Infinite punishment for a finite sin?

[badmash_khel]

I have seen many Atheists and non muslims ask this question.

Is it really just and reasonable that God punishes someone (eternity in hell) for a finite crime? If the person who did the crime was given an infinite amount of time, wouldn't he have repented?

How do you see this question? Is it a reasonable question or an absurd one?

[khushal]

What is a finite sin?

[faye]

a sin which is not infinite.

[khushal]

name one

[faye]

pessimism

[khushal]

I have seen many Atheists and non muslims ask this question.

Is it really just and reasonable that God punishes someone (eternity in hell) for a finite crime? If the person who did the crime was given an infinite amount of time, wouldn't he have repented?

How do you see this question? Is it a reasonable question or an absurd one?

Correct me if Im wrong but the Quran only uses the word "abada" (forever) in reference to Heaven but never in reference to Hell.

also this verse:



al-A`raf 7:156
'I will inflict My punishment on whom I will; but My mercy encompasses all things."

[M17ArnoBaloch]

If the man has been given an infinite amount of time then the whole point of repentance and forgiveness would be lost. People would do crimes and simply ask for forgiveness and live forever and never pay for their crimes. The Idea is to avoid the objectives that are told to be avoided and stay in belief. And I don't know what you mean by an "finite crime" since there is place for forgiveness as long as you are living, once you die, it is then the (eternity in hell) comes. The Prophet Muhammad (saw) has told us to ask for forgiveness for any crime that you have and God will forgive it, but you shall hurry up since you know not about your life. Do repentance and God will accept it and I recall an ayah from the Qur'an where it says: "That God is merciful as long as your living, but when you die, nothing shall help you except of the good deeds you have done (in the world). And there is also an authentic hadith in Sahih Bukhari and Sahi Muslim where the Prophet (saw) has told a story of a man who killed 100 human beings and still got forgiveness from God. Here is the Hadith.

Bukhari
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: The Prophet said, "Amongst the men of Bani Israel there was a man who had murdered ninety-nine persons. Then he set out asking (whether his repentance could be accepted or not). He came upon a monk and asked him if his repentance could be accepted. The monk replied in the negative and so the man killed him. He kept on asking till a man advised to go to such and such village. (So he left for it) but death overtook him on the way. While dying, he turned his chest towards that village (where he had hoped his repentance would be accepted), and so the angels of mercy and the angels of punishment quarrelled amongst themselves regarding him. Allah ordered the village (towards which he was going) to come closer to him, and ordered the village (whence he had come), to go far away, and then He ordered the angels to measure the distances between his body and the two villages. So he was found to be one span closer to the village (he was going to). So he was forgiven." (Book #56, Hadith #676)


Muslim
Abu Sa'id al-Khudri reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: There was a person before you who had killed ninety-nine persons and then made an inquiry about the learned persons of the world (who could show him the way to salvation). He was directed to a monk. He came to him and told him that he had killed ninety-nine persons and asked him whether there was any scope for his repentance to be accepted. He said: No. He killed him also and thus completed one hundred. He then asked about the learned persons of the earth and he was directed to a scholar, and he told him that he had killed one hundred persons and asked him whether there was any scope for his repentance to be accepted. He said: Yes; what stands between you and the repentance? You better go to such and such land; there are people devoted to prayer and worship and you also worship along with them and do not come to the land of yours since it was an evil land (for you). So he went away and he had hardly covered half the distance when death came to him and there was a dispute between the angels of mercy and the angels of punishment. The angels of mercy said: This man has come as a penitant and remorseful to Allah and the angels of punishment said: He has done no good at all. Then there came another angel in the form of a human being in order to decide between them. He said: You measure the land to which he has drawn near. They measured it and found him nearer to the land where he intended to go (the land of piety), and so the angels of mercy took possession of it. Qatada said that Hasan told him that it was said to them that as death approached him, he crawled upon his chest (and managed) to slip in the land of mercy. (Book #037, Hadith #6662)


Abu Sa'id al-Khudri reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying that a man killed ninety-nine persons and then he began to make an inquiry whether there was any way left for him for repentance. He came to a monk and asked him about that, and he said: There is no chance for repentance for you. He killed the monk also and then began to make an inquiry and moved from one village to another village where there lived pious persons, and as he had covered some distance, he was overtaken by death, but he managed to crawl upon his chest (to the side nearer to the place where the pious men lived). He died and then there was a dispute between the angels of mercy and the angels of punishment and (when it was measured) he was found to be nearer to the village where pious persons were living equal to the Space of a span and he was thus included among them. (Book #037, Hadith #6663)

What do you mean by an "finite crime" or "finite sin". Please elaborate more. Nothing is a finite crime in Islam as long as you ask for forgiveness.

[Zirey]

It is an interesting and relevant question. Some have argued that any sin against an infinite God is worthy of infinite punishment. Since Jesus the Messiah has taken away the sin of the world, I rather believe that no punishment will last endlessly and that all will eventually come to repentance.

