Pakistan's PM, DG ISI and COAS visit to Afghanistan

[BarakzaiAbdali]

What I've to do with the data of Azad Afghanistan for getting rid of Punjabi imperialism? I think your totally out of your mind now. Before this you asked me to provide data about Peshawar or Nowshehra? That was relevant but I replied to that



Who is using Americans? It was one of your masters General Mehmood who deceived Mula Omar not to let Osama leave Afghanistan so that the General could divert the bombs from GHQ Rawalpindi to Kabul and Qandahar.

Can you read well? Obviously not. Whether you are literate or not is up for debate... but what we know for sure is that you lack any data anywhere for anything.

The only wheeling dealing Mehmoods to worry about are of the Achekzai mentality.

The rest of what you say all appears to point that you are more privy to the ongoings of the Panjaby establishment and where their bombs are than the rest of us.

Otherwise, as I said, put your money where your mouth is. Your enchantress/goddess Tajee Taj ANDERSEN is writing a book called Taliban and Taliban. Prove that you are the Inverse Muhajid man. Its easy, go find Omar and help sustain karzai all yourself.

You dont need my tax dollars to keep your boat afloat or to keep dropping bombs on Afghans and FATA folks. You can go there with your own senses, guns, and ammo.

Lets see Achekzai Bibi lead from teh front for once like Alexander did. Otherwise, you're just talking and talking.

[khyaal]

Can you read well? Obviously not. Whether you are literate or not is up for debate... but what we know for sure is that you lack any data anywhere for anything.

Provide you data for what purpose?

The only wheeling dealing Mehmoods to worry about are of the Achekzai mentality.

Is his mentality even worse than yours since he has refused to be sold out?

The rest of what you say all appears to point that you are more privy to the ongoings of the Panjaby establishment and where their bombs are than the rest of us.

Otherwise, as I said, put your money where your mouth is. Your enchantress/goddess Tajee Taj ANDERSEN is writing a book called Taliban and Taliban. Prove that you are the Inverse Muhajid man. Its easy, go find Omar and help sustain karzai all yourself.

Are you debating with me or Farhat Taj Anderson? What she has to do with me or my thread? I told you I guess she might be paid a lot better than any Punjabi boot lickers.

You dont need my tax dollars to keep your boat afloat or to keep dropping bombs on Afghans and FATA folks. You can go there with your own senses, guns, and ammo.

LOL. So ultimately you promised fidelity. That is a lot better.

Lets see Achekzai Bibi lead from teh front for once like Alexander did. Otherwise, you're just talking and talking.

You despise him because he is a traitor for Punjab. Keep it up.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Provide you data for what purpose?



Is his mentality even worse than yours since he has refused to be sold out?



Are you debating with me or Farhat Taj Anderson? What she has to do with me or my thread? I told you I guess she might be paid a lot better than any Punjabi boot lickers.



LOL. So ultimately you promised fidelity. That is a lot better.



You despise him because he is a traitor for Punjab. Keep it up.

Blah Blah Blah, all just a bunch of hoey since you cannot produce a single shred of evidence to back up any of your absurd contentions. You have no data, polls, surveys or anything of the sort that shows your absurd contention that KP Pashtuns are ready to stage an insurgency against the Panjab. Rather, they like you, are pretty much dancing to Kiyani's tune and joining his retarded military in the droves. At least the mainlanders that is. Luckily the FATA folks have a little more backbone and are willing to actually shoot on site.

Regarding your boy Achekzai, since you are so blinded by your belief that, nauzoobillah, Achekzai Bibi is like Pashtun Prophet, I hate to break it to you buddy, but here is the truth about murderin Mehmood, stool pigeon to the ISI and leader of your false ideologies. (of course Toramana attempts to decry the Tribal Analysis Center has having flawed research but has to produce a single shred of evidence to the contrary to buttress his assertions):

"There are two main sub-tribes of Achakzai currrently, one is the
Ghabizai under the leadership of Ahmed Khan Achakzai (son of Haji
Mohammed Khan Achakzai) and the other is the Ahmadzai which is led
by Mehmood Khan Achakzai. Previously, this was one of the most stable
Pashtun tribes, but for over nearly two decades they fought a internal tribal war in the area of Gulistan and Addullah Khan in Pakistan which led to the destruction of Gulistan Bazzar and much loss of life. After the death of Abdul Samad Khan Achakzai (the father of the current leader of Amidzai,Mehmood Khan Achakzai), the most favored person to represent Achakzai was Haji Mohammed Khan Achakzai. His desire for reunification with Afghanistan’s Achakzai caused the Pakistani Government to believe that Haji Mohammed Khan could reunite the Pashtun territory in Afghanistan, which would remove a quarter of Pakistan. They prevented this by causing enmity within the tribe. Mehmood Khan wanted to succeed his father, Abdul Samad Khan, in the tribe’s leadership and with the help of ISI, he killed Haji Mohammed Khan and two of his sons in 1990 and declared himself as the new Achakzai leader. The Ghabizais are still a powerful tribe and control Pakistan’s Gulistan district."

