Marriage to non-Pashtuns

[tor_khan]

Tor Khan, would you allow your Pashtun women to marry a Black African and consider it good just to look good?

I wish it was a simple as "allowing"/"not allowing". But you want to know a story of an Black African Pashtoon? Read here.

Some people marry for practical reasons - to get a visa, to pay a debt, so that orphaned children get a replacement parent etc. The rules for marriage for me were different, there was nothing to stop my (arranged) marriage, which was set up by our families. But these days it's about first time sweethearts and choice is the choice word. We might consider this going against the rules and "allowing" as you say, but apart from some of the more sickly aspects of living in a culture of Laila-Majnun revival what in fact has changed since humans first walked the earth? All cultures have their stories of love forlorn/clandestine meetings etc. Sometimes Pashtoons cross the boundaries between tribes, families, cultures. At which point do I stand in judgement??

Sure there are cultural/religious/linguistic boundaries - but people are headstrong and in reality, da zra sara sa waku??

Ghani Khan famed Pashto poet, son of Bacha Khan who was jailed by Pakistan for his pro-Pashtoon politics, was himself married to a Parsee. Famously he wrote:

"Pashtun is not merely a race but, in fact, a state of mind; there is a Pashtun lying inside every man, who at times wakes up and overpowers him."

Ghairat, Pashtoonwali, Pashtooniyat is much, much more than a firing of an AK47 and certainly ghairat doesn't stem from a fear of Uzbeks and Africans that is a kind of an abnormal reversal of machoiism. Ghani Khan, a poet, a drund Pashtoon, a humanitarian promoter of peace and a patron of our beautiful language is a fine example.

[Muslimah]

"Pashtun is not merely a race but, in fact, a state of mind; there is a Pashtun lying inside every man, who at times wakes up and overpowers him."

BEAUTIFUL! Mashallah!

[Shayesta]

@Maseed
I know that your entire point was that even in Islam it's said it's not a problem to marry your own kind so that you both stay at same level, and I know that some people here take you out of context by saying that you think that Pukhtoons are superior, while all you were trying to say is that you don't support Pukhtoons marrying others whatsoever. But the way you are arguing gives people the feeling to push you even harder and to make the situation even more confusing, get my point? Just give it a rest and do avoid calling people Indian lovers, Western lovers, etcetera because just like how you think it's wrong for inter-racial marriages, exactly same-wise another Pukhtoon doesn't like being judged for something very baseless.

And about how Pukhtoons lose their culture to Tajiks, I completely agree. I know of Pukhtoon men who married Tajiks because they wanted an 'open minded' woman, as in a woman who wears short clothes, has no problem talking to guys, etcetera. I really feel disgusted seeing such men and with one of them I put him on check and for first time in my life I didn't regret being rude towards someone who is older than me! But if any Pukhtoon can promise he/she is gonna teach his/her children Pukhto and Pukhtunwali, then what's the problem? Just like how newly convert Muslims love Islam much more than those who were born Muslims, exactly same-wise someone who newly adapted Pukhtoon culture loves Pukhtoons much more than those who were born Pukhtoons. And besides, such a thing as 'pure Pukhtoon' hardly exists anyway. You will find Pukhtoons who look complete Russians, you will find Pukhtoons looking complete Chinese and you will find Pukhtoons look like complete Punjabi's. How you gonna decide who is 'pure Pukhtoon' and base your 'respect' relying on their race?

[MazloomyarMaseed]

@Maseed
I know that your entire point was that even in Islam it's said it's not a problem to marry your own kind so that you both stay at same level, and I know that some people here take you out of context by saying that you think that Pukhtoons are superior, while all you were trying to say is that you don't support Pukhtoons marrying others whatsoever. But the way you are arguing gives people the feeling to push you even harder and to make the situation even more confusing, get my point? Just give it a rest and do avoid calling people Indian lovers, Western lovers, etcetera because just like how you think it's wrong for inter-racial marriages, exactly same-wise another Pukhtoon doesn't like being judge for something very baseless.

