Why

[khyaal]

The dream will come true.



We just need awearness and need to counter this Pakistani propaganda which is making

its way through school text books and ptv.

Look! His intentions are so obvious, this Punjab co-opted Pashtun has agenda of dividing the land of Great Ahmad Shah Baba while he has so relentlessly been working as Punjabi/Paki apologist on this forum.

Mr.Sher Khan! you are Paki patriot so-called Pakhtun and you don't have any right to talk about Azad Afghanistan or its issues let aside the division of Afghanistan. It is better you only talk about the issues of your minority class of Punjab co-opted Pashtuns.

[parsiwaan]

Parsiban,

I am an Afghan from Afghanistan and don't get me started with your history and those people you are defending.

Im not defending "those people" but simply showing you guys the mirror...if u defend Golbodin, Omar and... then i will have no choice but to defend fahim and rest... just check the threads in this forum in support of savage Taliban.

Today Afghanistan is going through war and misery not only because of Pashtuns, but because of every other ethnic group as well. I knew from the beginning that you are only on this forum to spread hatred not only between Pashtuns, but to force Pashtuns to hate other ethnic groups as well.

Wrong... Afghanistan is in misery only because of Pashtons Doud khan, Pashton, Taraki, Pashton Amin, Pashton Babrak Karmal, and Pashton Najib. Its all because of senseless and pointless da pashtonistan zemong policy which has provoked a more powerful and imperialist servant Pakistan to react. Kabul must be burn policy of Zaiallhaq is reaction of pashtonistan zemong policy.

Let me remind you that your Setami idealogy will not work here or anywhere else in Afghanistan. Pashtunistan will be united with Afghanistan whether you like it or not. Afghanistan will also have the Northern regions of Afghanistan as part of greater Afghanistan whether you like it or not.

Stop your destructive dream of braking Pakistan...your own pashtons will slit ur head and feast on your blood in honor of Pakistan...just check the postings of proud Pakistani pashtons in this forum! I personally have nothing against loy Afghanistan.. giving a secular, democratic system where rights of minority are safeguard is established...but lets face loy Afghanistan is the reason Afghanistan is suffering today. Naïve pashton ruler of Kabul had provoked imperialist creation Pakistan and thought wrongly the Pakistani pashton will favor them…the reaction was Kabul must be burn and strategic depth policies… while de pashtonistan zemong remains a wet dream…Kabul was burn and strategic depth is a reality today.

What we face in Afghanistan today is the fault of our leaders not the people. In the other hand we have people like yourself who either pretend to be from Afghanistan or in the name of Afghan spreading hatred.

Off course its the mistake of pashton leaders that we all afghans are paying today, but problem is when local pashtons like yourself have not realize the mistake of those totally failed policies of those leaders...even today you guys till believe in loy Afghanistan and pashtonistan...while Pakistani Pashtons are laughing at you "Gilamjaams." You know if telling the truth is spreading hatred them be it… I say it as it is… if bound of afghans are so superficial that it will be broken with few internet post then afghans don’t deserve to be together to began with.

Fahim, Abdullahx2, Dostum, Mohaqiq, Khallili, Masoud, Qanoni, Rabani and etc are no different from Mullah Omar, Sayaf, Hekmatyar, Ahmadzai, and etc. Each one of these individuals had or are symbols/puppets of foreigners.

Exactly, so why we see people defending Mullah omar, Hakmatyaar in here? Moreover these individuals are the product, the real problem was da pashtonsitan zemong policy which forced Pakistan to take counter measure... Massod, Hekmatyar and rest are product of that reaction...if weak Afghanistan had not provoked Pakistan with supporting Ghafar khan and all those Maleeks that were receiving billions of dollars as payment from Kabul gov but at end they were also milking Pakistan and were royal to neither...Pakistan would have not successfully turn massod and hekmatyar loss to burn Afghanistan.

The Northern Alliance war against Taliban had nothing to do with Afghanistan becoming the fifth province of Pakistan. We can counter this arguement and say that the Taliban were fighting against the Northern Alliance to stop Afghanistan from becoming another republic of the Russians and Iran.
Your arguement is based on emotions, but let me remind you the ground reality tells us something else.

You kidding me? was there any Irani, or Russian fighting in ranks and file of NA? Was not frontier corps and ISI generals actively caring Taliban war machines? Even Taliban defense minister was from FATA area...check Abdul Rashid book Taliban...while u could not find a single Tajikistani, Uzbekistani, or Irani in ranks of NA...the one responsible for NA war against Taliban were General Aseif Delawar a Safi Pashtons from Kohaistan...he is now Afghanistan’s ambassador to Ukraine.

[parsiwaan]

Parsiwan a more sound and objective evaluations, plaease.

Every intervention in another state for what ever aim, has its own policy aims and the means through which that objective/ends is pursued. I agree with you on our reliance on Pakistan at the time and how much our politics was integrated, but we were still a fire that we rather entered in to the belly of Pakistan than a Qabili Palaw.

Dude, lets stop using fancy analogy and big words, the fact is this fire has burn only our own ass...and that of few pashtons of FATA, those Punjabis and majority of NWFP pashtons has not been effected at all but even have profited from this fire. Check this out...not only they care getting billions of dollars from US/West as aid, they are also benefiting from cheap afghan refugee labor, and billion dollar foreigner exchange they get from afghan carpet industry and hard cash afghans in west send to their relative in Pakistan. If it was not for afghan refugees there would be no Hayatabad in Peshawar...it will be empty.