http://www.tribalanalysiscenter.com/...ai%20Tribe.pdf

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL, see khyaal, sorry to break it to you, but America builds real minds, that see the whole world, which is it controls even your reality. Its sad that it took the TAC to discuss what everyone else already knew and what you were so delayed in realizing. Your Hitlerian heroes are murderers, opportunists, and a part of the Paki establishment.

Bottom line of it all:

1) All your heroes are fake, including murderin' mehmood. The real Pashtun heroes are dying due to you backing their killers. It matters little though because they win in front of God's throne.

2) You still have no data to support unrealistic contentions.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Come to salvation Khyaal, break out of the matrix equivalent that they have put your mind into. Ask yourself why the same damned people and their sons and their sons sons still dominate the party platform in the same way that Balliwood Balliwall does for his grandfather. Its all one big mess and you unfortunately are caught up on it. I seriously dont blame you, being inside that miserable state breeds that sort of lackadaisical approach to reality. However, just know that you day in and day out you are advocating for the killing of your own brothers across the border and in FATA. You are also gaining a huuuge goona by utilizing outside powers to kill them. Now that you have some light shining into the dark recesses of your mind, continue to read and wake up. The sad thing is that the KP Pashtuns are in a complete state of darkness, believing that their government's twisted law supercedes God's law. They will fight to the very last, some of them, to sustain such hegemony. Their support of the Pakistani army, murderning innocents in FATA is something that they all collectively have to start thinking about.

[khyaal]

Blah Blah Blah, all just a bunch of hoey since you cannot produce a single shred of evidence to back up any of your absurd contentions. You have no data, polls, surveys or anything of the sort that shows your absurd contention that KP Pashtuns are ready to stage an insurgency against the Panjab. Rather, they like you, are pretty much dancing to Kiyani's tune and joining his retarded military in the droves. At least the mainlanders that is. Luckily the FATA folks have a little more backbone and are willing to actually shoot on site.

Though the question of providing data of the people who are about to stage insurgency against punjab is very absurd, even if you get such data from some source (highly hypothetical situation), what, btw, will do with such data? It will prove that my claims are true about Pashtun resentment?

So you think the whol previous history of Pashtun resistence was a lie? Let us suppose I'm lying then why you, an alleged Pashtun(afghan), is admant in proving me a liar. This should be a Punjabi and not any Barakzai at least.

Regarding your boy Achekzai, since you are so blinded by your belief that, nauzoobillah, Achekzai Bibi is like Pashtun Prophet, I hate to break it to you buddy, but here is the truth about murderin Mehmood, stool pigeon to the ISI and leader of your false ideologies. (of course Toramana attempts to decry the Tribal Analysis Center has having flawed research but has to produce a single shred of evidence to the contrary to buttress his assertions):

Why have taken the other side, why you are interested in proving us wrong? You US asylum seeker, are you some super moralist?

"There are two main sub-tribes of Achakzai currrently, one is the

Ghabizai under the leadership of Ahmed Khan Achakzai (son of Haji

Mohammed Khan Achakzai) and the other is the Ahmadzai which is led

by Mehmood Khan Achakzai. Previously, this was one of the most stable

Pashtun tribes, but for over nearly two decades they fought a internal tribal war in the area of Gulistan and Addullah Khan in Pakistan which led to the destruction of Gulistan Bazzar and much loss of life. After the death of Abdul Samad Khan Achakzai (the father of the current leader of Amidzai,Mehmood Khan Achakzai), the most favored person to represent Achakzai was Haji Mohammed Khan Achakzai. His desire for reunification with Afghanistan’s Achakzai caused the Pakistani Government to believe that Haji Mohammed Khan could reunite the Pashtun territory in Afghanistan, which would remove a quarter of Pakistan. They prevented this by causing enmity within the tribe. Mehmood Khan wanted to succeed his father, Abdul Samad Khan, in the tribe’s leadership and with the help of ISI, he killed Haji Mohammed Khan and two of his sons in 1990 and declared himself as the new Achakzai leader. The Ghabizais are still a powerful tribe and control Pakistan’s Gulistan district."

