Discussion of Ahmadi between Akbar Khan and MeemWawMeemNoon

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

^ MWMN....i understand your stance,

Fair enough, beloved sister.

but ahmdaiyyat concept is illogical and does not go side by side with the traditional islamic teachings.

Again, fair enough! However, you would have to show why. Secondly, there are many things that we don't understand in Islam, but we accepted because we have iman that Hadhrat Muhammad (saw) was correct.

For example, he had 9 wives at one time, but he has told everyone to only have 4 maximum at one time.

Also, Allah calls those who disbelieve illegitimate children.

We don't question these things because we know there must be more to the picture but it is just that we don't know enough.

Hence, when we accept Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) we have to make sure that he does not speak against Islam or the Quran or the Holy Prophet (saw), other than that whatever he has said one has to take it with the understanding that the he is the reformer of the time.

And secondly we are not some kind of authority.

You don't need to be an authority. When people accepted Islam they did not seek permission. If that was the case then no one would have accepted for the authority were against Hadhrat Muhammad (saw).

[Master Khan]

wrora you keep changing the question, first it was about the last prophet and then you changed it to Hadhrat Isa and then after you are speaking about mohammad(s.a.a.w) wifes etc now.
we are speaking about Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

wrora you keep changing the question, first it was about the last prophet and then you changed it to Hadhrat Isa and then after you are speaking about mohammad(s.a.a.w) wifes etc now.
we are speaking about Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.

No, dear brother, the subject is the same.

I was just giving examples.

The subject is still Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as).

If Hadhrat Isa (as) is passed away, then it makes Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) the Messiah. Hence, whatever he says has wisdom from Allah.

Hadhrat Muhammad (saw) is the Prophet from Allah. Whatever he has done we don't question. We don't question why he married so many women.

I was just trying to show my sister eyeliner that if Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) is the Messiah then we don't question.

Therefore, it all depends on whether Hadhrat Isa (as) is still alive or not.

[eyeliner]

at the time that the prophet SAW brought islam, it was questioned and upto today people do question the religion, and questioning is accepted in the sense as it takes away the possibility of falling into the trap of blind faith. But what Mirza came with was against the prophets ideals and contradicted his teachings, we were clearly warned and there will come people who will claim prophethood but none will be a prophet, because muhammad is the prophet. Now we cant say its day and at the same time say its night, because it is either day or night.

i mentioned that one has to be an authority, now i know at the time people were not experts in the religion of islam but the religion at the time (im not talking about paganism, just about monotheistic faiths i.e. christianity) it was clear that their would have been a prophet coming and that was accepted. Now in the above post you said the prophet had nine wives at a time and expects people to have 4, now if people who are an authority for e.g. expert in fiqh/juristpreudance they would have the upperhand in giving the reason and context behind it. Otherwise shia claims such as muttah would have significance today since they claim that the shabah's did it and so can they.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

at the time that the prophet SAW brought islam, it was questioned and upto today people do question the religion, and questioning is accepted in the sense as it takes away the possibility of falling into the trap of blind faith. But what Mirza came with was against the prophets ideals and contradicted his teachings, we were clearly warned and there will come people who will claim prophethood but none will be a prophet, because muhammad is the prophet. Now we cant say its day and at the same time say its night, because it is either day or night.

i mentioned that one has to be an authority, now i know at the time people were not experts in the religion of islam but the religion at the time (im not talking about paganism, just about monotheistic faiths i.e. christianity) it was clear that their would have been a prophet coming and that was accepted. Now in the above post you said the prophet had nine wives at a time and expects people to have 4, now if people who are an authority for e.g. expert in fiqh/juristpreudance they would have the upperhand in giving the reason and context behind it. Otherwise shia claims such as muttah would have significance today since they claim that the shabah's did it and so can they.

One thing that you have to understand, dearest sister: you have to interpret the ahadith vis-a-vis the Quran.

Secondly, as you can see, Islam already has a problem with "authority." Which authority to follow. The Shia say one thing and the Sunni say another. Who to follow? That is why we need a reformer.

That said, could you kindly tell me what has Ahmadiyyat said against Islam. This would shed a lot of light.

[eyeliner]

ok so their maybe different groups, but their basis of beliefs are the same. Basis as in everyone should know that the prophet muhmmad is the seal, and all sects generally accept that.Now mirza might have been some charismatic leader that won people over but thats all he will remain.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Ahmadis DO NOT reject the fact that Hadhrat Muhammad (saw) is the Seal of the Prophets.

I guess on the rest we can agree to disagree.

[Master Khan]

But Hadhrat Muhammad (saw) himself said that there will be no prophets after me (as in new ones), so how can this punjabi guy calm to be a prophet and the second coming of Hadhrat Isa (who is not died yet)

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Fair enough, beloved brother. If you go based on that, then you are RIGHT. I give in. However, we must interpret every hadith based on the Quran for we don't know the exact context nor do we know its authority.

According to the Quran, Hadhrat Isa (as) is dead and prophethood can continue.

I go based on Quran. If I were to go based on ahadith only, then I guess I would have to choose what you are saying because that is the majority stance. However, there are ahadith that speak of another prophet. But I guess people will say those are "weak" ahadith.

[Master Khan]

The quran is the main book, if you don't beilieve in that then you are not a muslim, the quran saids that the last prophet is mohammad(s.a.a.w)

[eyeliner]

Ahmadis DO NOT reject the fact that Hadhrat Muhammad (saw) is the Seal of the Prophets.

I guess on the rest we can agree to disagree.

if they dont reject then where did mirza come from? and who is he?

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) is the awaited promised Messiah.

[eyeliner]

^ no Isa (AS) was

[Master Khan]

wrora a Prophet doesn't have pictures.
The 2nd coming of Isa haven't happen yet.

[eyeliner]

forget about pics, he had no revealations, and a promised messiah should have sanity too