Link... Afghan carpets export brought pakistan $238 million dollars.
http://pakistantimes.net/2005/08/17/business1.htm

Pakistan was hedging its bets on Taliban to large extend. Islam and faith has been core in Pashtun political revival historiacally. Pakistan was running out of money itself and couldn't develop itself, and educate yourself and relationship with Taliban was also deteriorating. Every time when Pakistan is in crisis the military walks in, and it was about time that Pakistan had to redefine its relationship and policies towards Taliban Afghanistan. Can't you decipher why Musharaf was vehementaly anti-Taliban? Forget about some of those Pakis' wet dreams. I ask you again to tell me what a colony is in your own words, not a 19th centur dictionary.

Even today, Taliban are doing Pakistan bidding, and taliban themselves have not shy from admitting this... check Taliban commander's interview where he states without Pakistan help we will not survive a week. As for as colony, i already told u what Emirat means and how it come to being, i also told u how Pakistanis pashtons were planning total control of Afghanistan with Habib Bank, WPDA and other building “infrastructure of Afghanistan.”
Do you know when Taliban were capturing Kabul, that night PTV was playing a old British movie about anglo-afghan war, i was visiting Pakistan then and i remember vividly. Pakistan is successor of British raj with same forward policy, FATA, PATA and collective punishment are still there... while the naïve FATA Pashtons think they are Azaad. (Check Mohammad Ali Jenah speech about FATA and NWFP, he openly states the forward policy of British Raj will be continued!)

Pakistan's relations with Massoud and Hekmatyar, both who received their initial terrorist trainings from them were one based on the fact Hekmatyar was a Pashtun and Pakistan was liable to have him friendly. It also has to do with thier ideologies. Massoud simply remained out of favour and his vhemence for Pakistan was due to the fact that Pakistan had to be on the side of his foes - not that he was opposed to foreign involvement. Massoud's terrorist career started under ISI tutelage. On another note; Pakistan relations with certain Pashtun groups are also out of complusion as may be a choice.

It makes no difference, compulsion or choice, the fact is Pakistan is using certain pashtons groups.... not the other way around! Is Pakistan not destroying schools, colleges, bridges and hospitals throw these certain pashton groups? 380 schools has been destroyed in southern Afghanistan in 2009…check the news.

Ok, Hekmatyar had his share in the destruction of Kabul. And most of the information about his destruction also remains by and large from the only sources of media controlled by Ranbani's illigitimate government. Lets look at it this way. Why are areas which were controlled by Hekmatyar more destroyed and shelled than ones held by Massoud's forces? The worse destroyed parts of Kabul are central-east and eastern parts. The rest remained thriving and intact then.

Those area that are destroyed were the front line, it was Hakmatyar that started the war for why ex Communist and General dostom are in gov, later he join hand with General dostom and Wahdat. Saif and Golbodin were saying it long ago that there has been a lot of sin in kabul so the city needs to be destroyed....the fact is Hakmatyar was doing Pakistan’s bidding---Kabul must be burned...just as Taliban are now---to prevent establishment of ANA, ANP and governance...to keep Afghanistan destabilize and weak.

My reponses to you are in proportion to your western orientalist views of Pashtuns. I am not drawing any comparison between Gulbadin, Omar and Fahim etc. The matter of the fact is that your elites to this date are still warlords and most of the Tajiks areas such as Takhar and Kudoz are still raven by Bacha Baz warlords. Other than the security concerns, the major spoilers are mainly warlords in the current transition period - and I am not going to say where they and in which ethnic groups they remain dominant and concentrate to the highest level, which speaks volume *cough* *cough*.. the sophesitcation and the culture etc. Exxxxxxxxxxxxxxcuse me. The worse Pashtun minister is better than Abdullah and Fahim.

Just compare how much Mazar, Herat, Fariab, Punjshir and rest of north and north west has developed to south...even in good times it was only Farsiban, Hazara and Uzbak the most progressive...check the girls school and university enrollment percentage, over all I’m not saying all but generally speaking... the fact is pashtons are conservative and treats their women like a commodities..check why most of afghan female marring non-afghans are pashtons.

You are only alowed to evaluate and judge Pashtun war time leaders from analysing the dynamics of Afghan politics only. Since Massoud himself had to draw foreign support in his own aims. We even know about the infamous treaties with the Russians durring the invaion. He even wrote a letter to CIA before his demise begging for help, despite that he was anti-American at a point. Well obviously he had to keep it sweet with the Ruskies.

Massod had no choice but you will never find a single Ruskies or other foreigners soldiers or generals in Massod ranks ..other then few Ruskies that were captured during war and had converted to Islam....lets me honest here...who brought Soviet? who brought Arabs and Pakistanis?
Check cold war project documents where Nabeghi Sharq Taraki calls soviets primary and ask to send more soviet troops, he even ask them to send Tajikistani and Uzbekistani troops.

I don't buy in to your ethnicsing everything and for that you got answer for speaking for every one in my previous post. Wouldn't you agree that each time we had Tajik who wasn't suited to run the country it led cycle of violence and all the bad lucks?