And about how Pukhtoons lose their culture to Tajiks, I completely agree. I know of Pukhtoon who married Tajiks he wanted an 'open minded' woman, as in a woman who wears short clothes, has no problem talking to guys, etcetera. I really feel disgusted seeing such men and with one of them I put him on check and for first time in my life I didn't regret being rude towards someone who is older than me! But if any Pukhtoon can promise he/she is gonna teach his/her children Pukhto and Pukhtunwali, then what's the problem? Just like how newly convert Muslims love Islam much more than those who were born Muslims, exactly same-wise someone who newly adapted Pukhtoon culture loves Pukhtoons much more than those who were born Pukhtoons. And besides, such a thing as 'pure Pukhtoon' hardly exists anyway. You will find Pukhtoons who look complete Russians, you will find Pukhtoons looking complete Chinese and you will find Pukhtoons look like complete Punjabi's. How you gonna decide who is 'pure Pukhtoon' and base your 'respect' relying on their race?

Thank you very much sister, atleast you understand what I am saying.

I am not basing my judgements on colour of skin, as you will find Pashtuns of many colours, I just want to unite my people and develop a strong bond together through marriage and tribal unity.

A good example is that a Pashtun would marry a Russian woman in the 70's to show how strong communist he was, same with those Jamiets type who marry with Arabs, to show how strong Muslim they are.

I oppose inter marriage, because it brings nothing but outside influence on our already fragile people and region.

Regards

[MazloomyarMaseed]

BEAUTIFUL! Mashallah!

So the european wants to say Pashtuns are not a race eh!

[MazloomyarMaseed]

I wish it was a simple as "allowing"/"not allowing". But you want to know a story of an Black African Pashtoon? Read here.

Some people marry for practical reasons - to get a visa, to pay a debt, so that orphaned children get a replacement parent etc. The rules for marriage for me were different, there was nothing to stop my (arranged) marriage, which was set up by our families. But these days it's about first time sweethearts and choice is the choice word. We might consider this going against the rules and "allowing" as you say, but apart from some of the more sickly aspects of living in a culture of Laila-Majnun revival what in fact has changed since humans first walked the earth? All cultures have their stories of love forlorn/clandestine meetings etc. Sometimes Pashtoons cross the boundaries between tribes, families, cultures. At which point do I stand in judgement??

Sure there are cultural/religious/linguistic boundaries - but people are headstrong and in reality, da zra sara sa waku??

Ghani Khan famed Pashto poet, son of Bacha Khan who was jailed by Pakistan for his pro-Pashtoon politics, was himself married to a Parsee. Famously he wrote:

"Pashtun is not merely a race but, in fact, a state of mind; there is a Pashtun lying inside every man, who at times wakes up and overpowers him."

Ghairat, Pashtoonwali, Pashtooniyat is much, much more than a firing of an AK47 and certainly ghairat doesn't stem from a fear of Uzbeks and Africans that is a kind of an abnormal reversal of machoiism. Ghani Khan, a poet, a drund Pashtoon, a humanitarian promoter of peace and a patron of our beautiful language is a fine example.

Out of all the people you bring up Ghani Khan and Bacha Khan, the alcoholic and the Indian lover.

Let me make this clear, he said that due to his blindless of love for a Non Pashtun, in a way, he is trying to say Pashtuns are not a establish race of people, which is wrong, pashtuns are a established race of people, and these Bacha Khan followers, the same followers, who adapted a Hindu as their role model, are the representatives of Pashtuns?

You to say, Pashtuns are not a well establish race of people, is actually in a way going against Pashtun unity itself, These Bacha Khan boys, are only loved in a few areas, nobody in the tribal areas even considers them as fellow Pashtuns, that is why they were booted out of the tribal areas with Nehru.

The same people who speak of Pashtuns, are the same ones who bow down to Pakistan, and distance themselves from real Pashtunwali and follow Mainstream Pakistani culture.

It is hipocritical of him to insult Pashtuns and marry a Parsiii, you cant lead pashtuns, when your not mingled with Pashtuns, For example, Look at Ahemd Shahs son, what did he do to Pashtuns? he sold them out for Dari Zubans, these ghanis and bachas and asfandyars, are all on the same ship of being traitors.

Regards.

[Shayesta]

^ But what if their partners do find themselves in our culture? I for example felt insulted when you said you can't respect Pukhtoons who sell their daughters to non-Pukhtoons and nor can I respect Pukhtana's for actually marrying them. But since my both grandmother's aren't Pukhtana's, I am raised with the thinking all people in Afghanistan are same and despite half of my family being Tajik they all speak Pukhto as their first language. Ever since I met my in-laws all the men in my in-laws started to communicate in Pukhto when I was around and one of my sisters-in-law even joked, 'Do you realise that thanks to you all our men are getting Pukhtunized?' Whoever has married into our family has adapted our culture and our language instead because they don't consider Pukhtoons to be different than them, now should women in my family be ashamed of themselves for marrying Tajik's even though those Tajik's have turned into complete Pukhtoons?