<A href="http://www.tribalanalysiscenter.com/PDF-TAC/Achakzai%20Tribe.pdf" target=_blank><A href="http://www.tribalanalysiscenter.com/PDF-TAC/Achakzai%20Tribe.pdf" target=_blank>http://www.tribalanalysiscenter.com/PDF-TAC/Achakzai%20Tribe.pdf

Look, don't try to teach me the biography of my elders and the history of my party, I know it a lot better than you. I know that some but not all of the Ghabizi work for the ISI. And it is a well known fact in Southern Pakhtunkhwa.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL, see khyaal, sorry to break it to you, but America builds real minds, that see the whole world, which is it controls even your reality. Its sad that it took the TAC to discuss what everyone else already knew and what you were so delayed in realizing. Your Hitlerian heroes are murderers, opportunists, and a part of the Paki establishment.

I've already told you that some Punjab's boot lickers are working for a lot less than that scape goat of yours, Farhat Taj, so such people don't carry much weight.

Bottom line of it all:

1) All your heroes are fake, including murderin' mehmood. The real Pashtun heroes are dying due to you backing their killers. It matters little though because they win in front of God's throne.

2) You still have no data to support unrealistic contentions.

Yeah I know all our (pashtun/afghan) heroes are fake. Only Ranjit Singh was the real hero and now his successors, the Punjabi Generals.

Some have gone mad in Mahmood Khan's enmity to the extent that they opted to be the boot lickers of Punjabis than facing PMAP politically.

[khyaal]

Come to salvation Khyaal, break out of the matrix equivalent that they have put your mind into. Ask yourself why the same damned people and their sons and their sons sons still dominate the party platform in the same way that Balliwood Balliwall does for his grandfather. Its all one big mess and you unfortunately are caught up on it. I seriously dont blame you, being inside that miserable state breeds that sort of lackadaisical approach to reality.

Lol. Your tactics are so cheap and childish. My dear, you have been blinded by PMAP's enmity which has caused you lose all your rationality and you are even ready to annihilate the whole Pashtun(afghan) nation if you could just to satisfy your false ego.

However, just know that you day in and day out you are advocating for the killing of your own brothers across the border and in FATA. You are also gaining a huuuge goona by utilizing outside powers to kill them.

Now again you started twisting facts with fallacious wordings. You should know that these were not Pashtuns (afghans) of FATA who brought Al Qaeda there, these were your masters, the Punjabi Generals who made Al Qaeda as their official guests. Then you know that these people made the whole population of FATA hostageby killing hundreds of Pashtun elders ruthlessly . So instead of blaming Punjabi Generals for the catastrophe to force them to help the innocent people get rid of these ruthless Arabs, Chichens, Ozbeks you are deliberately perpetuating Pashtuns miseries by concealing the fact there are foreigners who have taken the whole population hostage.

Now that you have some light shining into the dark recesses of your mind, continue to read and wake up. The sad thing is that the KP Pashtuns are in a complete state of darkness, believing that their government's twisted law supercedes God's law. They will fight to the very last, some of them, to sustain such hegemony. Their support of the Pakistani army, murderning innocents in FATA is something that they all collectively have to start thinking about.

So in your opinion in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa there are some Godless people in the so-called government? Toba obasa. Tabah shey.

We do have differences with ANP but what you are spreading are deliberate and blatant lies with the sole intention of demonizing each and every Pashtun leader. Wrora, no one will listen to your concoctions and BS, you are justing wasting your time here. Get up and face your opponents politically, not through lies and Punjab's support.

[Michin Khel]

Khyal go lick your wounds of defeat, barakzai sahab has defeated you in debate...your points are too rediculous, childish and pathetic. I had already stated about you that you repeat things like parrot and you have robotic brain unable to respond to points other than fixed agenda in your mind.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Though the question of providing data of the people who are about to stage insurgency against punjab is very absurd, even if you get such data from some source (highly hypothetical situation), what, btw, will do with such data? It will prove that my claims are true about Pashtun resentment?

So you think the whol previous history of Pashtun resistence was a lie? Let us suppose I'm lying then why you, an alleged Pashtun(afghan), is admant in proving me a liar. This should be a Punjabi and not any Barakzai at least.



Why have taken the other side, why you are interested in proving us wrong? You US asylum seeker, are you some super moralist?

Look, don't try to teach me the biography of my elders and the history of my party, I know it a lot better than you. I know that some but not all of the Ghabizi work for the ISI. And it is a well known fact in Southern Pakhtunkhwa.

I've already told you that some Punjab's boot lickers are working for a lot less than that scape goat of yours, Farhat Taj, so such people don't carry much weight.

Yeah I know all our (pashtun/afghan) heroes are fake. Only Ranjit Singh was the real hero and now his successors, the Punjabi Generals.

Some have gone mad in Mahmood Khan's enmity to the extent that they opted to be the boot lickers of Punjabis than facing PMAP politically.