That is b/c of Pashton tribalism...this is why Afghanistan is not a nation yet, always thinking of themselves as pashton, tajik and even among pashton, Durrani, Ghaljia and... do you know how the army of Ghadar Nadir khan treated people of Shamali? that is after swearing on Qorhan...peoples good, land and even women were taken... talk about Ghirat and Ezat. Check what British agent Mohmmad Gul Mommand and later Pakistani proxies Taliban did to Shamali valley. My own cousins land were all burn by Taliban in Kodaman...all the grepsyard, trees and everything.

[Toramana]

Mr Parsiban, hold on. I have noticed one thing in Parsibanans, that is they are past-masters of playing the victimhood drama and blame-game even when they are the worst aggressors and the evilist of perpetrators.


The fact of the matter is, when Burhanuddin Rabbani captured the throne of Kabul thanks the backing from Pakistan (Rawalpindi agreement in 1992) and the ethnicity-motivated support from commie Generals like Baba Jan, etc. who abandoned Dr Najibullah to join hands with Masoud, Rabbani, etc. in a rare spirit of Tajak/Parsiban solidarity and Rabbani declared Afghanistan "Yak Kishawar-i-Farsi-Zaban", there was little option left to Pashtuns except to orgaize around any one they could to get a foothold in Kabul and reclaim their right as a majority.

And you are pretending as if Tajaks/Parsibanans were superpatriots and Pashtuns the ultimate traitors. This is far from reality. During the Afghan War, the most prominent Parsiban leadership, received practical and political backing from Pakistan. Rabbani, along with his Jammiath-i-Islami, was based in Peshawar. He even owned property in Peshawar granted to him by General Zia-ul-Haq (just ahead of new Peshawar Bus Stand right on the GT Road). Jummaith-i-Islami with backing from Pakistan grabbed the largest chunk of power in Kabul including the powerful defence ministery (in 1992). Not only did the Dari-Zaban milk Pakistan playing the Islamic brotherhood card, also after the War(1992), did its secular leadership tap every channel of support evoking sectarian empathy, ethnic kinship, and secular/commie connections. Consequently, Russia, Tajakistan, Uzbakistan, Iran, Turki, India, (even France) were some bases of support for Parsibanans against the Pashtun majority.

On the contrary, the secular Pashtun leadership of Afghanistan got scattered and exiled thanks the mechanation of Punjabi-Mahajar Janta which couldn't tolerate secular Pashtun leaders in Afghanistan except Islamists for fear of potential Indian influence and revival of Pashtun nationalism. They had to contend with Taleban or other Pashtun Islamists because the total marginalization of Pashtuns from power in Kabul would have caused intense resentment in Pashtuns on the Pakistani side of the Durand Line. That was their compulsion to do so.

Last, contrary to your half-truths and grass misinterpretation of events concerning the role of some Pashtun army officers in Paki military or civil bureaucracy in the civil war in Afghanistan, such role wasn't aimed at and not motivated by any desire to destroy Afghanistan ( that is your own sinister/dishonest misrepresentation of facts to sow a seed of hatred in Pashtuns of Afghanistan against Pashtuns of Pakistan). Such role PRIMARILY and FUNDAMENTALLY arose in response to the actions of Northen Alliance thugs who with active backing from Iran, Tajakistan, Russia, etc. had marched on Kabul and were hell bent to keep the Pashtun majority out and have re-seated Parsibabanans at positions of power. Just like you Tajaks got unwavering support from your ethnic and sectarian kin in Iran, Tajakistan, etc.in a bid to railroad the Pashtun majority, same did the Pashtuns do who received backing from their brethern in Pakistan.

I have myself talked to many Pashtun army officers and they told me they had no other option except to support Taleban/Islamists in the face of Parsiban hegemony that was trying to surge in a most macabre way in Kabul. They also said, secular Pashtun leadership was neither avaibale nor in good currency with Punjabi-Mahajar junta that controlled Pakistan's foreign policy. Those were the dynamics of civil war that Pashtuns got caught in. They had very limited options.

The northern allaince thugs should have realized from the very beginning that by taking Kabul with such nacked force and chauvinistically declaring Afghanistan a "Kishawar-i-Farsi Zaban" railroading the Pashtun majority, there could have been no better consequence than the strong reaction the Pashtuns showed whatever you name it, the Taleban movement, etc.

[Fahd]

ok parsiban i will don't dance for i will dance for toramana
haha
jk
thanx toramana i read what u post and understand like 90% hehe

[Toramana]

Parsiban, lies would not do anyone good. No more the ridiculous propaganda. It is a fact that Russians were brought to Afghanistan by Babrak Karmal, an ethnic Tajak. Russians even through a well-devised strategy strengthened the ethnic minorities like Tajaks, Uzbaks, etc. for strategic (security shield against capatalistic/Islamic infuences) and demographic/political reasons (large Tajak, Uzbak populations in the erstwhile USSR). They deliberately weakened Pashtuns politically and physically by destroying their lands most mercilessly while signing deals with Masoud and other Tajaks and bringing them up the in military and civil administration disproportionately.

