References on Ahmad Shah Abdali and Zahir Shah

[Shayesta]

LOL yeah my father's grandfather came from Arghandab to work in Laghman. Then he bought land, held a position in the government for Laghman. My grandfather was born in Laghman, lived there and is even buried there. Though my great grandfather was sent back to Arghandab to get buried.

Interesting. I am not sure where from Kandahar we original are but next time when I go to Afghanistan, Inshahlah, then I will make sure I ask my grandmother. Thing I always found strange was that Tajik's from my looks used to guess I am a Panjsheri and Pukhtoons always used to guess I am a Kandahari, LOL. Though I haven't got any Kandahari feature whatsoever. *Cries*

I would like to know who you'd rather, Abdali or Zahir Shah, and why!

LOL, if an Afghan would have asked this question then he/she would have been worthy of a slap at least, haha! But since you don't know about these two personalities, Ahmad Shah Abdali is known as our Baba because he was the one founded Afghanistan and thanks to who Pukhtoons had experienced a very successful and beautiful empire. It's just sad his son wasn't as capable enough.........

[Darweshkhel]

Zahir Shah is known in Afghanistan as THE LAZY King ;-)

Ahmad Shah Baba is the grandfather of our nation.

[Darweshkhel]

part II

[Darweshkhel]

part III

[MazloomyarMaseed]

^We Pashtuns never accept foreign rule. never, never will.

That is why all 50 countries in Afghanistan are losing from Pashtuns.

Loosing from Pashtuns?

We are slaves of everybody

Why do you dream as if its 17th century kandahar???

We are bombed and killed and we kill our own people.

50 countries are not loosing anything. Well Pashtuns accepted Pakistani Rule a very long time ago.

[MazloomyarMaseed]

Ahmad Shah Baba is the founder of modern Afghanistan. He also worked on unifying Pashtun tribes. I am pretty sure 99.9% would choose Ahmad Shah Baba.

I dont think 99.9 percent of Pashtuns would choose him.

He is very well known in Pakhtunkhwa as a lover of Dari etc.

[Darweshkhel]

I dont think 99.9 percent of Pashtuns would choose him.

He is very well known in Pakhtunkhwa as a lover of Dari etc.

You must be confusing something Maseeda, its his son Timor Shah who spend his youth and was educated Herat. Timor Shah was not aware of Pashtunwali, he betrayed his own people and he threw his fathers great Empire into chaos.

Loy Ahmad Shah Baba was known as a great lover of Pashto literature and sciences. Unfortunately he did not have a chance to dedicate himself to peotry since he died very fast. And he loved Pashto poetry - I own the Diwan of Ahmad Shah Baba, it's a collection of 200 pages Pashto peotry written by the Loy Ahmad Baba compiled by the late Pohand Habibi. There is just one 2-page poem written in Dari called "Farsi Kalam" at the end. ;-)

[Gaia]

Hello, Kandahary and Pakistani, I will message you in your inbox if that’s ok to you. To all of the people that have been trying to help me, thank you bunches once again. It’s always great to confirm that one trace of the Pashtun character.

And because this place here really does feel like some sort of extended family, I feel obliged to tell you that I might disappear for some time. You guys stay fine and keep up with the great work.

[Gaia]

Thank you, Shlombay. But, unfortunatelly, I'm not sure about anything! I'd bug you, though, if you didn't have a problem with it!

[pukhtana]

I dont have a problem, I am Pukhtana.

[Roshina]

Hello you, people....

I’ve been looking pretty much everywhere for some good reference on both, Ahmad Shah Abdali and Zahir Shah. The Pashtun forums seem to be the best places to find these, for it saves me the time selecting prejudiced and superficial information (I can have those with the Ocidental roots).

So.... would anyone, please, point me a way to find good literature on them? Also: please, make it in English; Pashtu and Urdu illiterate here.

Thank you in advance.

So, I'm not yet very proud of my knowledge of Pashtun history, so when I see people like you studying about us, I feel ashamed of myself; I feel disgusted with myself! Thank you for making me realize what other things I need to work on, khor jaaney!

Before anything, though, welcome! Pa salo stargo darta pakhair waayam! (Umm... something like "Welcoming you with a hundred eyes"; you get the idea.) You're going to stick around here with us, and you're gonna ask us any questions you have not just to help yourself but to help those among us who take pride in being Pukhtuns ('cause, you see, we got the names of people like Ghani Baba engraved in the records of our Pukhtun history ) but don't know enough about our historical background. So, as we strive to help YOU, we'll be helping our illiterate souls as well.... I'm referring here specifically to myself, of course.

Now, what I normally do is use Google Books! It's very good, you see! Not all books are provided in full text, but some are; others aren't offered at all, but since you can search for key words / names, you at least come to know which sources deal with your topic. I'm gonna go through Google Books, then, and see what I find, k? I'll PM you for more information, in case the books aren't offered online AND you either don't have time to cover them or access to them; I'll get 'em from my school library then.