The data is important for one main reason: It undoes your bloodlust and your narrative.

Its not that anyone does not desire the reunification of Pashtuns. Its the narrative you are trying to construct. Pashtun resentment is a very real phenomena. However, Pashtun resentment on the verge of violent insurgency is a whole nother issue. Your, and a few other folks attempts here are to paint a false picture devoid of supportive data. And what is worse is you desire American intervention (i.e. you want to use my army) to deal with your homegrown ridiculous Pakistani issues because you have neither the will nor the means now the actual Pashtun manpower to handle the job yourself.

For example: Everyone wishes that Iraqis really were ready to endorse freedom, life loving values etc and they could have deposed Saddam Hussein all on their own. A small few within the American governmetn and neoconservative circles, however, painted a completely false picture of a people that wanted an American invasion and actually LUSTED for it. They promised americans garlands, and chocolates, and Iraqi celebrations. Instead, they got murder, carnage, rape and destruction.

The real pashtun heroes, Abdali, Mir Wais, and others stand in stark diametric distinction to your nonmeritocratic, bone headed, ISI agent, fellow tribesmen killing, drone advocacy PMAP/ANP leadership brackets.

So the reason I am interested in proving you wrong? Its because you gaurantee bloodshed and more impending death for the Pashtun masses. Sure, they are certainly lost and have forgotten the face of their forefathers in so many ways. However, the absurd narrative you propose, where Karzai Bibi and his ANA army/NATO backed army? will march across the Khybar Pass and take back KP in a bloodless procession where KP Pashtuns will throw flowers at him and embrace the ANA army, offering their daughters and chocolates is bound to, like the Iraq war, lead to idiocy and further blood shed. I prefer life, as opposed to subservience to NATO and ethnic cleansing based death for all the people, even if they do call us kabulyaan. They simply do not know any better.

Regarding FATA occupation by a handful of arabs, give me a break. The arabs were well come guests as much as they were in many regions of Afghanistan.

"In a brand-new cemetery across the street, hundreds of people each day crowd to view the neatly dug graves of 74 Arabs and other foreign fighters who died in the U.S. bombing in October and November. Some of the visitors are sick people seeking blessings from the dead, who are believed to have special powers as martyrs for Islam. Others are angry young men who throw stones at foreigners attempting to visit the site.
"These boys died here alone, in a foreign country. They were our Muslim brothers and we weep for them," said Sher Mohammed, 65, a horse cart driver who was visiting the Arab cemetery Monday. "It is the duty of every Muslim to see they are buried with respect."

"To a certain extent, Taliban sympathies here also extend to Arabs who lived here and fought alongside the Taliban against its armed domestic opponents in northern Afghanistan, and who later were killed or wounded in the U.S. bombing campaign.
At Mir Weis Hospital, where a half-dozen injured and armed Arab fighters have been barricaded inside a prison ward for weeks, even the soldiers guarding the grounds this week said they strongly disagreed with the government's decision to suspend all food supplies to the detainees after they refused to surrender.
"It is a shameful violence to stop their food and kill them slowly. Every Muslim in the world has sorrow for these men," said Akhtar Mohammed, 40, a hospital guard. "We want a moderate Islamic government, but not one that will sell the Koran for dollars." The Arab prisoners, he added, "are dying but they are happy, because they will go to paradise."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A51578-2002Jan15

You on the other hand construct an idiotic narrative where 3 or 4 Arabs held the whole of the mighty Ahmadzai Wazirs hostage. As if Nek Mohammad and his men has no will of their own. Get a reality check.

[khyaal]

The data is important for one main reason: It undoes your bloodlust and your narrative.

Its not that anyone does not desire the reunification of Pashtuns. Its the narrative you are trying to construct. Pashtun resentment is a very real phenomena. However, Pashtun resentment on the verge of violent insurgency is a whole nother issue. Your, and a few other folks attempts here are to paint a false picture devoid of supportive data. And what is worse is you desire American intervention (i.e. you want to use my army) to deal with your homegrown ridiculous Pakistani issues because you have neither the will nor the means now the actual Pashtun manpower to handle the job yourself.

a) About your insistence on producing data I would like to tell you about the elections of 1946 under the British in which the Khudai Khidmatgaraan got clear majority and they had the right to demand for themselves their future as independent Pashtun nation but just about six months after that elections the British deprived them of their majority through coercive and unfair means. Just wanted to make it clear to you that numbers and figures don't have any meaning when ones opponents have naked power. They can concoct figures and data according to their own whims and desires.