And about those Pukhtoons who lose their culture instead, I have always believed that if a Pukhtoon can't maintain his language then he doesn't deserve to be called a Pukhtoon and therefore we are much better off without such people and such people are the reason why Pukhtoons are suffering. Don't you think it's good that those people just screw off to the Tajik culture forever and never turn back?

[MazloomyarMaseed]

^ But what if their partners do find themselves in our culture? I for example felt insulted when you said you can't respect Pukhtoons who sell their daughters to non-Pukhtoons and nor can I respect Pukhtana's for actually marrying them. But since my both grandmother's aren't Pukhtana's, I am raised with the thinking all people in Afghanistan are same and despite half of my family being Tajik they all speak Pukhto as their first language. Ever since I met my in-laws all the men in my in-laws started to communicate in Pukhto when I was around and one of my sisters-in-law even joked, 'Do you realise that thanks to you all our men are getting Pukhtunized?' Whoever has married into our family has adapted our culture and our language instead because they don't consider Pukhtoons to be different than them, now should women in my family be ashamed of themselves for marrying Tajik's even though those Tajik's have turned into complete Pukhtoons?

And about those Pukhtoons who lose their culture instead, I have always believed that if a Pukhtoon can't maintain his language then he doesn't deserve to be called a Pukhtoon and therefore we are much better off without such people and such people are the reason why Pukhtoons are suffering. Don't you think it's good that those people just screw off to the Tajik culture forever and never turn back?

I accept, that at present, there are many pashtuns with married tajiks etc, i can not oppose this, iam speaking of present, this day and age, One of my very dearest brother and member of this forum is half pashtun and half tajik, i never judge him on his heritage, but he works for pashtun unity etc, Iam speaking of thsoe who promote it,glorify it at present,and encourage it at present. Inter marriage is a obstacle to our unity, You cant have Africans leading our nation can you? Nor can a European lead our nation, our culture and heritage is passed onto blood and through our bloodlines. That doesnt mean we conquer and make others our subjects and slaves and show how strong we pashtusn are over other races, i support isolation and unified productivity within our pashtun people.

[Muslimah]

So the european wants to say Pashtuns are not a race eh!

Im not European. LOL
Not even close!

[Muslimah]

im sorry i like your culture - im guilty of that. If you dont like it...dont read my posts. You are seriously spending WAYY to much time obsessing over my life...find something better to do with your time.

[Master Khan]

Wow alot of racism going on here.
If you don't like Black people then keep that to yourself.

[Muslimah]

im not black either...
dont hate on me either! Or Master Khan will straighten you out! :P

[MazloomyarMaseed]

Muslimah has a thing for Pashtuns, nothing wrong with that.

Iam sure there are many good looking lebenese men for her to choose, Why Pashtuns? Why cant the world leave us alone, we are not a breeding or mating ground.

[Muslimah]

lol
fine - you're all a bunch of baboons who smell bad and have big noses. I hate Pashtun's....is that better?

geesh---some of you don't know how to take a compliment!

Most of the world thinks your kind is awful and wants to blow up the rest of the world. There are people like me however, who are more educated, and see the beauty in your culture! Don't get defensive and upset that someone compliments you! :P

[Muslimah]

Iam sure there are many good looking lebenese men for her to choose, Why Pashtuns? Why cant the world leave us alone, we are not a breeding or mating ground.

First of all,
I am not "the world"...i am one person. I am also not considering your culture as a "breeding ground" lmao...
Second, Why would I just be looking for a "good looking guy"? I am not superficial - nor am I a moron. Looks mean nothing to me.
Pashtuns (well clearly not all .. you've helped change my mind) are very kind, respectful, religious, hospitable, well-mannered, positive and adoring people. Maybe this doesn't represent EVERYONE. But probably 1990 members on this forum atleast!
Don't take offense to an outsider saying you guys are great. Just say thank you and keep your hatred and racism to yourself. If you don't like what I say...keep in mind others like to take the compliment.