Problem with Islam?

[Manzareh]

Roshina - as being a moderator its hilarious when you ignore when i said "IF WHAT HE SAYS IS TRUE" seems you have a guilty conscience..i received a private message from a moderator so for that sake i wont humilate you and your evil kafaar friends.

M16 - Can you please take some prozac and calm down, somehow you relate every singe topic and post "Taliban ISI Saudi Wahabi" its getting really boring now, i mean doesnt anything else happen in your life, your realy obsessed to a level that i feel sorry for you + pissed off that you just relate everytopic to ISI this and bullcrap that in every single thread.

[Toramana]

Roshina - as being a moderator its hilarious when you ignore when i said "IF WHAT HE SAYS IS TRUE" seems you have a guilty conscience..i received a private message from a moderator so for that sake i wont humilate you and your evil kafaar friends.

M16 - Can you please take some prozac and calm down, somehow you relate every singe topic and post "Taliban ISI Saudi Wahabi" its getting really boring now, i mean doesnt anything else happen in your life, your realy obsessed to a level that i feel sorry for you + pissed off that you just relate everytopic to ISI this and bullcrap that in every single thread.

@Manzery

Man, calm down. You want to crucify others with views other than yours but this is an open forum for all types of discussion. You should understand this point.

@MeemWowNoon

You are not even a Muslim. How come you speak for that religion?

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

How low do you want to stoop?

[Manzareh]

@Manzery

Man, calm down. You want to crucify others with views other than yours but this is an open forum for all types of discussion. You should understand this point.

@MeemWowNoon

You are not even a Muslim. How come you speak for that religion?

The same as you wish to crucify others with views other than yours, take a look at yourself..your one of the most one sided people here. its an open forum for all types of discussion so im entitled to give my views, which is what i am doing. i just dont respect certain people in here which is why naturally my tone changes in regards to who im speaking with.

and your not a muslim, so who are you to say who is and who is not..a little hypocritical dont you think.

[Toramana]

How low do you want to stoop?

Man come on. I have nothing against you and have no objection to you being a Muslim( I even don't care whether you are a Muslim or not as long as you are a proper rational human being) but the people e.g. Manzeray, Shahsawa Khurassani, etc. whom you want to speak for don't consider you a Muslim.

Now how can you deny the above?

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Man come on. I have nothing against you and have no objection to you being a Muslim( I even don't care whether you are a Muslim or not as long as you are a proper rational human being) but the people e.g. Manzeray, Shahsawa Khurassani, etc. whom you want to speak for don't consider you a Muslim.

Now how can you deny the above?

My love for Islam and Muslims trancend their view of me. We speak of unity, the only way to achieve it is to take a bullet for each other and then resolve our issues when the enemy has left.

I love ALL of my Muslim brothers and sisters, no matter how much they hate me, no matter how much they think I am a hypocrite, no matter how much they consider me a kafir. End of the day we all believe in Allah, and the Prophet (saw), no matter under what definition.

Yes, I will disagree with some opinions and present my case, but when push comes to shove, I rather my blood be shed for my family then to see them suffer at the hands of the enemy.

[Toramana]

The same as you wish to crucify others with views other than yours, take a look at yourself..your one of the most one sided people here. its an open forum for all types of discussion so im entitled to give my views, which is what i am doing. i just dont respect certain people in here which is why naturally my tone changes in regards to who im speaking with.

and your not a muslim, so who are you to say who is and who is not..a little hypocritical dont you think.

It isn't a bad thing to be single sided .... It is really a bad thing when you start strangualting free thought in the name of santity of your skewed view of religion.

[Roshina]

Roshina - as being a moderator its hilarious when you ignore when i said "IF WHAT HE SAYS IS TRUE" seems you have a guilty conscience..i received a private message from a moderator so for that sake i wont humilate you and your evil kafaar friends.

Dearest brother,
Don't flatter yourself -- you lack the ability to humiliate me, as does anyone else who thinks they posses the power to humiliate an individual who takes pity on people who are here only because they believe they're right and others are wrong and that it's their obligation to right the people who're wrong.

Besides, if you're gonna hesitate before "humiliating" another person just because a moderator prevented you from doing so, what does that say about YOU as a person and as a Muslim and as a Pashtun? Like, seriously? Toba.

