Stoning to Death

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Stoning is barbaric. It is a horrific spectacle. It has no place in true humanity

Well, the Prophet Muhammad had people stoned. What say you?
Also, does the death of Cameron Todd Willingham by lethal injection have a "place" in humanity?

[MostafaM]

You are wrong, and I can give you primary evidence from non Muslim sources with DIRECT VISUALIZATION from the field of battle. Here is the stunning and only frontline embedded documentary done by Paul Refsdal called Behind the Masks. Note his commentary at exactly 12 minutes 22 seconds into the video:

"The Afghan rebels 25 years ago had everything of weaponry. The Taliban, not so, have few weapons and very little ammunition."

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=5e5_1283088242

The reason why Niazi thanks your post... is that both you, he, and the elites here are attempting to legitimize the murder of the common people who have joined this movement... all because you privately want power and know you cannot sustain it without the support of the superpower juggernaut. Your parents ran away and left their people to fight the Russians and have lost their right to lead or play any role in the new Afghanistan.

Your goal is to make the false connection between every aspect of the movement and Pakistan, the Arab states, and pretty much anyone that you can utilize as a scapegoat to demote Islamic motives.

Regarding AK47s and launchers... give me a break every home on the Pashtun belt or in the Afghan basin, including ours, has weaponry. You can find weaponry in Karzais home, Omars home, the Malang's home etc.

The only contribution Pakistan makes to the war is allowing the insurgents to utilize Pakistani soil as a backward operating base to which to retreat. However, they do this for their own motives.

You have utterly failed... beacuse you have not won a single person with any aql over. Your attempts to hang the Pakistani/Saudi albatross around the neck of the commoners that have joined this movement is your own undoing.

Even the elites like Hekmat Karzai know that this narrative is losing its sheen:

http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth...225708920.html


Bottom line: The commoner, the village Pashtun is fueling this insurgency and that is the final word here until you can rebut Paul Refsdahl. And they are fighting a war of attrition with very little in the way of arms and ammunitions... but they are fighting with their hearts at the forefront. They do not want your hegemony anymore.

How much does one AK-47 round cost?

How much do water, food and shelter cost?

Are these fighters paying for everything themselves?

Do weapons need maintenance?

How much does an RPG round cost?

How much does fuel for their bikes, trucks and lorrys cost?


These are calculations that every field commander has to make.

Note that these fighters get paid a salary to be able to provide for their families.


Where does this money come from?

Where do highly explosive materials come from? They are not produced in the Tirah Valley....

Where do all the chemical products come from that are used to make home made bombs?


Listen, you can fool yourself but not someone who has military experience.

You are portraying the insurgency with these wonderfull and idealistic words. You are trying to portray a proxy war on the expense of the ordinary people as an heroic act. It is not.

[Saifullah]

well the insurgency doesn't use highly sophisticated weapons. They are quite inferior as compared to a normal army and definately NATO. Why is the term home made bomb used? Coz its not difficult to make....u dont need supplies from china or russia or somebody else to use it

[ScimitarXEdge]

And you?
What is your profession?

And what´s so special about being a chemical engineer that sounds so unbelievable to you?

What´s wrong with you, Ghanzarya?

I'm a Mathematician

well before you were Mechanical Engineering

[BarakzaiAbdali]

How much does one AK-47 round cost?

How much do water, food and shelter cost?

Are these fighters paying for everything themselves?

Do weapons need maintenance?

How much does an RPG round cost?

How much does fuel for their bikes, trucks and lorrys cost?


These are calculations that every field commander has to make.

Note that these fighters get paid a salary to be able to provide for their families.


Where does this money come from?

Where do highly explosive materials come from? They are not produced in the Tirah Valley....

Where do all the chemical products come from that are used to make home made bombs?


Listen, you can fool yourself but not someone who has military experience.

You are portraying the insurgency with these wonderfull and idealistic words. You are trying to portray a proxy war on the expense of the ordinary people as an heroic act. It is not.

Deal with the evidence, deal with what Resfsdahl saw. If money flows in from the gulf and the Afghan commoner gets ahold of some AKs that way, more power to him. If money and arms comes in via uzbek and chechyaan rebels or dagestanis who cares? You are so ignorant as to say: Americans can arm Karzai and whoever they want... but everyone has to tie their hands behind their backs. Its the Afghans, as Resfdahls shows, who are doing the fighting.... and its the common man... not the silk patkaa wearing Karzai.

