and post the aftermath of an evidence based arguement here for us to see:

"Well, no. While the immediate spark for events in Tunisia, Egypt, and Yemen came from poverty, oppression, etc, the ultimate cause is the unIslamic nature of the dictatorial governments that long have ruled the three states in question. Each regime has used the rhetoric of Islam in public statements and the methodology of European Fascism as its instrument of government. On this point the Neoconservatives were absolutely right: The Muslim world is rife with Islamofascists. What the Necons deliberately failed to add to this truism is that the Islamofascists are not found among the mujahedin, but rather man the Arab regimes that Washington, many of its Western allies, and Israel have supported for several decades."

Wrorre, evidence, and evidence from top notch sources like this one trump anecdote, propaganda, and opinion... everytime.

*I expect that the next attempt will be to committ ad hominem on Mike... watch for this dear readers and you will see that this attempt to discredit such a valuable source will fall flat on its face. My repeated referencing to him is because he is a high impact factor source.

[Manzareh]

All these things are positive and I would be the happiest man on earth if Pashtuns are the the manufacturers of the best cars of the world, the best long distance runners etc but they should not be the world best terrorists or Taliban or supporters of Alqaida. they should be famous not notorious. .

even if they were the manufacturers of the best cars, best long distance runners etc they would still be known as terrorists, it depends on the media and how the world labels people. just because you label someone something it doesnt mean they are what you label them.

Just tell me a simple thing. Are you in favour of Taliban and Alqaida. If you are then no need of further discussion and if you are not then please suggest how can we combat these menices.

the way to combat these menices is to spread true Islam.

[Toramana]

Brizenski...For BarakzaiAbdali

Q: And neither do you regret having supported the Islamic fundamentalism, having given arms and advice to future terrorists?

B: What is most important to the history of the world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BRZ110A.html

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Brizenski...For BarakzaiAbdali

Q: And neither do you regret having supported the Islamic fundamentalism, having given arms and advice to future terrorists?

B: What is most important to the history of the world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BRZ110A.html

Khan Saib,

Think about it on a practical level. Address, in a reasonable fashion what the nominally religious villager survivalist was facing.

Forget the parts where Zahir Shah and Daud Khan played cards with the Russkies and forget the part where the US formulates the actual bait tactic.

Address, in a human fashion this issue:

In Qandahar, the Soviet invasion resulted in the following:
1) Heads of families were killed in a manner that you have not seen yet in KP. They lined up males and shot them in the back of the head like the world saw done by the serbians to Bosnians.
2) They destroyed shrines and anything they deemed representative of a feudal mentality.
3) They let the KHAD hounds free on the populace.

Whether Pakistan became involved or not was irrelevent to the man on the ground in southern Afghanistan. How was he to deal with Najib when he brutalized the populace? This brand of murder started under Taraki and continued even after the Soviets left.

The populace did not know the names of Kamal Ataturk, Lenin, Brezinzki etc when they picked up the gun.

What would you have done, Toramana Saib, had you been the man in Behsud or any of the villages?

There are people here on this forum that lost whole families to the Red War Machine.

They were not concerned with Western, Saudi, Pakistani, etc collusion. Their concern was that same concern that the American insurgents faced when they decided that British hegemony could not be allowed to stand. They fought with French muskets... but make no mistake about it... it was the Americans doing the fighting. In this same fashion, make no mistake, the bare foot Afghan was fighting the juggernaut, not Brzenski.

Finally, if you are upset with Mr. Brzenski, then you and Mr. Bin Ladin have common ideologies because he himself noted that Afghanistan had become the playground for imperial powers. He noted that where the Russians came, the Americans would follow..

So based on this evidence, your own statements above, why would any Afghan trust an American?

[ScimitarXEdge]

Brizenski...For BarakzaiAbdali

Q: And neither do you regret having supported the Islamic fundamentalism, having given arms and advice to future terrorists?

B: What is most important to the history of the world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BRZ110A.html

Firstly it's envogue in popular culture to conflate terms extremism with fundamentalism but they're not the same thing, the flaws of extremism does not make fundamentalism flawed.

