Toramana appreciation thread

[Toramana]

Keep up the good work, Barakzai !!!
You are the only person here who can handle this awful person.

Wrayun,
I have written over a thousand posts.
If you were not interested to read them at the time, then stop accusing me.

I would prefer you tell me WHY YOU are full of hatred for me ?
I have never said a word directly to you, either positive or negative.
Sorry but the problem lies with you.

Sorry Toramana - dizzyj loves nothing else but to wreck anybody's happiness or ability to have a peaceful discussion.
I am on the verge of leaving this stie
due to HER principally.
together with the fact that NO one will stand up to confront this fiend who speaks like a demoness. Except so far, BarakzaiAbdali.


It says to me that there's something seriously wrong with the people here that they have so little ability to see how cruel she is .


I have better things to do with my time.

I have never had any problem with Toramana.
Extreme disagreements in ideas are different from these dreadful personal attacks, as was pointed out.
I have no animosity for him.

Hay, lonely lady, are you still alive? Please, don't leave...these things happen you know...this is a cyberspace you know...and fights get quickly triggered but also quickly forgotten...

[Wrayun]

Wrayun,
I have written over a thousand posts.
If you were not interested to read them at the time, then stop accusing me.

I would prefer you tell me WHY YOU are full of hatred for me ?
I have never said a word directly to you, either positive or negative.
Sorry but the problem lies with you.

I have read your posts, and from them I have deduced little about you. You seem to know the region, our people, and the politics involved, but nothing about why you are so interested and here you are actually engaging in the discourse.

I don't have any hate or animosity towards you, for that I would have to know you first. So, I simply asked you two questions. Just two. Not thousands, simple two questions that you can answer:

Are you Muslim?
Are you Pukhtoon?

Have the decency to answer them. If you won't, don't ask the same of others. That's double-standards. And when I see hypocrisy, I like to point out. It is perfectly fine if you do not wish to disclose information about you, just don't ask others to do what you wont do yourself. You seem to do that quite often.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

read the full sentence
if you were not hogging on each other's pride then you shouldn't have felt offended.

Ok very well. If that is how you meant it, then that's fine. I read with the emphasis on the second half of the sentence. As you can see Toramana is not offended with me, so all is well. My apologies on my behalf. In the future I will generally avoid reading your words as I think we generally have a personality mismatch and just do not see eye to eye. Take care and best wishes.

[IamDZJ]

Ok very well. If that is how you meant it, then that's fine. I read with the emphasis on the second half of the sentence. As you can see Toramana is not offended with me, so all is well. My apologies on my behalf. In the future I will generally avoid reading your words as I think we generally have a personality mismatch and just do not see eye to eye. Take care and best wishes.

personality mismatch? i think it's your brain. give it a break every once in a while. and don't you dare comment on my lack of formal education again. take your apology and hang it around your neck. it suits you much better there.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Barakzai, one thing I can say for sure ... Despite my skirmishes with you don't dislike me neither does unknownprince...About Edge, I am 50-50 ...but about Alchemist, I am sure he dislikes me...Hahaha

But anyhow, Barakzai, thanks a lot wrora...May be someday we see a Pashtun nation united and in peace...

Out of curiousity though, how right was I in my bio sketch? Recall you had attempted an analysis of myself previously. I wanted to see how on target I was.

[Toramana]

Out of curiousity though, how right was I in my bio sketch? Recall you had attempted an analysis of myself previously. I wanted to see how on target I was.

There are few errors to be rectified....The first one is, I don't belong to any kind of landed nobility ... neither Miangulan nor Afzal Khan Lala nor any other fuedal family...I am a member of a middle class/ lower middle class family but with good level of education and respected in the area...


Second, I don't have any personal enmity with clergy ... My disagreement with them is ideological and stems from my strong Pashtun nationalist leanings...I consider Mullahs to have (most of the time) played the role of fifth columnists and foreign agents in Pashtun society ...

Also, some names that you have mentioned are unfamiliar for me...

[randolph85]

whats going on in huurrrr?

[BarakzaiAbdali]

There are few errors to be rectified....The first one is, I don't belong to any kind of landed nobility ... neither Miangulan nor Afzal Khan Lala nor any other fuedal family...I am a member of a middle class/ lower middle class family but with good level of education and respected in the area...

Second, I don't have any personal enmity with clergy ... My disagreement with them is ideological and stems from my strong Pashtun nationalist leanings...I consider Mullahs to have (most of the time) played the role of fifth columnists and foreign agents in Pashtun society ...