The deal with Masoud was not just a tactical move. Actually, Russians wanted to build political "assets" in the north of Afghanistan (due to its geographical proximity with USSR) which they could later rely on and use. Later events corroborate that, as how Masoud and his Tajak entrouge got active backing from Ruskies.

So much so that when Americans were invading Afghanistan in Oct 2002 and got advice from Russians on that togethor with their conditions for support, Russians insisted Kabul should be given to Parsibanans and Pashtuns should be left in the south. Obviously, that was politically to risky for Americans to accept.

[Fahd]

wah wah toramana bro
ta de awlna cherta weh !!!!!!!

[Toramana]

Mr Parsiban, Pashtuns of Pakistan suffered heavily due to the influx of those millions of Parsibanans whom they had nothing in common with. Their infrastructure was destroyed, resources were depleted, society criminalized due to drug and gun culture, etc.

The foundation stone of Hayatabad was laid down much before(1974) there was any Parsiban on the radar screen.

I wonder who allowed the Parsibanans to move to Pukhtunkhwa in such a large number when they have nothing to do with us.

As for conservatism, we Pashtuns have our own values. We are not blind imitators of foreign cultures. Pashtuns are well on their way to education, trade, and other exposure. Unlike, your Tajaks in Tajakistan or Persians in Iran who put on the yolk of Russian slavery for almost two centuries and Mullah rule for the last few decades and have no democratic tradition in their society, we have strong history of political activism. True, our Pashtun brothers in Afghanistan were left behind a bit due to the unfortunate events of the last 3 decades, the re-awakening is visible (amidst the mechanation of our adversaries). They would soon join us as well in our march to collective progress.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Easy with the wordings people and lets be a little objective. No need for certain words and keep the debate civil, Manana

Swat wrora wo pa sawt buner nor seemo kae khalk da Afghanistan pashtano saraa kha woo kho kala kala pa peshawar kae ham zanree ba Afghanistan pashtano tha badh waell. We have to be a little fair when saying such things. Although I agree that is their land as well, but we have to move to the practical, where we actually enforce this unity.

[Toramana]

Look! His intentions are so obvious, this Punjab co-opted Pashtun has agenda of dividing the land of Great Ahmad Shah Baba while he has so relentlessly been working as Punjabi/Paki apologist on this forum.

Mr.Sher Khan! you are Paki patriot so-called Pakhtun and you don't have any right to talk about Azad Afghanistan or its issues let aside the division of Afghanistan. It is better you only talk about the issues of your minority class of Punjab co-opted Pashtuns.

Mr Khayal Khana, I hold in regard your dream of a grand Afghanistan where angels, saints, dogs, donkeys, women, men, hetereosexuals, homosexuals, etc. would freely roam around but other people have the right to disagree with you. Also, don't doubt the intentions of other friends when they disagree with you on the issue of Pashtun nationalism or identity.

Looking at your blind and uncontrolled romance, I fear you would back up from Pashtun nationalism quickly when you would find, things are not as romantic as you formed the images of. There is a saying that the kettle which boils quickly is burnt quickly as well.

One should be a bit realistic in one's love/romance for things.

[khyaal]

Mr Khayal Khana, I hold in regard your dream of a grand Afghanistan where angels, saints, dogs, donkeys, women, men, hetereosexuals, homosexuals, etc. would freely roam around but other people have the right to disagree with you. Also, don't doubt the intentions of other friends when they disagree with you on the issue of Pashtun nationalism or identity.

Look Toramana! Keep this in mind that in such discussions I don't take ones disagreement as personal opposition because in fact I don't know who the poster is. I just oppose those views which in my opinion are divisive and dangerous for Pashtun(afghan) nation. Amusing thing is that you just do the same of which you accuse other for.

BTW, am I more dreamer than those who are after the simultaneous division of two states while they will be silent spectators to watch your cherished dreams coming into realization? What you think, will this be comedy show for them?

Looking at your blind and uncontrolled romance, I fear you would back up from Pashtun nationalism quickly when you would find, things are not as romantic as you formed the images of. There is a saying that the kettle which boils quickly is burnt quickly as well.

One should be a bit realistic in one's love/romance for things.

What romance? Do you consider the existence of Pakistan some immutable reality and the re-unification of afghans a mere dream? If it is so, then please don't just waste your time in such forums, go and further improve your career goals and your personal ambitions. I know well your mentors, their bewitching lies and their deceitful characters.

[ComradePashtun]

Dude, lets stop using fancy analogy and big words, the fact is this fire has burn only our own ass...and that of few pashtons of FATA, those Punjabis and majority of NWFP pashtons has not been effected at all but even have profited from this fire. Check this out...not only they care getting billions of dollars from US/West as aid, they are also benefiting from cheap afghan refugee labor, and billion dollar foreigner exchange they get from afghan carpet industry and hard cash afghans in west send to their relative in Pakistan. If it was not for afghan refugees there would be no Hayatabad in Peshawar...it will be empty.