For Ahmad Shah Durrani:

Now, I'm looking at a book called Ahmad Shah Durrani: Father of Modern Afghanistan by Ganda Singh. Perhaps you've looked at it already, I don't know, but in case you haven't, it looks like something useful.

There's also An Oriental Biographical Dictionary: Founded on Materials Collected by the Late Thomas William Beale. Information on Ahmad Shah starts on page 29. Here's the link to an online version of the book: http://www.archive.org/stream/cu3192...44983_djvu.txt

(You'll notice that there are a couple of other Ahmad Shahs on the same page.)

Consider also India's Historic Battles: From Alexander the Great to Kargil by Kaushik Roy. Abdali appears on pages 6, 80 (start of chapter 5: "Abdali's Organ Pipes: The Third Battle of Panipat, 14 January, 1776"), and 188.

The Culcutta Review (Volume 56) by University of Calcutta is another source. Click it. Starts on page 1, "Ahmad Shah Abdali: The Last Muhammadan Invader of India."

Saviours of Islamic Spirit (Volume 4) by Abdulhasan Ali Nadvi and Mohiuddin Ahmad. Pages 225 and 228.

The Cambridge History of India discusses him on pages 416, 433, 438, 445, and 610. (There's another Cambridge History of India with focus on the Moghul Emprire. Look into that as well. Page 372.)

Ahmad Shah Abdali: A Profile by Ishtiaq Hussain Azhar (it's published by the Ahmad Shah Abdali Day Celebration Committee! I had no idea such a thing existed, yo!)

Conflict in Afghanistan: A Historical Encyclopedia by Frank Clements. Starting on page 79.

Sketches of Rulers of India by George Devereux Oswell and Sir William Wilson Hunter. Page 18 is where a discourse on Abdali begins, it seems.

The History of India from the Earliest Ages (volume 4, part 2) by James Talboys Wheeler. Page 410. The same author has another book called Early Records of British India in which discussions on Abdali begin on page 210.

The Muslim World (Issues 1-12) by World Muslim Conferences. Page 48 is where it begins: "Ahmad Shah Abdali: Father of Afghans."

Okay, so there are many more. Keep in mind that I haven't read these books; I'm going by what Google Books tells me! If I had, I'd tell you exactly what you were looking for, but unfortunately, I can't.

Lemme know if this helps, k? And gimme a minute now for Zahir Shah.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

BLS... THAT's a nickname!

English. Or French. Italian too. Maybe German. No Pashtu or Urdu :D Sorry, I'm an illiterate!

And waiting now. Thanks in advance.

loll what is wrong with BLS? :p

I don't know about french or italian. However, I can get you information on Pashtuns from a variety of English sources. They may not concentrate solely on Ahmad Shah Baba though. Off the top of my head, read

The Pathans by Olaf Caroe
The Afghans (2002) By Willem Vogelsang

http://books.google.ca/books?id=-2TH8UYeAaoC&printsec=frontcover&dq=The+rise+of+the+Indo-Afghan+empire&source=bl&ots=Q22bVafJ0Q&sig=ZlJET0dNr9TdsMAKU5NKUKSgZSg&hl=en&ei=lD8ETM_kKI_SNaDC-PQN&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CB8Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://www.amazon.com/History-Afghanistan-Greenwood-Histories-Nations/dp/0313337985/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1275346959&sr=1-10

http://www.amazon.com/Modern-Afghanistan-History-Struggle-Survival/dp/1845113160/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1275346959&sr=1-4

http://www.amazon.com/Afghanistan-Cultural-Political-Princeton-Politics/dp/0691145687/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1275346959&sr=1-7

^^again I have not read all of them, but they may be a helpful resource.

[Gaia]

Hello,Qrratugai,thank you so much for the references.* As I've told you,I've looked for many of those books already but the really valuable ones (i.e.,**the autobiography and the profile) are out of print and/or unavailable. The one copy of Ahmad Shah by Ahmad Shah I found has an impeditive price. The references are enlightining though.

And you, dear BLS.... what's wrong with BLS? Nothing. At all. Just that I fulfilled the spaces and, being me... It's just that it's difficult to memorize. I never know which alphabets to call you by. I've got the "History of Struggle and Survival" one and have seen the others you pointed, look like good side referencing. Thank you.


*Not sure whether I should use space after period or not...
** Comma and period, space or not space: That is the question!

[Gaia]

And since we're all here.... what you guys think of Mirza Ali Khan? Feelings, thoughts... I'm all ears.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

And since we're all here.... what you guys think of Mirza Ali Khan? Feelings, thoughts... I'm all ears.

Faqir i ipi was a great Pashtun religious figure and freedom fighter. Till his death he gave Pakistani forces and British a run for their money. He was also a very shrewd man, who used the Islam bibi case to further his cause against the brits.