Oh, and in my post in response to you, I also emphasized that *if you're gonna even THINK that Sangar's assumption is correct,* then you should read what others write before falling prey to such immature and baseless assumptions. Now, what you COULD have done is actually verified Sangar's claim using your own abilities to read and comprehend and you then wouldn't have had to say "IFFF what Sangar has said is correct," don't you think, wror gula?

Peace.

[Baygham]

The same as you wish to crucify others with views other than yours, take a look at yourself..your one of the most one sided people here. its an open forum for all types of discussion so im entitled to give my views, which is what i am doing. i just dont respect certain people in here which is why naturally my tone changes in regards to who im speaking with.

and your not a muslim, so who are you to say who is and who is not..a little hypocritical dont you think.

Toramana is not being hypocritical, he is merely narrating what is part of the muslim belief in saudia, pakistan, al-azar, deoband, taliban, the iranian shia hierarchy, the tableeghis, ahli-hadith, ahli-sunnath, wahabis,(and from the looks of it, I bet it is your belief too) all agree on one thing, i.e. Qadiani's are not muslims.

This is not a secular principal or one derived from stalin, george w. Bush, Gordon Brown or Obama, or for that matter the Isreali state, These people dont give a damn whether Ghulam Qadiyan is full muslim or an octaroon (1/8th).

So in short there is nothing hypocritical about what Toramana said. The above mentioned muslims have routinely considered the Qadianis as second hand citizens, (cant vote for muslim candidates in pakistan, or go to hajj in saudia per the saudia government)

On the other hand Toramana has openly stated that he has no problem with having a full citizen status for Qadianis (vote for any candidate in pakistan, and go to hajj in saudia), but is astonished how being considered second class citizen is more appealing to the intoxicated MWMN that he cannot differentiate friend from foe.

[Roshina]

Don't you have anything else to do? Like admiring women who do not remove the hair from their body?

I fully respect women who don't shave - yes, absolutely. How NOT to admire them for refusing to shave just to please society and men who think they're unattractive with hair? (And you prove my point here yet again, Sangara!)

But your point, if you have any, is ...?

And we can continue talking about that in another thread, if you got some deep thoughts to share with me on this.

[Toramana]

Baygham, well said. For us, all Muslims with the diversity traditional, orthodox, liberal, secular, moderate, etc. are a part of the broader Muslim culture and identity as long as they learn to co-exist with each other and resolve their differences rationally. But if left to the choice of these radical Islamists, Qadianis would be the first to be cut to pieces and reduced to third-class citizenship status...Then Barlevi and Salafis/Wahabis will be at each other throats...and what about Shias and Sunnis?

The fact is only secularism can maintain the cultural and civilizational unity of Muslims.

[unknownprince]

You know whats really annoying, people who think they are so smart, and that everything they say is the truth which they back by science and 'rational thought' -this is called white noise!!!

[unknownprince]

Islamic sects can only exist if there is secularism. Look in the USA all the Islamic sects exist peacefully. We already have proof.

Freedom is also a form of mental slavery. People enjoy so much freedom that they become lazy and don't care to question their government anymore. They say ignorance is bliss, but is it??

[Toramana]

Freedom is also a form of mental slavery. People enjoy so much freedom that they become lazy and don't care to question their government anymore. They say ignorance is bliss, but is it??

Freedom is not slavery...that is diabolical to say...Freedom is rather the highest form of dignity and opportunity one can attain...opportunity to ponder over, to investigate, to express, to question, to challenge, etc...opportunity for self-realization, and the list goes on.

Those people are rather slaves whose minds are chained by dogma and who cannot think beyond certain limits put by one of the most ignorant creatures of the society i.e. mullahs.

[unknownprince]

Freedom is not slavery...that is diabolical to say...Freedom is rather the highest form of dignity and opportunity one can attain...opportunity to ponder over, to investigate, to express, to question, to challenge, etc...opportunity for self-realization, and the list goes on.

Those people are rather slaves whose minds are chained by dogma and who cannot think beyond certain limits put by one of the most ignorant creatures of the society i.e. mullahs.

Im talking about the western notion of freedom. Now that is mental slavery!!!

The problem you have had is you met one or two Mullahs, and you based your whole opinion of Islam on those encounters!!!I do pity you!!