Link... Afghan carpets export brought pakistan $238 million dollars.
http://pakistantimes.net/2005/08/17/business1.htm





Even today, Taliban are doing Pakistan bidding, and taliban themselves have not shy from admitting this... check Taliban commander's interview where he states without Pakistan help we will not survive a week. As for as colony, i already told u what Emirat means and how it come to being, i also told u how Pakistanis pashtons were planning total control of Afghanistan with Habib Bank, WPDA and other building “infrastructure of Afghanistan.”
Do you know when Taliban were capturing Kabul, that night PTV was playing a old British movie about anglo-afghan war, i was visiting Pakistan then and i remember vividly. Pakistan is successor of British raj with same forward policy, FATA, PATA and collective punishment are still there... while the naïve FATA Pashtons think they are Azaad. (Check Mohammad Ali Jenah speech about FATA and NWFP, he openly states the forward policy of British Raj will be continued!)




It makes no difference, compulsion or choice, the fact is Pakistan is using certain pashtons groups.... not the other way around! Is Pakistan not destroying schools, colleges, bridges and hospitals throw these certain pashton groups? 380 schools has been destroyed in southern Afghanistan in 2009…check the news.



Those area that are destroyed were the front line, it was Hakmatyar that started the war for why ex Communist and General dostom are in gov, later he join hand with General dostom and Wahdat. Saif and Golbodin were saying it long ago that there has been a lot of sin in kabul so the city needs to be destroyed....the fact is Hakmatyar was doing Pakistan’s bidding---Kabul must be burned...just as Taliban are now---to prevent establishment of ANA, ANP and governance...to keep Afghanistan destabilize and weak.





Just compare how much Mazar, Herat, Fariab, Punjshir and rest of north and north west has developed to south...even in good times it was only Farsiban, Hazara and Uzbak the most progressive...check the girls school and university enrollment percentage, over all I’m not saying all but generally speaking... the fact is pashtons are conservative and treats their women like a commodities..check why most of afghan female marring non-afghans are pashtons.




Massod had no choice but you will never find a single Ruskies or other foreigners soldiers or generals in Massod ranks ..other then few Ruskies that were captured during war and had converted to Islam....lets me honest here...who brought Soviet? who brought Arabs and Pakistanis?
Check cold war project documents where Nabeghi Sharq Taraki calls soviets primary and ask to send more soviet troops, he even ask them to send Tajikistani and Uzbekistani troops.



That is b/c of Pashton tribalism...this is why Afghanistan is not a nation yet, always thinking of themselves as pashton, tajik and even among pashton, Durrani, Ghaljia and... do you know how the army of Ghadar Nadir khan treated people of Shamali? that is after swearing on Qorhan...peoples good, land and even women were taken... talk about Ghirat and Ezat. Check what British agent Mohmmad Gul Mommand and later Pakistani proxies Taliban did to Shamali valley. My own cousins land were all burn by Taliban in Kodaman...all the grepsyard, trees and everything.

Parsiwan,

I am sorry that what I say is not a tune in your Setami ears and doesn't fit your own version anti-Pashtunism.

I ask you again to enlist those of the Pakistani foreign policy aims in Afghanistan in Taliban period so we can conclude whether Afghanistan could be accounted for as a colony. What is hard for you to do that? My views are more hostile towards Taliban than I could imagine others' in this forum. But I have my own reasons. I am also against every aspect of Pakistan's involvement in our country. But our relations with Pakistan is not a zero-sum. Just as you may allege that Pakistan uses certain Pashtun froups for its own ends - I would rather argue the other way around. Very good that Hekmatyar and Taliban used Pakistan.

Fancy words it your habit. How can you claim that Pashtuns in PK were not affected by the war? What cheap labour? That cheap labour I don't think helped the very millions of Pashtunkhwa Pashtuns who live on the verge of poverty line themseslves. I don't blame them when they say that Afghan were strain on their local economy. Can you even account for the destruction that they have gone through over the past 9 years? What aid got to them? Where else would have you sold your carpets, Parsiwan?

I am aware of Pakistani interest, even today many Pashtuns are supporting Taliban for the very reasons as they did in the 90's. Despite my seemingly anti Taliban views, I have never supported their sumbmission to the current set up haphazardly. It has to come through genuine political solution. I just want them to be moderate and willing to negotiate. Although I don't agree with their ideologies but the dog of Taliban is better than the entire NA.

I don't give a crap about your refugee experience in Pakistan and their banks and other institutions. They could hardly feed their own population. I know my nation and I believe in my people.

Yes there were arabs and others but that was what was largely due to circumstance. Your leaders brought and embraced Abdullah Azam, Bin etc. before the Pashtuns did. Yes Pashtun tribalism was the reason your mother give birth to you, everything bad with you noble boy-players is Pashtun fault.

I know you goons and what you are capable of. All you did was rape Kabuli women and loot their household than building ANA and ANP and governance. Massoud in ploy with his Prachamis pushed Hekmatyar out of Kabul and marginalised Pashtuns and rejected every Afghan character of the country. I cannot more eloquently explicate it than Taronama has in his post.

Why did Masoud not co-opt Dostum and Hazaras then? Why did Hazaras and Dostum side with Hekmatyar then? What were Massoud'd plans?

As for Pashtun and Prasiwan women - your claim is rideculous and laughable. Parsiwans are known for their women if anything. Thank you. Our women are strong alahmdulilah and very introvert and preserved in proud Pashtun character - dranday dee! Thank you.

