Islam and Women

[Ansari1]

the master may do as they please but not other people... see how the punishment is only a fine in the reduction of her VALUE... she is seen as chattell... not as a human being with the dignity that entails

Hilal b. Yasaf reported that a person got angry and slapped his slave-girl. Thereupon Suwaid b. Muqarrin said to him: You could find no other part (to slap) but the prominent part of her face. See I was one of the seven sons of Muqarrin, and we had but only one slave-girl. The youngest of us slapped her, and Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) commanded us to set her free.


They slapped the slave girl, and the Prophet sallalahu aleyhi wasallam commanded them to set her free. Note, the master was ordered to set his slave free. Compare slapping with raping. What would be the hukm if they or one of them raped her by force?

I think it is more than clear.

perhaps you would like to quote the 4 madhabs on their stance on sex with slaves??? I will do so in a while...

Please do.

[Badlun]

This statement is very interesting

See I was one of the seven sons of Muqarrin, and we had but only one slave-girl.

As sex is allowed between master and the slave-girl. So in this case the 7 masters would do sex with 1 slave-girl?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

There's no indication that sex happened though or that sex is permitted w/o nikkah. As I have disproven and refuted many of the claims here. So this is more your perverted Osho fantasies.

[Badlun]

Must read this to clarify that marriage is one thing and having sex with slaves is another thing. Also apart from sex how a slave would serve seven men!

http://islamqa.info/en/10382

The Prophet sent Ali to Khalid to bring the Khumus (of the booty) and . . . Ali had taken a bath (after a sexual act with a slave-girl from the Khumus).

What was Muhammad’s response to the person who hated Ali for this sexual act?

Do you hate Ali for this? . . . Don’t hate him, for he deserves more than that from [the] Khumus. (Bukhari)

Did Hazrat Ali marry her?

The Quran in Sura 4:24 says:

And forbidden to you are wedded wives of other people except those who have fallen in your hands

The Quran in Sura 23:5-6 says:

[Most certainly true believers] . . . guard their private parts scrupulously, except with regard to their wives and those who are legally in their possession, for in that case they shall not be blameworthy.

Does Quran not differentiate Wife and slave girl? Wife with marriage and slave girl being slave. Even wives of others captured in wars are allowed to be kept as slave girls and do sex.

[M17ArnoBaloch]

Must read this to clarify that marriage is one thing and having sex with slaves is another thing. Also apart from sex how a slave would serve seven men!

http://islamqa.info/en/10382

The Prophet sent Ali to Khalid to bring the Khumus (of the booty) and . . . Ali had taken a bath (after a sexual act with a slave-girl from the Khumus).

What was Muhammad’s response to the person who hated Ali for this sexual act?

Do you hate Ali for this? . . . Don’t hate him, for he deserves more than that from [the] Khumus. (Bukhari)

Did Hazrat Ali marry her?

The Quran in Sura 4:24 says:

And forbidden to you are wedded wives of other people except those who have fallen in your hands

The Quran in Sura 23:5-6 says:

[Most certainly true believers] . . . guard their private parts scrupulously, except with regard to their wives and those who are legally in their possession, for in that case they shall not be blameworthy.

Does Quran not differentiate Wife and slave girl? Wife with marriage and slave girl being slave. Even wives of others captured in wars are allowed to be kept as slave girls and do sex.

Only if the third party agrees to engage in the sexual act. Only then the sex permissible. Otherwise if you force her to do so, its not allowed.

[M17ArnoBaloch]

I have a question which I wanted to ask.

In Islam, can a man have orgy with his wives?

is this allowed?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Must read this to clarify that marriage is one thing and having sex with slaves is another thing. Also apart from sex how a slave would serve seven men!

http://islamqa.info/en/10382

.

Islamqa is a Wahhabi website and we don't rely on their assessments in mainstream Islam.

Also if you read the hadith about 'Ali, the statement (after a sexual act with a slave-girl from the Khumus). This is actually not apart of the original hadith. It is a parenthetical added later, So in actuality this is not evidence for approving sex with slaves w/o marriage.

So again, this is simply perverted fantasies of deviants like Osho.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

I have a question which I wanted to ask.

In Islam, can a man have orgy with his wives?

is this allowed?

You'll never have to worry about this since you have a sexual orientation towards your own gender.

[Black Lion]

You'll never have to worry about this since you have a sexual orientation towards your own gender.

