Islamic reaction to radical Muslims

[Palwasha]

I'm a bit of a latecomer to this thread and am actually here by invite - thanks to Afghanlady for that.

Ah, I was hoping you'd post a response Tor Khan wrora, if only I knew you respond to invites. =P

Nice move Afghanlady.

[ozymandias]

Is there is a misplaced negative in the sentence? The grammar is confusing.

Do you mean "no terrorist in the history of the world was .... a muslim"?

In which case, why the debate?

No misplaced negative. I'll try and rephrase:

I doubt that you can prove that not a single terrorist, ever, was a muslim. There have been many high-profile terrorists that were muslim, and you would have to prove that they were not.

[Azmatullah]

No misplaced negative. I'll try and rephrase:

I doubt that you can prove that not a single terrorist, ever, was a muslim. There have been many high-profile terrorists that were muslim, and you would have to prove that they were not.

You must have heard of the Crusades where Muslims were brutally massacred, mosques destroyed along with everything else, or are you deliberately ignoring that? Do you not consider them as ''terrorists''. To turn it into a Muslim issue is ridiculous. What about the millions of innocent lives that have been lost in this so called war on terrorism (or as some would say, the ''modern crusades''), in countries such as Iraq and Afghanistan. Is that justified in your eyes? Are those who are responsible not terrorists in your eyes? Let's not forget this video which recently made news. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF9P5...eature=related Thanks.

[ozymandias]

Ozymandias,

I understand what you mean by us 'forcing' which we never have, but we have a polite request.

That is not true. Terrorism is 'forcing', and many here have posted in support of that. I think it is safe to say that at least on this site there are muslims that wish to force all to follow islamic customs.

we as Muslims want our religion to be respected, my people are dying on a daily basis, the least we request is to respect our religion.

And a request is fine. Not only is it fine, you *are* granted respect: exactly as much respect as any other creed out there. To request more is to request special treatment, and is not justified.

[ozymandias]

You must have heard of the Crusades where Muslims were brutally massacred, mosques destroyed along with everything else, or are you deliberately ignoring that?

What does this have to do with *ANYTHING*? I never said that there were no christian terrorists. You are now bringing up irelevant facts to try and disprove points I have not, nor would not make. What exactly are you hoping to do by this tactic?

Do you not consider them as ''terrorists''.

Not typically, considered that the Crusades as a whole were a series of military actions to prevent the expansion of the Turkish nation into a nearby nation, and the subsequent wars. Typically military action of one nation against another, especially where the targets are intended to be primarily valid military targets is not considered terrorism.

Terrorism tends to lie outside the realm of valid military strategy, and consists of attacking non-military targets, including civilians, in an inhumane way, or through a method intending to instill fear into the population at large. In fact, according to modern articles of war, the targets and methods favored by terrorists are expressly forbidden by international treaty.

In short, while some of the crusades may have consisted of terrorist-like behavior, in the larger scheme of things, these were merely collateral damage in valid military campaigns -- for the most part.

That is not to mention the fact that the crusades had atrocities and terrible, terrible actions on *both* sides of the conflicts. Neither side was innocent.

To turn it into a Muslim issue is ridiculous. What about the millions of innocent lives that have been lost in this so called war on terrorism (or as some would say, the ''modern crusades''), in countries such as Iraq and Afghanistan.

There is a huge difference in collateral damage to civilian targets, and deliberately attacking civilians directly.

Is that justified in your eyes?

Collateral damage is an unfortunate side effect of war. I only support war as a method of last resort, and I deeply regret the fact that Bush was allowed to lie to our country and get us tied into a war that was not needed. I feel that we should, and are, rethinking our strategy, and are working to remedy the problems.

Are those who are responsible not terrorists in your eyes?

They are not attempting to use fear to control the actions of a group of people in violation of their basic human rights -- they are attempting to end a too long, and too bloody war. As a whole, the campaign is not a terrorist action by any stretch of the imagination. That is not to say that some of the combatants have not crossed a line and done inappropriate things.

Let's not forget this video which recently made news. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF9P5...eature=related Thanks.

I will not, and cannot excuse that behavior. That is the difference between myself and may posters here: I do not support illegal and immoral actions, be it terrorism, or failure to identify a target's identity or hostility prior to engaging it.

[Azmatullah]

Thanks for clearing that up, i must have misunderstood your post when i assumed you were turning this into a Muslim problem.

[ozymandias]

Thanks for clearing that up, i must have misunderstood your post when i assumed you were turning this into a Muslim problem.

No sir. This is a generic problem in which there are terrorists that we all have to deal with, and there are supporters of terrorism that we all have to deal with.