As for education, I am once again saying this that on our local standard Pashtuns will beat you in any field. By the way Jalalabad university was ranked the first till few years ago - I don't know about it now, if anything it might be second to Kabul in where I know for a fact that Pashtuns and Hazaras are the brightest. Generally we are ba-estedad people and this is a known fact. Kabul university and other private universities are packed with Pashtun females. It is so nice reading Pashtun female profiles for their accomplishments in institutes like the American univerity of Afghansitan, despite the fact that for years they were descriminated against for even enrolling in the most fare international university by Farsiwans and Hazaras administrators. These and other descrimination thanks to these forces have sends schocks and has created deep awareness in Pashtun community in Afghansitan on many levels. In war-torn regions it is unfortunate that our people are deprived from all baisc ammenities. That is the dark side of war. Inshallah we will regain our prominance.

Nadir Shah's action cannot be judged accordintg today's standard. After all he had to despose a foreign agent and bandit from power who looted all Kabul and even Pashtun regions. By the way my grad dad's dad also participated in the battle.

How was Gul Muhamed Khan Momand a British agent?lol Every one is an agent according to you. You denounce Shenwari tribe for standing against Taliban, if they didn't you would still find a reason to loosen that trap of yours. You entire clan is a foreign and occupation mercenary.

[parsiwaan]

Tormana,
Your just mad cause i have pointed all the crimes and treason of you NWFP pashtons against afghan and Afghanistan...no wonder you make no sense.

Mr Parsiban, hold on. I have noticed one thing in Parsibanans, that is they are past-masters of playing the victimhood drama and blame-game even when they are the worst aggressors and the evilist of perpetrators.

Really? ok tell me the last time a Parsiban invaded you people? For past 200 years you guys are selling your soul to one evil to another and kill others and each other and yet talk about evilist and aggressors?

The fact of the matter is, when Burhanuddin Rabbani captured the throne of Kabul thanks the backing from Pakistan (Rawalpindi agreement in 1992) and the ethnicity-motivated support from commie Generals like Baba Jan, etc. who abandoned Dr Najibullah to join hands with Masoud, Rabbani, etc. in a rare spirit of Tajak/Parsiban solidarity and

You have no idea what your talking about, Najib was let go from soviet, he become like a dog without a owner so he realise and reached to Golbodin and also was welling to accept UN peace plan...to allow a transetion gov to hold which will then hold a election. The Karmalist function of Parchiam was against this plan, they wanted their party to have a saying in future gov, and this is why they wage a coup against Najib. For your information General Baba jan was just one of the top generals of Karamlist function, the rest..General Delwar--a Pashton from Kohistan--new Afghanistan ambassador to Ukraine, General Azami a Farsi speaking Pashton, General Momen a half Pashton and Olumee brothers Barkzia pashtons were all leading the coup against Najib. Even after Massod took Kabul, General Dewlar was continuing as commander of Garnezoon ee Markazee. You should read Genral Nabi Azami book….but then you need to live with yourself… you have to turn this into Farsi against pashton for your servitude of Pakistan…or how else you would suck the blood of afghans? As for as Pakistani support you should read how much they liked Massod...there are tons of books about this..go educate yourself.

Rabbani declared Afghanistan "Yak Kishawar-i-Farsi-Zaban", there was little option left to Pashtuns except to orgaize around any one they could to get a foothold in Kabul and reclaim their right as a majority.

Shakokoo jan aka Rabbani does not need to declare Afghanistan as " "Yak Kishawar-i-Farsi-Zaban" for Afghanistan and whole region were, are and well be "Yak Kishawar-i-Farsi-Zaban"! How could anyone deny this? What language a pashton speak when he meets a Uzbek? Or when a Baloch talks to a Pashton? Or Nooristani with a Turkmen and so on?

You Pashtons should know that envy and hatred against Dari is hatred and enmity with Pashto itself. When Ferdowisi said:

Base Rang Bordam Dar Ein Saal Si
Ajam (non-Arab) Zenda Kardam Badin Parsi

He declared what it says on the tin, that his language revived the language and culture of Non-Arabs, which includes Pashtons.

...I doubt Bayazid Roshan and others, including Khushal Khan Khattan, who poured the structure of Pashto literature would have been able to come up with the modern Pashto without the aid and guidance Farsi..

Dari would have been the lingua-franca and common language of Indian Sub-continent, had not been for British to cunningly remove Farsi and replace it with a makeshift language that is Urdu.

So, the real enemy of Farsi culture and language in the region are British and Russians and they still are, for only Dari can withstand any cultural attack of West.

And you are pretending as if Tajaks/Parsibanans were superpatriots and Pashtuns the ultimate traitors. This is far from reality. During the Afghan War, the most prominent Parsiban leadership, received practical and political backing from Pakistan. Rabbani, along with his Jammiath-i-Islami, was based in Peshawar. He even owned property in Peshawar granted to him by General Zia-ul-Haq (just ahead of new Peshawar Bus Stand right on the GT Road). Jummaith-i-Islami with backing from Pakistan grabbed the largest chunk of power in Kabul including the powerful defence ministery (in 1992). Not only did the Dari-Zaban milk Pakistan playing the Islamic brotherhood card, also after the War(1992), did its secular leadership tap every channel of support evoking sectarian empathy, ethnic kinship, and secular/commie connections. Consequently, Russia, Tajakistan, Uzbakistan, Iran, Turki, India, (even France) were some bases of support for Parsibanans against the Pashtun majority.