Any data or numbers that are collected under hegemonic control will be inherently lacking credibility.

b) We saw the same when Bengalis clearly won majority but the Punjabi chauvinist refused to hand over power to them. Bengal's majority figures didn't work.

c) You can't collect even fair data of census about actual pashtun population in Pakistan let aside bring out data which shows the real sentiments of Pashtuns(afghans) in Pakistan.

Apart from that you have repudiated yourself by bringing about Sadam's case when the US provided data about his future plans which proved to be wrong later. LOL

For example: Everyone wishes that Iraqis really were ready to endorse freedom, life loving values etc and they could have deposed Saddam Hussein all on their own. A small few within the American governmetn and neoconservative circles, however, painted a completely false picture of a people that wanted an American invasion and actually LUSTED for it. They promised americans garlands, and chocolates, and Iraqi celebrations. Instead, they got murder, carnage, rape and destruction.

Here you have falsified yourself and have even unwittingly cleared Karzai Saib of the charges which you very skillfully present to deceive us.

The real pashtun heroes, Abdali, Mir Wais, and others stand in stark diametric distinction to your nonmeritocratic, bone headed, ISI agent, fellow tribesmen killing, drone advocacy PMAP/ANP leadership brackets.

When one carefully observes your posts he would know that what your real motives are. dumping contradictory ideologies and mixing right with wrongs in one place to create confusion and mess won't work anymore.

You have a consistent record of maligning Pashtun(afghan) leaders just because some Ghabizi have opted to allign themselves with Punjab.

So the reason I am interested in proving you wrong? Its because you gaurantee bloodshed and more impending death for the Pashtun masses. Sure, they are certainly lost and have forgotten the face of their forefathers in so many ways. However, the absurd narrative you propose, where Karzai Bibi and his ANA army/NATO backed army? will march across the Khybar Pass and take back KP in a bloodless procession where KP Pashtuns will throw flowers at him and embrace the ANA army, offering their daughters and chocolates is bound to, like the Iraq war, lead to idiocy and further blood shed. I prefer life, as opposed to subservience to NATO and ethnic cleansing based death for all the people, even if they do call us kabulyaan. They simply do not know any better.

If gullible Pashtuns(afghans) had committed such degree of sacrifices for their own nation, they would be free by now from the shackles of Punjab and thus there would be no NATO or US for which we consider Punjab as the main culprit who imposed more than 30 years of long war on the soil of Azad Afghanistan We know Punjab very well than some gullible Afghans of Azad Afghanistan and thus we stand by our judgement.

Regarding FATA occupation by a handful of arabs, give me a break. The arabs were well come guests as much as they were in many regions of Afghanistan.

Who told you that there are handful of Arabs? Musharaf himself has confessed in his book their number to be in several thousands who have immense financial resources apart from the being under the guardianship of the ISI. Besides, he has also confessed of training suicide bombers by the ISI.

"In a brand-new cemetery across the street, hundreds of people each day crowd to view the neatly dug graves of 74 Arabs and other foreign fighters who died in the U.S. bombing in October and November. Some of the visitors are sick people seeking blessings from the dead, who are believed to have special powers as martyrs for Islam. Others are angry young men who throw stones at foreigners attempting to visit the site.
"These boys died here alone, in a foreign country. They were our Muslim brothers and we weep for them," said Sher Mohammed, 65, a horse cart driver who was visiting the Arab cemetery Monday. "It is the duty of every Muslim to see they are buried with respect."

Look! Don't dupe us by telling history and events without their proper context. We know that the attack on Taliban regime was caused by the extreme lack of maturity by Mula Omar when General Mahmood convinced him not to let Osama leave Afghanistan, otherwise you would see GHQ being bombed by the NATO. Musharaf himself has confessed the threat given to him by the then US Ambassador immediately after the 9/11.

"To a certain extent, Taliban sympathies here also extend to Arabs who lived here and fought alongside the Taliban against its armed domestic opponents in northern Afghanistan, and who later were killed or wounded in the U.S. bombing campaign.

Taliban had no sympathies for Arabs. Osama chose to stay in Qandahar just to keep an eye on Mula Omar. They despised these Arabs.

At Mir Weis Hospital, where a half-dozen injured and armed Arab fighters have been barricaded inside a prison ward for weeks, even the soldiers guarding the grounds this week said they strongly disagreed with the government's decision to suspend all food supplies to the detainees after they refused to surrender.

You are again describing events without their proper context.

"It is a shameful violence to stop their food and kill them slowly. Every Muslim in the world has sorrow for these men," said Akhtar Mohammed, 40, a hospital guard. "We want a moderate Islamic government, but not one that will sell the Koran for dollars." The Arab prisoners, he added, "are dying but they are happy, because they will go to paradise."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...1578-2002Jan15

You on the other hand construct an idiotic narrative where 3 or 4 Arabs held the whole of the mighty Ahmadzai Wazirs hostage. As if Nek Mohammad and his men has no will of their own. Get a reality check.