[ozymandias]

ok Ozy.

so if you agree to that request then everything is fine.

The Muslim world has a simple request. Respect our religion, we wll respect your religion.


we are not asking you to say Islam is the best at 5PM everyday.

We, including myself, the South Park staff, and the Danish cartoonists respected your religion as much as they respected any other -- and still had terrorist attacks.

Not only that, but people who only did the 'crime' of living in neighborhoods that decided to riot may have actually respected your religion *MORE* than they did others -- but they still suffered at the hands of terrorists.

What about the victims of the Taliban? Were they *ALL* disrespecting Islam? Even the Muslims in the Twin Towers?

[Master Khan]

We, including myself, the South Park staff, and the Danish cartoonists respected your religion as much as they respected any other -- and still had terrorist attacks.

Not only that, but people who only did the 'crime' of living in neighborhoods that decided to riot may have actually respected your religion *MORE* than they did others -- but they still suffered at the hands of terrorists.

What about the victims of the Taliban? Were they *ALL* disrespecting Islam? Even the Muslims in the Twin Towers?

They never respected our religion.
The danish cartoonists took it to far, South Park team was alright.

[ozymandias]

They never respected our religion.
The danish cartoonists took it to far,

I prefer to talk to someone other than an avid terrorism supporter, but I do have a question for you: How can you say that every single person in the Twin Towers, including the Muslims, never respected Islam? Who are you to make that judgement?

South Park team was alright.

...?

[ozymandias]

Ok.


So with your argument, the U.S.A are also terrorists.

Could you please try to read more of what I post, rather than picking and choosing what to respond to?

What about the Victims of Nato? The U.S.A? The bombardments of Afghanistan?

Again, I already addressed this.

[Master Khan]

I prefer to talk to someone other than an avid terrorism supporter, but I do have a question for you: How can you say that every single person in the Twin Towers, including the Muslims, never respected Islam? Who are you to make that judgement?

What, I am not talking about 9/11, Supporting Terrorism, Twin towers.
But about that danish guy, all I said was that he took it too far.
South Park didn't really took it far....?

To be honse I am a fan of South Park, I have seen all the episodes.
And I watched the 200,201 episodes aswell.

[ozymandias]

What, I am not talking about 9/11, Supporting Terrorism, Twin towers.

I asked "What about the victims of the Taliban? Were they *ALL* disrespecting Islam? Even the Muslims in the Twin Towers?" to which you replied: "They never respected our religion."

But about that danish guy, all I said was that he took it too far.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, we all know you are an avid supporter of terrorism.

South Park didn't really took it far....?

I agree. That surprises me.

To be honse I am a fan of South Park, I have seen all the episodes.
And I watched the 200,201 episodes aswell.

So you only support free speech if it is something you like?

[abubaker]

iam sick of people who feel like they can say what ever the hell they want about some one elses relegion and expect them to be quite, sorry but wea are not chiristian who have abandoned their relegion secturies ago, just because one group doesnt take offence if thir relegion is made fun off doesnt mean the others will too

you have your own relegion, make fun of that as much as you like but leave us alone.
by the way nowa days any one who doesnt agree with the western idiology is labled a radical and wahabi

yaw shir da, thori au speeni tapi tha sara di, chana ausama au chana khalil zad golda wi[samiullah tarun]

[ozymandias]

iam sick of people who feel like they can say what ever the hell they want about some one elses relegion and expect them to be quite,

No one is expecting you to be quiet. They are expecting you to act civilized, and not resort to terrorism. Big difference.

sorry but wea are not chiristian who have abandoned their relegion secturies ago,

What christians are *you* talking about? By definition, if they are christian, they have not abandoned their religion.

just because one group doesnt take offence if thir relegion is made fun off doesnt mean the others will too

Again, no one is expecting you not to be offended, they are expecting you to not resort to terrorism every time you get offended or angry.

you have your own relegion, make fun of that as much as you like but leave us alone.

1) Free speech means I can say what I want. It's a basic human right.
2) No special treatment for any religion.

by the way nowa days any one who doesnt agree with the western idiology is labled a radical

Not at all. You can not agree -- in a civilized way, and you are fine. It's only when you act like barbarians and radical religious nut cases are you labeled radical.

and wahabi

From what I understand the violent attacks on modern society and modern changes to islam *IS* wahhabism, at least in part. I could be wrong, but that was my interpretation of what wahhabi means -- but this is second hand from a muslim friend. Feel free to correct this part.

yaw shir da, thori au speeni tapi tha sara di, chana ausama au chana khalil zad golda wi[samiullah tarun]

Sorry, my Arabic is not that good yet.