Most folks develop political/religio-political leanings associated with their parents views according to the American Civics I studied long ago. Would you say that your father/family members are also nationalist and that you picked up some of his/their own viewpoints? Is the area you live in an ANP voting block? What was the crucial juncture at which you decided that Pashtun nationalism superceded a Pakistani identity that others like Luffy and Shahbaz have not shed? I disagree with my own father over some of his ideological leanings, but he says that he developed his viewpoints when he saw that the Pashtuns generally got the raw end of every deal. He also felt that Farsi was forced on him at an early stage and he found it useless compared to English per his career as an engineer. He initially was very Afghan Pan National, but after the war and the subsequent treatment the Pashtuns recieved, he became feriously pro Pashtun on both sides of the border, so this change of his was later in age.

I guess I am just interested in your ideological genesis.

[Toramana]

Toramana is an irreplaceable asset to Pukhtoon interests. His opponents are lucky, it seems that old age ..j/k.. has worn him out. Otherwise he can be extremely challenging, as if not already.

Hahaha Bacha, that is literally true...After being active on forums for a long time, a kind of fatigue has caught me knoking me down...Thanks Wrayuna Bacha

[Gulalai]

how did an appreciation thread turn into a 5 page argument? lol

[Abeille]

poisonous psychopaths meddling in things not their cup of tea.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

how did an appreciation thread turn into a 5 page argument? lol

Beguma, Marray, bas khabaraah khathmaa swaa. I am usually fairly cool 95% of the time, but in the wrong circumstance I go from 0 to 60 in seconds (usually its when one of the junior residents I supervise screws up and I gotta pull a Doctor Cox). My apologies to the readership for the clutter. Ill see if I can delete the spam style posts. I just took the comment the wrong way and went to town.

[Toramana]

Most folks develop political/religio-political leanings associated with their parents views according to the American Civics I studied long ago. Would you say that your father/family members are also nationalist and that you picked up some of his/their own viewpoints? Is the area you live in an ANP voting block? What was the crucial juncture at which you decided that Pashtun nationalism superceded a Pakistani identity that others like Luffy and Shahbaz have not shed? I disagree with my own father over some of his ideological leanings, but he says that he developed his viewpoints when he saw that the Pashtuns generally got the raw end of every deal. He also felt that Farsi was forced on him at an early stage and he found it useless compared to English per his career as an engineer. He initially was very Afghan Pan National, but after the war and the subsequent treatment the Pashtuns recieved, he became feriously pro Pashtun on both sides of the border, so this change of his was later in age.

I guess I am just interested in your ideological genesis.

ANP had little following in Swat (being a princely state) before the 2008 elections except for Afzal Khan Lala's constituency(also due to his family influence)...ANP, however, had many ideologically committed members in Swat...

I think my inclinations towards Pashtun nationalism developed during my teen years and reached maturity in 1990s...I had no one in my family associated with any Pashtun nationalist struggle in a strong political and ideological sense although there were relatives who were kind of ANP followers...But they didn't influence me...

I can say that I discovered Pashtun nationalism and leftist ideologies on my own through reading and pondering over issues...

[Gulalai]

Beguma, Marray, bas khabaraah khathmaa swaa. I am usually fairly cool 95% of the time, but in the wrong circumstance I go from 0 to 60 in seconds (usually its when one of the junior residents I supervise screws up and I gotta pull a Doctor Cox). My apologies to the readership for the clutter. Ill see if I can delete the spam style posts. I just took the comment the wrong way and went to town.

kha Wrora, bas kha de che khabara khalasa shwa
ahh no worries, i understand. I can't say it hasn't happened to me before at this forum
Don't worry about deleting i think that will just cause more confusion. The argument and misunderstandings are over so lets just move on... to appreciating Toramana i guess haha

[BarakzaiAbdali]

ANP had little following in Swat (being a pricely state) before the 2008 elections except for Afzal Khan Lala's constituency(also due to his family influence)...ANP, however, had many ideologically committed members in Swat...

I think my inclinations towards Pashtun nationalism developed during my teen years and reached maturity in 1990s...I had no one in my family associated with any Pashtun nationalist struggle in a strong political and ideological sense although there were relatives who were kind of ANP followers...But they didn't influence me...

I can say that I discovered Pashtun nationalism and leftist ideologies on my own through reading and pondering over issues...

Was there a trigger? Did you feel discrimination as a Pakistani Pashtun?There are those with leftist leanings, I have met some Khattaks who were children of high ranking officials here at Yale, who were from Pakistan and equally do not like Zia policies, but they are staunchly anti India and not at all inclined to a Pashtunistan.

Does your family agree with your general assessments?

My father once had an argument with a Pakistani diplomat for example, regarding the status of the refugees. He noted that the Pakistani state restricted them to the NWFP province and that the flux of the refugees was limited into the other provinces, burdening NWFP and creating a climate of hostility between Pashtuns per competition and population issues. The diplomat responded that half of Aga Khan medical is filled with Pashtuns...