Your Punjabi masters are responsible for all the destruction brought about on our land since Pakistan has a fundamental clash with Afghans where Punjabis being the occupier of Afghan land while with the US we don't have any such clash just as Pakis don't have with China.

A renownd Pakistan journalist Abdullah Malik (deceased) has written in one of his books perhaps 'Pakistan, America and aur Fauj'(i don't recall the name but i have read it) that the US which we (Pakistanis) blame for all our misfortune was brought to this region by the very efforts of our leadership'(both military and civilian).

[BarakzaiAbdali]

a) About your insistence on producing data I would like to tell you about the elections of 1946 under the British in which the Khudai Khidmatgaraan got clear majority and they had the right to demand for themselves their future as independent Pashtun nation but just about six months after that elections the British deprived them of their majority through coercive and unfair means. Just wanted to make it clear to you that numbers and figures don't have any meaning when ones opponents have naked power. They can concoct figures and data according to their own whims and desires.

Any data or numbers that are collected under hegemonic control will be inherently lacking credibility.

b) We saw the same when Bengalis clearly won majority but the Punjabi chauvinist refused to hand over power to them. Bengal's majority figures didn't work.

c) You can't collect even fair data of census about actual pashtun population in Pakistan let aside bring out data which shows the real sentiments of Pashtuns(afghans) in Pakistan.

Apart from that you have repudiated yourself by bringing about Sadam's case when the US provided data about his future plans which proved to be wrong later. LOL




Here you have falsified yourself and have even unwittingly cleared Karzai Saib of the charges which you very skillfully present to deceive us.



When one carefully observes your posts he would know that what your real motives are. dumping contradictory ideologies and mixing right with wrongs in one place to create confusion and mess won't work anymore.

You have a consistent record of maligning Pashtun(afghan) leaders just because some Ghabizi have opted to allign themselves with Punjab.



If gullible Pashtuns(afghans) had committed such degree of sacrifices for their own nation, they would be free by now from the shackles of Punjab and thus there would be no NATO or US for which we consider Punjab as the main culprit who imposed more than 30 years of long war on the soil of Azad Afghanistan We know Punjab very well than some gullible Afghans of Azad Afghanistan and thus we stand by our judgement.




Who told you that there are handful of Arabs? Musharaf himself has confessed in his book their number to be in several thousands who have immense financial resources apart from the being under the guardianship of the ISI. Besides, he has also confessed of training suicide bombers by the ISI.



Look! Don't dupe us by telling history and events without their proper context. We know that the attack on Taliban regime was caused by the extreme lack of maturity by Mula Omar when General Mahmood convinced him not to let Osama leave Afghanistan, otherwise you would see GHQ being bombed by the NATO. Musharaf himself has confessed the threat given to him by the then US Ambassador immediately after the 9/11.



Taliban had no sympathies for Arabs. Osama chose to stay in Qandahar just to keep an eye on Mula Omar. They despised these Arabs.



You are again describing events without their proper context.




Your Punjabi masters are responsible for all the destruction brought about on our land since Pakistan has a fundamental clash with Afghans where Punjabis being the occupier of Afghan land while with the US we don't have any such clash just as Pakis don't have with China.

A renownd Pakistan journalist Abdullah Malik (deceased) has written in one of his books perhaps 'Pakistan, America and aur Fauj'(i don't recall the name but i have read it) that the US which we (Pakistanis) blame for all our misfortune was brought to this region by the very efforts of our leadership'(both military and civilian).

LOOOOOOL. Its obvious you lack clear, cogent, and consistent scientific thought capability. If I thought the way you do, I would accidentily (intentionally?) kill patients on a daily basis and thankfully I dont. Otherwise, I would treat patients with Aspirin and claim it treated their high blood pressure sufficiently.

You are so rabid and shaking with rage that you bring me the results of a 1946 election to prove to me you have data that answers a completely different set of questions, namely whether Pashtuns are willing to live under the Karzai regime and namely whether Pashtuns are willingly to violently insurrect? LOOOOOL. Wow, so that boils down to, I have none. Moreover, if the Khoday Khidmatgaar election was done under the auspices of a superior power, the British, you basically drove the last nail into your own nonintellectual coffin: how is it that under the lesser men force of the Panjabi elite, you cannot reproduce or collect the data we ask for? LOOOOOOL.

