NaPak Army killing innocent civilians in Waziristan

[Toramana]

^^You are brainwashed fool with no conscience parading like a prostitute with no shame. Even a small child knows that one does not need 70,000 troops with air support and constant shelling destroying every village to the ground for 700 fighters.

Khushal, not to mention that this army is fighting this war for almost 14 years. Any professional army working among its own people (as Pakistan army claims FATA are its own people) during this long period would have developed an effective counter insurgency strategy anf plan, intelligence network, civilian population support-base, etc.

And which martial, professional army on earth will cause the dislocation of its own people in hundreds of thousands even in millions to fight a war against a rag-tag militia.

This Da Bannu Mazdigar type people can be ultimate disgrace to any nation. Unfortunately, he is to Pashtun nation.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

The Survey is sound but it lacks the Ground level support,Hell even if they would have asked me for Shariah i would have said yes and i know almost every single member of my family would have responded with "YES".

By such a standard, all voting and ideology is "emotional." What you view as practical and what the people view as practical is the difference between the elite that want to maintain a system of hegemony and feudal standards out of touch with the rural people and the average (rural) people who understand that your current system and order have bought wealth to but a few and have excluded the many. You telling them that its practical or impractical doesn't mean it is not so. In fact, more often than not the Pakistani state misapplies and misuses religious doctrine when it suits its purposes instead of applying the standard of justice. I would rather venture to say that the only impracticality in Pakistan is the pursuit of real justice with the current status quo.

This is the reason a survey conducted in countries like Pakistan are driven by emotion on the other hand survey conducted in Muslim countries like turkey,malaysia etc aswell as European/USA are of different caliber.

This is not going to happen infact the autonomous status of FATA will be withheld within this Govt with FCR abolished and FATA either form's into a new province or merger with KPK,We cannot Leave FATA as it is without govt security there.

One can hope that instead the following happens to save indigenous Pashtun culture: 1) US Aid spigots turn down the flow to pre war on terror levels 2) Pakistan is forced to make hard economic choices regarding where they station troops by having to deal with India on one border seeking to secure the fate of Kashmir and Afghanistan on the other side ensuring refuge and haven for the tribals that resist. Otherwise, this is really nothing to celebrate since FATA and the border lands of Afghanistan are the remaining bastions of Pashto and Pashto culture.

It is a Pakistani territory,Even Hakeemullah said we are loyal Son of Pakistan.FATA till eternity will now be having Army presence more than any other place in the rest of Pakistan except the border with india.Infact today we only have 1lac troops deployed along LOC while upto 2lac on Pak-Afghan border.

As per above.

Well sir its upto you believe it or not.Things are changing and extremely fast.Being i kid i remember in surrani,Bannu the sikenkhel public school had Afghanistan flag both in the main building and in the Ground.Today the situation is different.

Proving only that Pakistan is more of a military state than ever. One hallmark of a failing state is that the military is the main and primary functioning organ.

I am not getting why you responded with Hayatullah Khan tragedy and i am equally sad for him because it tears down my heart when i see my people suffering which in worst case scenerio doesn't number more than 500 on the other hand i have posted the example of people close to me having numbers in excess of 50k families.

Because Hayatullah was pointing out that Nek Mohammad of the Yargu Khel, who had participated in Afghanistan at an early age, was offered up by Pakistan as a sacrificial lamb as one of the early casualties of the double game. He definitively clinched the role of the military and the ISI and its loose treaties with the FATA people without any particular stance regarding what they would do in Afghanistan (indirectly and directly encouraging it) and the fact that they then would play fast and loose with the lives of their people instead of taking clear stances to guide their people. Hayatullah Wazir's contribution was that he caught Pakistan with its figurative pants down and directly exposed its double game. They killed him because he reported on Nek Muhammad's honest attempts at reconciliation coupled to the government's goal of getting rid of someone who was beginning to understand that he was being directed to send his men into certain death to feed the pot belly Generals of Lahore and Panjab

The Hazara boy demand punishment for his family murderer,The other girl weeping aside mother body also demand punishment.

