Is fasting obligatory in Ramadan?

[DaZahroJaam.]

astaghfirullah.

[کیش]

So like i said, you Miss. Lema are not bad.

I am either the truth or falsehood. best of heaven or worse of hell.

[DaZahroJaam.]

Read this and then remind yourself that you are 28 and not 14.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_fable

So long, sucker.

[Brown Skinned Savage]

Fasting) for a fixed number of days, but if any of you is ill or on a journey, the same number (should be made up) from other days. And as for those who can fast with difficulty, they have (a choice either to fast or) to feed a poor person (for every day). But whoever does good of his own accord, it is better for him. And that you fast, it is better for you if only you know." (2:183-84)

The part you highlighted is referring back to the previous statement of those who have valid difficulties, it is supplementing the previous sentence. Clearly not "any" difficulty or fasting wouldn't be suggested at all because fasting is fundamentally difficult.

[Badlun]

The part you highlighted is referring back to the previous statement of those who have valid difficulties, it is supplementing the previous sentence. Clearly not "any" difficulty or fasting wouldn't be suggested at all because fasting is fundamentally difficult.

I do not understand if already journey and health issues are discussed then what is the need of writing an AND and then talking of other difficulties. I think God being a rational being has given a choice to observe fast or feed poor. Its a blank check.

However thanks for your to the point reply.

[HalloIsBack]

what does a tafsir say about this one sentence?

[کیش]

Read this and then remind yourself that you are 28 and not 14.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_fable

So long, sucker.

Let me break it down

They are two types of people: those who risk the next life for this one, And those who risk this life for the this. Simple

I don't want that. I won't the best of the best of the hereafter, and that is Jannah Al-Firdous. The nearest a human can be to the lord. Whatever i have to do in this world, i will and have done to the best of my abilities. If it is what i said last night then i will do it for my lord.

I'll risk getting tossed in the worst part of hell for a chance to be the best/with the best. Whatever it takes

[Brown Skinned Savage]

I do not understand if already journey and health issues are discussed then what is the need of writing an AND and then talking of other difficulties. I think God being a rational being has given a choice to observe fast or feed poor. Its a blank check.

However thanks for your to the point reply.

Let me explain further what I mean: The part of the verse you quote in Arabic is

وَعَلَى الَّذِينَ يُطِيقُونَهُ فِدْيَةٌ طَعَامُ مِسْكِينٍ ۖ


Here the word used is يُطِيقُونَهُ Which means "They are afraid of it", in this context "Ha" at the end is in reference to the Situation mentioned previously since that would be the only possible reference in the Grammatical case.

It's funny that we're discussing this because this is exactly WHY we need to study the Qur'an in Arabic; because Translations often have problems conveying Important details like this because it would not Process the same in the translated language. But that's another topic. I just wanted to highlight this.

[Khostai]

[MENTION=4505]Khostai[/MENTION], good to see you having some common sense.

I always have good common sence yo

[Badlun]

Let me explain further what I mean: The part of the verse you quote in Arabic is

وَعَلَى الَّذِينَ يُطِيقُونَهُ فِدْيَةٌ طَعَامُ مِسْكِينٍ ۖ


Here the word used is يُطِيقُونَهُ Which means "They are afraid of it", in this context "Ha" at the end is in reference to the Situation mentioned previously since that would be the only possible reference in the Grammatical case.

It's funny that we're discussing this because this is exactly WHY we need to study the Qur'an in Arabic; because Translations often have problems conveying Important details like this because it would not Process the same in the translated language. But that's another topic. I just wanted to highlight this.

I am reading further on this subject and have found the following exegesis which explains that there are other difficulties also included besides journey and illness.

Fasting and Ramadhan

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آَمَنُوا كُتِبَ عَلَيْكُمُ الصِّيَامُ كَمَا كُتِبَ عَلَى الَّذِينَ مِنْ قَبْلِكُمْ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَتَّقُونَ ‡
أَيَّامًا مَعْدُودَاتٍ فَمَنْ كَانَ مِنْكُمْ مَرِيضًا أَوْ عَلَى سَفَرٍ فَعِدَّةٌ مِنْ أَيَّامٍ أُخَرَ وَعَلَى الَّذِينَ يُطِيقُونَهُ فِدْيَةٌ طَعَامُ مِسْكِينٍ فَمَنْ تَطَوَّعَ خَيْرًا فَهُوَ خَيْرٌ لَهُ وَأَنْ تَصُومُوا خَيْرٌ لَكُمْ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ تَعْلَمُونَ ‡
شَهْرُ رَمَضَانَ الَّذِي أُنْزِلَ فِيهِ الْقُرْآَنُ هُدًى لِلنَّاسِ وَبَيِّنَاتٍ مِنَ الْهُدَى وَالْفُرْقَانِ فَمَنْ شَهِدَ مِنْكُمُ الشَّهْرَ فَلْيَصُمْهُ وَمَنْ كَانَ مَرِيضًا أَوْ عَلَى سَفَرٍ فَعِدَّةٌ مِنْ أَيَّامٍ أُخَرَ يُرِيدُ اللَّهُ بِكُمُ الْيُسْرَ وَلَا يُرِيدُ بِكُمُ الْعُسْرَ وَلِتُكْمِلُوا الْعِدَّةَ وَلِتُكَبِّرُوا اللَّهَ عَلَى مَا هَدَاكُمْ وَلَعَلَّكُمْ تَشْكُرُونَ ‡

O you who believe! Fasting is prescribed for you, as it was prescribed for those before you, so
that you may guard (against evil).