Regarding Saddam, you horse's arse, it exactly that, a neoconservative party forging data, just as you present invalid data, the Khoday Khidmatgaar election, as proof of some wiley and untenable idea that the Pashtuns from attock to the durand are waiting for Khyaal Shah Khattak to lead them to a great rebellion so he can present the flags of the united lar and bar tribes to Karzai bibi. LOOOOOOOOL. Man you amuse me with your absurd dreams.

Regarding Karzai and the charges against him... LOOOL. absolved? How? Can you read English? Point out to me where that was done. I think he more than guilted himself with his brothers Kabul Bank ventures, betting the hard money of Afghans over in Dubai. That, my friend, is well documented.

Regarding the Ghabizi, deal with the facts, Mehmood did the murdering and is the ISI stool pigeon, hence his continued safe status and repeated releases. Were he a real threat to the regime, he would be as dead and gone as Bugti.

Regarding the Arabs, you didnt even rebut the Post article because you couldnt. Instead you referred to some dead Pakistani journalist of your choosing who supposedly saw 1000 Arabs with guns to the heads of Pashtuns. Riiiiiight.

Try again Khyaal Lala, you certainly are not doing your party or reality justice. You look frantic my man.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Regarding the Arab data, per Scheuer in his recent bio:

"He (Bin Ladin) later claimed that over 170 Arab Afghans were killed in the Jalalabad fighting, and that this number, exceeded all Arab fatalities in the war until then. By admitting this, he was also admitting that fewer than 500 Afghan Arabs were killed in the 13 years of jihad, a miniscule total compared to the several thousand Afghan mujahideen killed in the same period. He was conceding that the war had been won by the 'poor, barefooted Afghans.'"

LOOOOL, see Khyaal that is called a source and reason. It detonates your haphazard logic regarding Najib, the secret Arab imperialist war, and your current idea that the ISI, like some Svengali, manipulated Omar and Bin Ladin, orchestrating the aftermath.

Remember Khyaal, proof, facts, quotes, stats trump your opinion... everytime.

Go ahead, start frothing and throwing our your usual filler about Panjabi this and servant of that, and Quettan Panjabi lover up and Lahori master down etc. Absurdity after absurdity echoes through the empty recesses of your mind like a can being kicked down an empty ally.

[khyaal]

Regarding the Ghabizi, deal with the facts, Mehmood did the murdering and is the ISI stool pigeon, hence his continued safe status and repeated releases. Were he a real threat to the regime, he would be as dead and gone as Bugti.

.

This again shows your complete ignorance despite being showing cockyness which is typically paki. You should know that the real threat to Paki regime was never Bugti. These were/are Baloch leaders like Sher Muhammad Marri, Khair Bukhsh Marri and Ataullah Mengal whose struggle against the Paki regime is extended over decades but it was never Bugti though we have great respect for him.

[khyaal]

Regarding the Arab data, per Scheuer in his recent bio:

"He (Bin Ladin) later claimed that over 170 Arab Afghans were killed in the Jalalabad fighting, and that this number, exceeded all Arab fatalities in the war until then. By admitting this, he was also admitting that fewer than 500 Afghan Arabs were killed in the 13 years of jihad, a miniscule total compared to the several thousand Afghan mujahideen killed in the same period. He was conceding that the war had been won by the 'poor, barefooted Afghans.'"
.

I think You have gone completely insane. What I was telling you was the fact that ISI during the proxy afghan war and after the ISI proxies took control of Afghanistan, help brought Arabs, Chichen and Ozbek terrorists by providing them Afghan land which they turned into a den and a center of terrorist activities around the world and after the 9/11 ISI then brought them to FATA.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

This again shows your complete ignorance despite being cockyness which is typically paki. You should know the real threat to Paki regime was never Bugti. These were Baloch leaders like Sher Muhammad Marri, Khair Bukhsh Marri and Ataullah Mengal whose struggle against the Paki regime is extended over decades but it was never Bugti though we have great respect for him.

LOOOL, still stuck in the box huh? Look Khyaal, your objectives dont make sense. Like I said, you appear to be pitching the following scam to the rural Afghans and your fellow Pakistanis in KP. You are welcome to tell me where I am wrong in this narrative:

Khyaal's narrative.
1) Pashtuns in KP are upset. In fact, they are so upset that they are waiting for someone, in fact anyone to swoop in and save them from the Panjab. Seriously, they honestly in the overwhelming majority want to be a part of Afghanistan right NOW. In fact, they want to be a part of Mr. Karzai's Afghanistan and not at all a part of Mullah Omar's Afghanistan.