That said; yes we realize that the colonial powers have manipulated any and all things for their agenda, they even manipulate communism, look at the Iran-Contra Scandal in the 80's. However, let's be intellectually honest here, The problem wasn't Islamic fundamentalism, the problem was different varities of Imperial powers all acting for their scheme, what did Secular Afghan government backed by Russia do for Afghanistan other than helping them slaughter 1.5 Million? If we go by raw statistics that makes them worse than all the bunch, even psychos like Gulbuddin or Massoud. However, we have to address that the manipulations of Colonialists/imperialists play the central theme here. They're the root of the issue; whether they're Capitalist variety or Communist variety. Everywhere Europeans have gone , has turned to crap.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Brizenski...For BarakzaiAbdali

Q: And neither do you regret having supported the Islamic fundamentalism, having given arms and advice to future terrorists?

B: What is most important to the history of the world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BRZ110A.html

By the way, do you want me to get you a patkaay like mine? I figure you can get me a Yusufzai dastoor/patkaay, and we can trade. That way if I visit your area and wear it they won't call me a spagaa infested Apganeea/Kabulaay (jk).

[ScimitarXEdge]

I love the Hotak Lungay, it's soooo exotic, I feel like I'm wearing a crown.

[Toramana]

By the way, do you want me to get you a patkaay like mine? I figure you can get me a Yusufzai dastoor/patkaay, and we can trade. That way if I visit your area and wear it they won't call me a spagaa infested Apganeea/Kabulaay (jk).

Hahahaaaa...Ya Bacha that would be nice...But what about this spagaa...infested...it is an overstatement....

[ScimitarXEdge]

Hahahaaaa...Ya Bacha that would be nice...But what about this spagaa...infested...it is an overstatement....

there's always lice shampoo, it's ok wrorukaia, we wont make fun of your lice problem

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Hahahaaaa...Ya Bacha that would be nice...But what about this spagaa...infested...it is an overstatement....

I was traveling as a semi tourist through Pakistan in 1996. There was a place called Abbotabad. I guess there is some Army station there because they were doing some flag salute thing. Everyone stopped and saluted the flag except me. Here in the states, that sort of stuff is not mandatory. They may get annoyed if you dont stand during the pledge of allegiance or during the Star Spangled Banner etc, but I was not a Pakistani national. A regimen man got upset with me and came over and asked me and my cousin why we had not saluted. I respectfully told him of my national affiliations. He spit on the ground and told me that A) he did not believe I was an American citizen and that B) I was another one of those lice infested kabulyaan lol.

[Badlun]

Per Matthew Hoh, their ideology does not appear to be constant war... but rather war against an outsider.... per Scheuer, they appear to have bought incorruptible stability to the region.

Proof sir... proof in the future please as opposed to anecdote.

As We noted before, Mr Hoh says the following regarding your claim of what actually causes the deaths of innocents:

http://www.thenation.com/article/157...-insider-talks

"We add more troops, which strengthens the Taliban and weakens support for the government. Suicide attacks, IEDs, military and civilian dead or wounded—all rise commensuratelywith eachincrease in foreign troop or Afghan government presence."

So perhaps, per the evidence your sentence should read:

Taliban kill innocent troops because of their low resolution weaponry that they must utilize when a nonmuslim invader, or an army funded by a nonmuslim invader (Pakistan's army) enter their territory.

If one Hoh talks of something then you take it as a valid argument and if the presence of the international troops is allowed by the Wolasi Jerga and Loya Jerga of Afghanistan , by hundreds of parliamenterians, then thats not a proof for you.There are thousands of scholars who are against Alqaida and Taliban but you just blindly believe in Hoh.

Where is that stability of Taliban now. Why they dont rule over Afghanistan any more. Do you still think that Taliban will defeat the International and Afghan forces and they will once again rule over Afghanistan. If you think like that then you will be living in a fools paradise. Its the era of democracy, modernism, human rights, fundamental rights of expression, movement and happiness. This is not the era for for those who carry us back to the stone age.

Just giving a reference of a link does not make an argument valid. Its not necessary in this kind of discussions that I must quote some one else. May be some one else will quote me!

I have always tried to reply whenever I felt it necessary and useful. I dont believe in mere intellectualism, apologetics and arguments for the sake of arguments and winning wars of proofs and references. I have a somple message to share with Pashtuns that we believing in our religion and practising Pashtunwali may follow democracy, free market economy, science and technology and human rights.