Your barking on the wrong door, if Pakistan had no plan to "Kabul must burn" they would have not unleashed their pashtons dog to destroy kabul... the fact of matter is Shakoko Rabbani and Massod both were genuinely ready for power sharing, they even allowed Golbodin when Pakistan unleashed their other dog Taliban to become priminster again...yes off course as legetimate government of Afghanistan...recognize by UN, Rabbani had full right o seek partnership with international community. Maybe as true successor of British you Cholaa Pakis think Kabul must care her international relationship true Pakistan ha? like those pervious amirs that were doing throw British raj?

On the contrary, the secular Pashtun leadership of Afghanistan got scattered and exiled thanks the mechanation of Punjabi-Mahajar Janta which couldn't tolerate secular Pashtun leaders in Afghanistan except Islamists for fear of potential Indian influence and revival of Pashtun nationalism. They had to contend with Taleban or other Pashtun Islamists because the total marginalization of Pashtuns from power in Kabul would have caused intense resentment in Pashtuns on the Pakistani side of the Durand Line. That was their compulsion to do so.

ahhaha what secular pashton leadership? you mean those double headed khans that were eating salt on one pot and then pissing on the same pat? like those Ghaffar khan and his grandson who today proudly claims that like German American, Anglo, American and Spanish America he is Afghan Pakistani...meaning he is Pakistani! What good did Afghanistan got from these secular two headed khan other then they milking Afghanistan, getting free education in our universities and then even badmouthing those afghan refugees and wanted to send them back.(just as Afsandaar wali had said few years ago in Peshawar.)

Last, contrary to your half-truths and grass misinterpretation of events concerning the role of some Pashtun army officers in Paki military or civil bureaucracy in the civil war in Afghanistan, such role wasn't aimed at and not motivated by any desire to destroy Afghanistan ( that is your own sinister/dishonest misrepresentation of facts to sow a seed of hatred in Pashtuns of Afghanistan against Pashtuns of Pakistan).

Excuse me but your either a fool or a god... seriously forget about that role was aimed or what it was not aimed... look at the end product...total destruction and ruin of afghan state, total control of afghanistan, a backward, ruin and subjected afghanistan under the name of Islam...which was actually run by Pashton ISI officers.

Such role PRIMARILY and FUNDAMENTALLY arose in response to the actions of Northen Alliance thugs who with active backing from Iran, Tajakistan, Russia, etc. had marched on Kabul and were hell bent to keep the Pashtun majority out and have re-seated Parsibabanans at positions of power. Just like you Tajaks got unwavering support from your ethnic and sectarian kin in Iran, Tajakistan, etc.in a bid to railroad the Pashtun majority, same did the Pashtuns do who received backing from their brethern in Pakistan

.
What Pashtons majority? Pashton were given their share of power in transition gov...the pashton representative Golbodin even accept and sign the shameful Peshawar accord...and yet under Pakistan design instead of build his cabinet and working to reconstruct the country he shot rockets... first under excuse of why Dostom militia were in Kabul...later he join hand with Dostom militia. As for as Iran, your dead wrong... Iran never favored the Parsiwaan until 1998 when Taliban killed Irani diplomats... in 94 Iran was actively supporting Hazara against Tajiks... i have footage of Irani militia captured by Massod forces...they did not look hazara and were speaking with Irani accent. General Azmai, now defense ministery spokesperson in his book states that when Taliban(actual foreigner forced with regular Pakistani officers) capture Heraat, Dr Abdullah who was in Heraat then had a state of art communication equipment that France given to Massod, he called Massod and said he will have to enter Iran, Massod reluctantly allow him but instructed Dr Abdullah to destroy the communication equipment and all the doc so it will not fall in hands of Iranis.
Even today, Iran is playing a double shameful game, on one hand they are saying they are with Karzia gov, on other hand they are secretly supporting Taliban

I have myself talked to many Pashtun army officers and they told me they had no other option except to support Taleban/Islamists in the face of Parsiban hegemony that was trying to surge in a most macabre way in Kabul. They also said, secular Pashtun leadership was neither avaibale nor in good currency with Punjabi-Mahajar junta that controlled Pakistan's foreign policy. Those were the dynamics of civil war that Pashtuns got caught in. They had very limited options.

I have a tv interview of General Babur where he says when he was serving Pakistan (he used to tell his Punjabi masters that he can make Pashtons of afghansitan dance in tune of Pakistan) he was actual supporting Afghanistan. He also says that those afghan artifact that he got from Kabul museum actual represent his forefathers..seriously you traitor Pakistani Pashtons must live with urself...someone you have to justify the destruction of afghan state... and what better way then to accuse those Parsibaan... specially when culture your so inferior to those Parsibaan...but then its a know fact that we never sold Afghanistan, we have safeguard Afghanistan against both soviets and Faqir and befarang paksitanis.