2) The Panjabatron master is so powerful that all dissent is crushable by his hand. That super human that we malign as a dispicable, dark brown, inferior race short creature that speaks urdoo is what is actually the only wedge between lar and bar... there is absolutely no way that there might generally be a mass of Pashtuns content with the status quo. Therefore, we must at all costs destroy Panjabatron the great dark lord of the East. Wait though, thats not all, its also Arabimaximus, the Lord of the Oil Peninsula that keeps us down as well. He and Panjabatron are holding hands and dancing on the ashes of Pashtun blood in the KP.

So like a damsel in distress, the KP Pashtun needs the big burly Tom, **** and Harry of the American Empire to swoop in and smash Panjabatron so that we can stealthily bring lar and bar together. Because, you know, America has always done right by the Pashtuns in all circumstances.

3) Even if America is not willing to free the KP Pashtuns from their hegamaniacal masters, the Panjabies, why we ought to let them strengthen Hamid Bibi's hand... because a strong Afghanistan under Karzai will one day seize its prior assetts. But dont worry, it will do so bloodlessly.
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This is exactly where I agree with both Manzerah and BLS saib simultaneously. Both have divergent views on the fate of KP and both ask eachother: who are you to speak on behalf of KP Pashtuns? With that question being asked, I honestly believe it is important to understand KP Pashtuns at the ground level without the rejoinder and the typical cop out response that you offer: data collection is impossible.

All that shows me is you have a fear that the data wont support your narrative that you pitch above.

Forgive me if I refuse to accept your word and the word of anyone, whether they be Manzerah as an Islamist, BLS as a moderate, Toramana a secularist, or any of these folks that claim to speak for KP Pashtuns and what they want.

I have to date interacted with about 30 or so Khybar medical grads. And to my surprise, all of them were invested in Pakistan. I had debates and back and forths with them regarding the interchangability of the words Afghan and Pashtun. It took literally 1 hour and multiple text references to get through their thick (but very smart) skulls.

This is but a small sample size. Having seen the diversity if view points, I refuse to accept your narrative, or the typical narrative that even Afghan Mellat sells under Ahady regarding a mass of Pashtuns awaiting their freedom at the hands of an Afghan National Army.

You have utterly failed in all your attempts to provide meaningful dialogue or data. And I will continue to demand it from you as I refuse to accept neoconservativesque style banterings.

The injustice you do to yourself is that those armed with reality are much more capable of pragmatic and practical thought processes and strategic thinking to realize their goals. In this way, and in many others, you fail. Its a component of your inability to critically think about your environment. Its really no different than democrats here in the US that believe Obama can do no wrong. Its just a sales pitch that falls on nonexistent ears.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

I think You have gone completely insane. What I was telling you was the fact that ISI during the proxy afghan war and after the ISI proxies took control of Afghanistan, help brought Arabs, Chichen and Ozbek terrorists by providing them Afghan land which they turned into a den and a center of terrorist activities around the world and after the 9/11 ISI then brought them to FATA.

Yeah and they dont have legs and arms of their own. They arent already located in multiple countries around the world such as Libya, Sudan, Chechyna etc? Afghanistan was one of many fronts. I never disagreed that Osama Bin Ladin utilized Afghan land to launch an operation to lure America into a second war of attrition. However, it was Mr. Bin Ladin and the not the ISI that instigated such a set up. There is no textual evidence from Scheuer or any other source you can furnish that shows the ISI instructed Bin ladin to attack America. These same folks had been in Sudan for a period of time as well and executed operations from that haven as well. In fact the corpus of evidence shows that the first man to greet Mr. Bin Ladin back into Afghanistan was none other than Mr. Sayyaf. The latter became a sour asset for the ISI and took on the Taliban. The latter is also a part of Mr. karzai's government and suspected to still possibly be feeding the insurgency information.

Finally you conflate cause and effect. These individuals are involved in a global conflageration of America's making. The American government has struck far away from the charter its founders set out for it and involved itself in intervening in so many different Muslim countries, propping up so many different dictators in the Arab nations and Central Asia that they were bound to feel the draft of blow back. If Ron Paul can recognize this:

YouTube - Terrorism: Ron Paul vs. Giuliani @ SC Debate

Why is it so hard for you to organize cause and effect.

If there was no Iraq war 1 and no idiotic interaction between the US and the gulf states, there would be no Osama Bin Ladin. That mess was created by American interventionism. Even now, Steven Colbert, a comedian jokes about American war on 3 Muslim nations simultaneously. That is exactly what Mike Scheuer predicted that the Muslim world would see with American interventionalism abroad. And last but not least, there is absolutely no reason for America to stick its nose into central asian affairs and comment on Russian incursions into the caucuses and Chinese incursions into the Uighar provinces. It enhances the perception that America is leading global anti Muslim effort when in fact the average American has no idea what the heck Lindsey Graham and his ass clowns are doing.

Come back to reality.