Once again, per the evidence Pape provides, even these deaths and the cause and effect land at the feet of the Pakistani military for its double game and the response that it incurred from the people it thought was chess pieces establishing that they would not play the part that Pakistan wanted them to play

Anyway i am not surprised from the sympathy pashtuns in Afghanistan have for talibans..Do you know why TTP collapsed?Because of the People support for the nation

I would say its too early to talk about collapse. Also I don't think of that organization as a single cohesive body like the Quetta Shura had... instead its a conglomerate of multiple players from different regions of the tribal belt and swat held together loosely in the first place. These same arguments were already happening back in the baitullah and abdullah mehsud days.

The Pakistani people and their support is contingent on mass media manipulation and early brain washing (e.g. coopting heroes such as Ahmad Shah Baba)... so I dont take too much stock in that.

Remember that American support for the Iraq intervention was also high because Blair and Colin Powell did the same sort of mass media manipulation tactics... that does not make it a moral victory at all nor does it legitimize the action.

Today in a declare war,TTP can't do **** and they are being bombed to hell.Recent analyst believe that TTP numbers without Hafiz Gul bahadur Group are less than 700fighters down from 9thousand during Swat operation

I would posit that 700 or so fighters with limited weaponry have caused a lot of trouble for Pakistan. Lets look at the accomplishments of Pakistan's adversary over nearly a decade:

1) Through multiple leadership hits (Nek Muhammad, Baitullah, Hakimullah etc) the group generally maintains some degree of fluidity and operational capability
2) They have established a backward operating base and perhaps even established ties with a nation state, giving the essential oxygen that any insurgency needs to survive.... remember that the Quetta Shura driven insurgency laid low for 2001-2004 after the initial massive hit from the US, Dostum from the north etc.... but they proved tenacious
3) They redirected Pakistan's national security paradigm and forced it to abandon its prior all eyes on India policy rendering it more dependent on outside aid than ever before
4) They influenced voting patterns in certain areas.
5) They show the ability to conduct operations across the country indicating that they are metastesized far across Pakistan and may lay low for a while but will continue to lure Pakistan into an endless game of hungry hungry hippo.

Remember my friend, there is the parable of the elephant and the mosquito----> With one paw the elephant can crush 5 to 10 mosquitos but enough malaria ridden mosquitos working diligently and quietly can cause a ruckus!



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[Al-Afghani]

Its a foolish approach that takes no responsibility for your own wrongs and internal contradictions . The central approach ought to be 1) admitting the true policy to the people so that a collective decision is made 2) Apologizing for the murder of truth telling reporters who exposed the double game your army is playing with the lives of people- like Hayatullah Wazir case above 3) Telling the people the honest truth about why these people fight in the first place and defining why they are upset with Pakistan instead of using these convenient terms like some sort of house negro (the term militant and terrorist etc are once you have adopted from George W. Bush it seems). 4) Expanding on 3 - telling the full breath of Pakistani electorate the history and story of the FATA tribes' role in Afghanistan for centuries and defining historical parallels ---> and then defining why they turned their fire power on pakistan. 5) Admitting collusion by allowing non Pakistani troops into some of the paramount military sites in Pakistan and pretty much compromising the Pakistani Army into the role of mercenary.

Your idea relies on the continued utilization of a false narrative that suits your own internal dialogue and allows you to kill during the day and sleep comfortably at night without a thought about your nation's culpability.

You are basically saying "Let Pashtuns live outside the law, or else we will cause trouble for you". That time is over, fortunately. Insha Allah, the Pakistani Army will crush these terrorists and bring NW under control.

[jankhan]

You are basically saying "Let Pashtuns live outside the law, or else we will cause trouble for you". That time is over, fortunately. Insha Allah, the Pakistani Army will crush these terrorists and bring NW under control.

You are saying as there is no more Pakistani interests in Afghanistan. I wish it happens.