Just look at his avatar LOL

[M17ArnoBaloch]

You'll never have to worry about this since you have a sexual orientation towards your own gender.

I love my gender, I'm in love with myself. :D

[Badlun]

Islamqa is a Wahhabi website and we don't rely on their assessments in mainstream Islam.

Also if you read the hadith about 'Ali, the statement (after a sexual act with a slave-girl from the Khumus). This is actually not apart of the original hadith. It is a parenthetical added later, So in actuality this is not evidence for approving sex with slaves w/o marriage.

So again, this is simply perverted fantasies of deviants like Osho.

If this Wahabi site says that God is one, will you also reject it? Go for the contents not the site. In the sites he mainly refers to Quranic verses and its translation.

Do you think the other companion just showed his hatred towards Ali only because he simply took bath?

And what about the verses of Quran I quoted which differentiate slave girl from wife? Or you also reject these because I quoted them?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

If this Wahabi site says that God is one, will you also reject it? Go for the contents not the site. In the sites he mainly refers to Quranic verses and its translation.

Do you think the other companion just showed his hatred towards Ali only because he simply took bath?

And what about the verses of Quran I quoted which differentiate slave girl from wife? Or you also reject these because I quoted them?

I did not say they're Kafir, I said we don't rely on them. Jews also say God is one, but we do not go to a Rabbi about Islamic rulings.

Same we don't go to Wahhabis, they're an "extreme" sect.

I think he resented 'Ali because he had a greater share of Khums, but that is all that can be deduced w/o the parenthetical information. HOwever if we leave the parenthetical out, there is no indication that he raped and/or had sex with a slave girl.

[Ansari1]

Dreamer, still waiting for the jurisdiction of the 4 madhahib.

Having sex with a slave/concubine is not raping her. Back in those days the women were dependant on men, so were their children. The slave was provided with housing, food, clothes, and in fact, the narrations mention that the master is ought to let the slaves wear and let them eat of the same [quality] food and clothes he wears.

In the biblical scriptures and the early battles it is even recorded the [non muslim] women who accompanied the battles with their fathers and husbands would wear beautifull clothes in order to attract their captors in case of a defeat.

Narrated Al-Ma'rur: "At Ar-Rabadha I met Abu Dhar who was wearing a cloak, and his slave, too, was wearing a similar one. I asked about the reason for it. He replied, "I abused a person by calling his mother with bad names." The Prophet said to me, 'O Abu Dhar! Did you abuse him by calling his mother with bad names You still have some characteristics of ignorance. Your slaves are your brothers and Allah has put them under your command. So whoever has a brother under his command should feed him of what he eats and dress him of what he wears. Do not ask them (slaves) to do things beyond their capacity (power) and if you do so, then help them.' (Translation of Sahih Bukhari, Belief, Volume 1, Book 2, Number 29)"

Not one of you should [ when introducing someone ] say ‘This is my slave’ , ‘This is my concubine’. He should call them ‘my daughter’ or ‘my son’ or ‘my brother’.
[Musnad Ahmad]


The following is a copy paste, so I didn't check the references provided:


"...he handled them with a genial humanity that made their lot no worse - perhaps better, as more secure - than that of a factory worker in nineteenth-century Europe."

Source: Hurgronje C., Mohammedanism, (N.Y., 1916), p. 128 as quoted by W. Durant, The Story of Civilization, vol. IV (N.Y., 1950), p. 209.


At the end of the 18th century, Mouradgea d'Ohsson (a main source of information for the Western writers on the Ottoman empire) declared:

"There is perhaps no nation where the captives, the slaves, the very toilers in the galleys are better provided for or treated with more kindness than among the Muhammedans."

Source: As quoted in The Encyclopaedia of Islam, vol.I, p. 35.







P. L Riviere writes:

"A master was enjoined to make his slave share the bounties he received from God. It must be recognised that, in this respect, the Islamic teaching acknowledged such a respect for human personality and showed a sense of equality which is searched for in vain in ancient civilization"

Source: Riviere P.L., Revue Bleaue (June 1939).



source:
http://www.answering-christianity.co...ale_slaves.htm

[Pakwatan]

I find you ignorants offensive while speaking on behalf of Wahabis. My family is Wahabi, and I am of Wahab.

[Diaphanous]

read up on slavery and islam and that phrase...

I have read the quran and i know there are lines about slavery in it. But i want you to give me specific quotes. Which quote are you referring to? Are you reading that line alone or in context with the lines before and after it?