Deal with Refsdahls observation. Otherwise, admit defeat. The average person is very much fueling the insurgency and you are attempting to demote their motives and cover up their suffering... which is a tragedy and a sin, not a heroic act.

The great evidence of that should be that assassin Sardar Muhammad. Groomed by Mr. Karzai even favored by him, Mr. Muhammad, it appears per the Washington Post Profile derives from a commoners village near Kalaay Karz. Its just down the road. Despite his deep disdain for the Taliban, he decided he could no longer sit by. The evidence of him being a sleeper agent for a great length of time is just not there per his family and other government officials. Something about the situation finally got to him.

[MostafaM]

well the insurgency doesn't use highly sophisticated weapons. They are quite inferior as compared to a normal army and definately NATO. Why is the term home made bomb used? Coz its not difficult to make....u dont need supplies from china or russia or somebody else to use it

Correct.

But if you wanna blow up an armoured personal carrier, you need alot of those stuff, it´s not cheap and it´s definitly available everywhere.

[Saifullah]

when there is a war there are plenty of people willing to sell weapons it is a great business...people dont care who's hand it goes in as long as their pockets are filled.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

well the insurgency doesn't use highly sophisticated weapons. They are quite inferior as compared to a normal army and definately NATO. Why is the term home made bomb used? Coz its not difficult to make....u dont need supplies from china or russia or somebody else to use it

Exactly, he's trying to sell himself as some kind of military hardware genius when any common person can just take a second and think about how the greater proportion of deaths to Us soldiers is being inflicted, not by rocket launchers, but simple IEDs.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Correct.

But if you wanna blow up an armoured personal carrier, you need alot of those stuff, it´s not cheap and it´s definitly available everywhere.

Actually it is available everywhere. Gates has been talking about targeting the plants where the parts are made for the materials the insurgents buy across the border.

[Saifullah]

IED is a really effective weapon, why? Because its cheap and not difficult to make yourself...

[MostafaM]

Deal with the evidence, deal with what Resfsdahl saw. If money flows in from the gulf and the Afghan commoner gets ahold of some AKs that way, more power to him. If money and arms comes in via uzbek and chechyaan rebels or dagestanis who cares? You are so ignorant as to say: Americans can arm Karzai and whoever they want... but everyone has to tie their hands behind their backs. Its the Afghans, as Resfdahls shows, who are doing the fighting.... and its the common man... not the silk patkaa wearing Karzai.

Deal with Refsdahls observation. Otherwise, admit defeat. The average person is very much fueling the insurgency and you are attempting to demote their motives and cover up their suffering... which is a tragedy and a sin, not a heroic act.

That was my point. You should read admit that I never stated anything else that in my opinion the ordinary Afghans are subject to a proxy from BOTH sides and get killed by TWO mercenary armies of the Taliban and ANA!

Where ever the armes come from, they don´t come for free nor do the come from "good pious muslims" aka Ummah-tree-huggers. They have their intentions and you are supporting suicide bombers, murderers and mutilators just like the ANA on the other side and spit on what the ordinary people want.

You should admit that you are trying to whitewash crimes in the name of jihad.

[شمله ور خراساني]

That was my point. You should read admit that I never stated anything else that in my opinion the ordinary Afghans are subject to a proxy from BOTH sides and get killed by TWO mercenary armies of the Taliban and ANA!

Where ever the armes come from, they don´t come for free nor do the come from "good pious muslims" aka Ummah-tree-huggers. They have their intentions and you are supporting suicide bombers, murderers and mutilators just like the ANA on the other side and spit on what the ordinary people want.

You should admit that you are trying to whitewash crimes in the name of jihad.

So what should Afghans do? Bend over and refuse any aid from outside to expell kuffar?

[BarakzaiAbdali]

That was my point. You should read admit that I never stated anything else that in my opinion the ordinary Afghans are subject to a proxy from BOTH sides and get killed by TWO mercenary armies of the Taliban and ANA!

Where ever the armes come from, they don´t come for free nor do the come from "good pious muslims" aka Ummah-tree-huggers. They have their intentions and you are supporting suicide bombers, murderers and mutilators just like the ANA on the other side and spit on what the ordinary people want.