(Fasting is) for a fixed number of days; and if any of you is ill, or on a journey, the prescribed
number (Should be made up) from days later, and for those (who miss the fast for illness or travel) who are able to do it, is a ransom of
feeding one that is indigent. But he that will give more, of his own free will, it is better for him.
And it is better for you that you fast, if you only knew.


Exception(s)

If you are on a journey or you are sick then you can make up any missed days later.
◦ Further to this, if you are able or can afford it, is the feeding of a poor person (and more if you can). This act is a ransom to be paid, if you can, for missing days in ramadhan, even if you make the days up at a later point.

It has been considered that this ransom is for one who finds it difficult to fast, and so does not and feeds people instead. But the word يُطِيقُونَهُ is really more easily understood as ‘having the ability to’… and so does not comfortably fit such an understanding… Further to this, verses 184 and 185 reiterate their contents, and in 185, no mention is made of feeding someone in the context either of missed days due to difficulty in fasting or due to missed days from illness or travel. If we understood that there was a third category mentioned in 2:184, then it would have also existed in 2:185.

However, the reality is that there are circumstances beyond illness or travel that may indicate that we can miss days and make them up. If we consider the two cases mentioned by Allah in the verse, illness and travel, we can derive further understanding.

Illness: This implies that you physically are incapable of fasting on one or more days. In the case that your illness is perpetual, then no making up of the days exists, however feeding the poor if you can remains. This implies that in the circumstance that it could be deemed physically damaging or just unduly taxing due to an illness to fast, then we can make use of the allowance. To be noted, this category appears to deal with challenges to fasting rooted in your own body.

Travel: This implies that if fasting acts to make a routine/normal job/task/circumstance dangerous/impractical or unduly difficult, then we can make use of the allowance. To be noted, this category appears to deal with challenges to fasting rooted in your environment and/or circumstances.

We have therefore in these two categories enough leeway to deal with any circumstance which may make fasting a trial and an undue challenge, rather than a means to God consciousness.

[Brown Skinned Savage]

However, the reality is that there are circumstances beyond illness or travel that may indicate that we can miss days and make them up. If we consider the two cases mentioned by Allah in the verse, illness and travel, we can derive further understanding.

.

Well First of all, This is not your writing, So you should cite the source.

Secondly, the author of the commentary is saying in Real Life there are other difficulties that arise, and it's possible that SOME people can fast during those extreme difficulties but it is at a point where it is barely feasible for them. This does not imply that this verse itself refers to those difficulties or that the verse "gives you an option" As you were suggesting.

The author of your commentary means there COULD be other difficulties where this Dispensation could apply. This is completely different than What you were suggesting, that Fasting is an option at A Person's discretion.

The Qur'an verse is only saying as stated before that ONLY in the cases of these special difficulties can you compensate in these other ways. NOT giving you the "option".

[Badlun]

http://www.detailedquran.com/quran_data/Fasting%20in%20the%20Quran.htm

Sorry forgot to give the above link.
If you have the possibility of having more difficulties to observe fast,then it is a clear option to keep fast or to feed poor. If you can fast without any difficulty then go for it, if face some difficulty, you have the other option. God is merciful and make your life easy.

[Badlun]

http://m.qtafsir.com/Surah-Al-Baqara/The-various-Stages-of-Fasting

Here it is vert clear that those who wish to fast,can fast,those who do not wish can feed a poor. I do not believe that any verse of Quran can be abrogated.

[Brown Skinned Savage]

http://m.qtafsir.com/Surah-Al-Baqara...ges-of-Fasting
Here it is vert clear that those who wish to fast,can fast,those who do not wish can feed a poor. I do not believe that any verse of Quran can be abrogated.

Nope, it's not saying that here either. It's quoting a hadith that "In the beginning" bWhich means it changed when Fasting became formally applied in the Qur'an.

The Tafsir goes on to say ......"...those who can fast with difficulty, (e.g., an old man"


This conforms with what is being said before, extreme difficulty, meaning it causes some health difficulty like for an Old Man., although the Old an is not technically sick, because generally the elderly have poorer health it could become a problem.

[Brown Skinned Savage]

http://www.detailedquran.com/quran_d...he%20Quran.htm
Sorry forgot to give the above link.
If you have the possibility of having more difficulties to observe fast,then it is a clear option to keep fast or to feed poor. If you can fast without any difficulty then go for it, if face some difficulty, you have the other option. God is merciful and make your life easy.

That's not true, because the possibility doesn't mean there are many possibilities and also it also doesn't mean it's always a probability, so the possibility would not always be likely to happen, therefore it's not an option in general.

Fasting has some difficulty, That's actually one of the purposes of fasting, otherwise what sacrifice would there be if it was completely easy? The Verse here is talking about EXTREME difficulties where it can injure you Not just ANY difficulty. That's why the grammar of the verse is "yettaqanoohiu" and not "yetaqooon kull shay"

If the verse said the later then your argument would be valid But Using Arabic structure would disprove your argument.