[khushal]

It is an interesting and relevant question. Some have argued that any sin against an infinite God is worthy of infinite punishment. Since Jesus the Messiah has taken away the sin of the world, I rather believe that no punishment will last endlessly and that all will eventually come to repentance.

^^so a man can take away the sin of the world?

[Karachi]

I have seen many Atheists and non muslims ask this question.

Is it really just and reasonable that God punishes someone (eternity in hell) for a finite crime? If the person who did the crime was given an infinite amount of time, wouldn't he have repented?

How do you see this question? Is it a reasonable question or an absurd one?

to be honest no one knows what Allah will punish or reward for. I hate Mullahs who are arrogant and think they know every thing

yesterday I was watching a pakistani religious show and this mullah was saying how people (kaffirs) will be punished for so many little things. how the hell does he know? is he God? The arrogance of some religious people makes me sick

[Breshna]

Everyone is accountable for their...own sins.

Allah s.w.t gives us many...chances.

We can repent in this...World.

As long as we don't repeat..them.

A human makes...errors after errors.

If you want...forgiveness start repenting.

Allah s.w.t is...Merciful.

The sins which cannot be..forgiven,

are the crimes one commits against...others.

Until that person...forgives.

[drona]

Punishment for Kaffirs [Non-Muslims] even if they don't commit any sin.

Sahih International: Their garments of liquid pitch and their faces covered by the Fire.

Pickthall: Their raiment of pitch, and the Fire covering their faces,

Yusuf Ali: Their garments of liquid pitch, and their faces covered with Fire;

Shakir: Their shirts made of pitch and the fire covering their faces

Muhammad Sarwar: with garments of pitch and faces covered by fire.

Mohsin Khan: Their garments will be of pitch, and fire will cover their faces.

Arberry: of pitch their shirts, their faces enveloped by the Fire,

http://corpus.quran.com/translation.jsp?chapter=14&verse=50

[Afghanistan2010]

Forever will be the disbelievers the dwellers of Jahanam that is a fact.

1 – In Soorat al-Nisa, where He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Verily, those who disbelieve and did wrong [by concealing the truth about Prophet Muhammad and his message of true Islamic Monotheism written in the Tawraatt (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel) with them]; Allaah will not forgive them, nor will He guide them to any way.
Except the way of Hell, to dwell therein forever”

[al-Nisa’ 4:168-169]

2 – In Soorat al-Ahzaab, where He says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Verily, Allaah has cursed the disbelievers, and has prepared for them a flaming Fire (Hell)
Wherein they will abide for ever”

[al-Ahzaab 33:64]

3 – In Soorat al-Jinn, where He says (interpretation of the meaning):
“and whosoever disobeys Allaah and His Messenger, then verily, for him is the fire of Hell, he shall dwell therein forever”

[al-Jinn 72:23]

Why

“This, because you took the Revelations of Allaah (this Qur’aan) in mockery, and the life of the world deceived you. So this Day, they shall not be taken out from there (Hell), nor shall they be returned to the worldly life (so that they repent to Allaah, and beg His Pardon for their sins)”
[al-Jaathiyah 45:35]

Their sin is it really finite ?

They have disbelieved in Allah and his Messengers,his Books,the Angels and his Siffaat (attributes).

They have wronged themselves not Allah wronged them :
As Allah say :

Surah An Nisa 4/64

Sahih International
And We did not send any messenger except to be obeyed by permission of Allah . And if, when they wronged themselves, they had come to you, [O Muhammad], and asked forgiveness of Allah and the Messenger had asked forgiveness for them, they would have found Allah Accepting of repentance and Merciful.

Surah An Nisa

Sahih International
Indeed, Allah does not forgive association with Him, but He forgives what is less than that for whom He wills. And he who associates others with Allah has certainly fabricated a tremendous sin.

4:49to top

Sahih International
Have you not seen those who claim themselves to be pure? Rather, Allah purifies whom He wills, and injustice is not done to them, [even] as much as a thread [inside a date seed].

4:50to top

Sahih International
Look how they invent about Allah untruth, and sufficient is that as a manifest sin.

“Truly, Hell is a place of ambush —

A dwelling place for the Taaghoon (those who transgress the boundary limits set by Allaah, like polytheists, disbelievers in the Oneness of Allaah, hypocrites, sinners, criminals),

They will abide therein for ages.

Nothing cool shall they taste therein, nor any drink.

Except boiling water, and dirty wound discharges —
An exact recompense (according to their evil crimes).

For verily, they used not to look for a reckoning.

But they belied Our Ayaat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, and that which Our Prophet brought) completely.

And all things We have recorded in a Book.

So taste you (the results of your evil actions).

No increase shall We give you, except in torment”
[al-Naba’ 78:21-30]

[khushal]

Punishment for Kaffirs [Non-Muslims] even if they don't commit any sin.

Are you aware of what Kafir means?

[IamDZJ]

God is a tyrant. You don't get to ask questions. You worship and you make sure that you worship him and only him the way you have never worshipped anything else. Beg for forgiveness for all the sins that you have, will or are capable of committing and if you please him enough, he will spare you from being tossed in to hell fire. .