You should admit that you are trying to whitewash crimes in the name of jihad.

Quiet the contrary, I admitted nothing. If a launcher here or a launcher there gets in, then so be it. Its not the main vehicle augmenting the damage. Thats being done by the men you see in Refsdahl's video, which is why you are so rabid now. Bring your proof regarding your claims otherwise we cannot take you seriously. Refsdahl, a nonMuslim has bought us frontline pictorials. What do you offer except ideologies that basically support occupation?

Once again, it actually is, per Islamic theology, considered a legitimate jihad since defensive jihad need not be declared by a Caliph. The minute that non Muslim invading armies shoes hit Muslim soil, the defensive jihad can activate. So if the commoner is fighting it and the ANA is fighting for the occupying source, one is actually imperial and one is not. Regarding suicide, mutilation, and the like, all of it stems back to the one single act that augments radicalism: foreign western intervention. Their own social scientists admit it... so who the heck are you for us to believe that its not the case?

I think Ill trust a professor from Cambridge's opinion on assymetric war measures rather than some sell out who cannot produce evidence worth his name. Here is a quote from Professor Barkawai and Dr. Victor Hanson, neocon extraordinaire:

"As Victor Davis Hanson comments, "we in the West call the few casualties we suffer from terrorism and surprise 'cowardly', the frightful losses we inflict through open and direct assault 'fair'.""

Regarding your commentary on military experience, it appears you have none and cannot even come to the simple conclusions offered by Barkawi:

"When those who are weak in conventional military terms seek to fight the strong, they often do so through unconventional tactics and ruses. To do otherwise is to be stupid and risk being mown down by superior firepower. Yet tactics like poisoning families as they break bread expose the weak to charges of barbarity."

Therefore, I posit that the suicide bombs, the mutilations, etc are your and Hamid Karzai's doings. ALL YOURS to account for. They were not going on when your red, white, and blue storm troopers werent building bases in Afghan soil.

Breaking bread with terrorists - Opinion - Al Jazeera English

[MostafaM]

So what should Afghans do? Bend over and refuse any aid from outside to expell kuffar?

If help comes with hidden intentions and interests in your country, then it´s better not to take it otherwise you become a slave of foreigners like the people you are fighting against.

There are many ways of resistance, many ways of defeating your enemy but the most noble way is to avoid any havouc coming down on your people, the ones you say you wanna fight for.

The resistance against the US forces could have been easily won via media pressure. I do not know if its appropiate to say that here but bringing the war to the enemy is an option, too. We saw how Spain pulled their troops out of Iraq after an attack on a train in combination with the elections there.

Killing, beheading, suicide-blasting women, children and men who have nothing to do with the conflict is the stupidest way of resistance. Kill the people you fight for! HA!

Civilian disobedience, general strikes etc.
The insurgency cannot come up with these things because they have a bad name. They impose their will on the people but if they are gone, the people turn their backs to them.

I myself am a witness of children throwing stones at Russian soldiers in Kabul. The bravery of Afghans made place for cowardice Arab style!

[BarakzaiAbdali]

So what should Afghans do? Bend over and refuse any aid from outside to expell kuffar?

Who cares what he thinks? Its a common tactic... hes attempting to assuage his own guilt and disarm his opponent by taking his strength (that he is native to his environment and deserves to be there more than the occupier or the elite oligarch that ran away from his duty and left his people high and dry (Karzai, Ghani, etc). Instead, the opponent smiles, looks at him, and chuckles and says here is a masalah:
Two school boys are gearing up for a fistfight in the school yard. One is a bully and is surprised that the boy who is about a 1/2 foot shorter is actually standing to the challenge. So he begins to worry and he says to himself: maybe this little shrimp knows martial arts, or maybe he has brass knuckles, etc. So the first thing he says is: "OK, no punching in the face.. (mind you he has punched many boys in the face." Then he says "OK, no kicks to the gonads (mind you he has kicked many gonads before." etc Until the fight is an absurdity. The fight starts and the bully gets a swift kick to the gonads and goes down.

Who cares what Mostafa thinks? Hes just trying to legitimize his feelings of guilt and justify himself turning his back on his religion. Thats why he started this thread.

He refuses to answer my prior post on his answer to stoning.

So Mustafa, one question:

If stoning is barbaric, why did Muhammad (S) do it?