The northern allaince thugs should have realized from the very beginning that by taking Kabul with such nacked force and chauvinistically declaring Afghanistan a "Kishawar-i-Farsi Zaban" railroading the Pashtun majority, there could have been no better consequence than the strong reaction the Pashtuns showed whatever you name it, the Taleban movement, etc.

lol there was no NA alliance when kabul was given to Shori Nezar by Pashton Parchmai Generals. Here is a link about NA go educate yourself first then come and try to sound intelligent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Alliance

[parsiwaan]

Parsiban, lies would not do anyone good. No more the ridiculous propaganda. It is a fact that Russians were brought to Afghanistan by Babrak Karmal, an ethnic Tajak.

lol so now Karmal has become a Tajik? whats else you will lebel Shah Shuja, Hamid Gul, Babur, Akhtar Abdul Rahman, all those Pashton ISI officers, Mullah Omar and Hakimullah Massod as also Tajik? Karmal father was a General in kings army...how many Tajiks were made general back then?

Russians even through a well-devised strategy strengthened the ethnic minorities like Tajaks, Uzbaks, etc. for strategic (security shield against capatalistic/Islamic infuences) and demographic/political reasons (large Tajak, Uzbak populations in the erstwhile USSR). They deliberately weakened Pashtuns politically and physically by destroying their lands most mercilessly while signing deals with Masoud and other Tajaks and bringing them up the in military and civil administration disproportionately. The deal with Masoud was not just a tactical move. Actually, Russians wanted to build political "assets" in the north of Afghanistan (due to its geographical proximity with USSR) which they could later rely on and use. Later events corroborate that, as how Masoud and his Tajak entrouge got active backing from Ruskies.

Ruskies inked deal with Massod much later, and that all out of necessity for they needed Salang open and Massod being betrayed by Pakistanis and his man and commander getting killed by favorite ISI ho..Golbodin he had to inked a treaty with ruskies...but then that deal was broken when he attacked and sacked Farqiee Nahreen in 89.
From 92 to 94 Massod activly were supporting Islamist Tajikstanis against Ruskies and their stooge in Tajikistan, it was only when Pakistan activily got invovled in afghanistan..with Pakistani pashton in regular paksitani army were given "leave" and were send to inflame the war ina afghanistan...these pakistani pashtons were leading the war against Massod...not only them but frontier force and those brainwashed kids from Madrassa were unleashed by Pakistan. You should read some more about this from Ruskies and American sources. As for as soviet backing Tajiks, you forget those 10 billion dollars aid soviets given to you all two headed khans of NWFP... weren’t you guys enjoying the soviet money and backing in Kabul? In same time when soviets were killing your fallow pashtons and turning 6 million afghans into refugees(most of pashton for most of tajiks stayed and fought and never left their country like Massod, Ismail khan and Ustad Zabiullah.)

So much so that when Americans were invading Afghanistan in Oct 2002 and got advice from Russians on that togethor with their conditions for support, Russians insisted Kabul should be given to Parsibanans and Pashtuns should be left in the south. Obviously, that was politically to risky for Americans to accept.

Americans invaded Afghanistan in oct 2001 not 2002 and Kabul was already in hands of Shori Nezar(NA) even when American allow the Pakistani generals being airlifted to Pakistan when Kunduz was under siege, even when American openly ask NA to not enter kabul. The American and Saudi Arabia were actively supporting Pakistan’s design against Afghanistan...when Taliban captured kabul... General Babur gather, American, British, France and other ambassador and flow them to afghanistan... when American special envoy Richardson ..he later become new Mexico governor ..was meet Massod in Jabullsaraj he open told massod that he expect massod force to surrender to taliban any day now since not much of land is left for you.. when translator translated this...Massod took his Pakool off and throw it on table and told Richardson that if i have left with that much of land i will still defense Afghanistan' s independence and liberality against this open Pakistan aggression.

[parsiwaan]

Parsiwaan who said we invited Tajiks and uzbeks and parsiwaans to Pashtunkhwa you just came to our land because tajikistan and Iran rejected you and killed you in large numbers. We Afghans(Pashtuns)only invited our Afghan(Pashtun) brothers because its there land. A Pashtun from Afghanistan is always welcomed in Pashtunkhwa because we are brothers and its there land. They are treated equally just like anyone else. We Pashtuns are all ethnic AFGHANS. AND GELAMJAM was a word exclusively used for Parsiwaans and northern alliance no Pashtun of Afghanistan was ever called Gelamjaam. They were called respected Pashtuns of Afghanistan. Any Pashtun of Afghanistan is welcomed in Pashtunkhwa especially Swat. Mingora loves Afghans(Pashtuns)

Swati,
There is not many Parsiwaan in Pakistan anyways, most of those Farsi speakers are those pashtons that have lost their language...as for as brotherhood... your just making me laugh... in 90s i was working for UN and have been to almost all refugees camps in Peshawar ..Kacha Gari, Babo, Khorassan, Machani, Jalozia.. i have seen how you guys treat those afghans...pashton and non-pashton alike... there was even a fight when some of khan wanted the afghan refugees out so they can build something on land... i have seen how you people come and take children to work in brake making factories and pay then 50 cents a day. Or how you throw the belonging of an pashton afghan family on street in Denbabar colony when he couldn't pay one month of rant...the guy spend the whole week on street near that Naar.
The fact is you guys got fat rich by sucking the blood of afghans..pashton and non-pashton alike...from the smuglering money that you guys get when you bring goods under Afghanistan name and then sell it Pakistan, to carpet business to cheap labor, to easy foreign exchange...dollar send by afghans from west to their relatives. With you as brother who need a enemy?