Origins of the Ghilzai tribe?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Mullah Omar , an ethnic Ghilzai has a few mongoloid looking features, if you kind of look at it.

even saddam hussein had these features; you find these features everywhere.

squinting eyes =/= epicanthic folds

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Here's an excerpt I wrote once for someone else about the Khalaj:

Here is some more information on the Khalaj from Clifford Edmond Bosworth:

"...Turkish ethnic elements had been established in eastern Afghanistan for some time, perhaps for several centuries. Marquart visualized the whole of this region as once held by first the Kushans and then by the Ephthalites or White Huns, the Sveta Huna of the Hindus and the Haital (more correctly, *Habtal) or Hayatila of the Arab historians. He believed that it retained in the early Islamic period a strong Ephtalite ethnic flavour, and connected the very name 'Zabulistan' with an Epthalite tribe, the Jauvla, Jabula, or Jabuvlah, known from northern Indian inscriptions. The Oghuz and Khalaj Turks, who in early Islamic period nomadised from Tukharistan and Badakhshan in the north down to Bust, would thus be the remnants of Turkish peoples brought from north of the Oxus as part of the Ephtalite confederation that then left behind in eastern Afghanistan. Marquart's theory is by no means certain, although Frye and Sayili have recently followed him. Yet there is no doubt about their existence there in pre-Ghaznavid times. At the opening of the 9th century, the Kabulshah had to send an annual tribute of 2000 Oghuz slaves to the governor of Khurasan, 'Abdallah b. Tahir. In the Caliphate of al-Mansur Ma'n b. Za'ida as-Sulami was governor of Sistan, and he received from the Zunbil at his winter capital of ar-Rukhaj [Arochosia/Kandahar] the customary tribute of camels and Turkish felt tents and slaves. The Zunbil is said to have had a bodyguard from the local Turks, at-Turk-ad-Dawari. Istakhri says that up to his own time, the Khalaj of Zamindawar had kept their Turkish customs, external appearance and language. The Khalaj survived as an ethnic unity for several more centuries; they were subdued by Sebuktigin and recruited into his army ; they formed an important element in the armies of the Ghaznavids, Ghurids and Khwarizmshahs; they were the progenitors of the Lodi Kings of Delhi (1451-1526); and their name probably survives today in that of the modern Ghilzai Afghans. Some form of authority was excercised over these nomads in the 10th century by the Samanid central government; the youthful Sebuktigin was once sent by his master Alptigin in a military force to collect the customary taxes from the Khalaj and Turkmens."

Ghaznavids: Part 1: The Empire under Mahmud, Section 2: The establishment of Sebuktigin in Ghazna: pg. 271-272.

An interesting side note is the alleged historical relationship of the Kharoti Ghilzai tribe and the Ghaznawid court. I believe the Nashers claim they were somehow apart of the Ghaznawid court?

[Midnight_Sun]

An interesting side note is the alleged historical relationship of the Kharoti Ghilzai tribe and the Ghaznawid court. I believe the Nashers claim they were somehow apart of the Ghaznawid court?

Some Ghorid chieftans (enemies of the Ghorids) were part of the Ghaznavid courts of Bahram Shah..and the Khalaj made up a sizeable chunk of their military, as well as their enemies. The Kharot are said to be peculiar among the Ghilzai in their dress 100 years ago, I remember reading this in one of my books, but I have neglected to cite it.

Most Kharot were nomads, so I kind of hard to believe they were prominent among the courts of the Ghaznavids...unless their origins lie with the Ghorids. I would love to do a genetic test of all the major Ghilzai clans to see if there is a patriarchal descent among all of them, or like the Pakhtuns of the border, come from different origins.

[Shahidulla]

-Some oriental scholars hold that the Ghilzais are the descendants of a mixed race of Hephthalite and Pakhtas who have been living in Afghanistan since the Vedic Aryan period

-Ḡalzī tribal genealogies in general trace their early descent from the union of either Shah Ḥosayn, a Ghurid (q.v.) prince, and Bībī Mātō, a granddaughter of Qays ʿAbd al-Rašīd, the putative ancestor of all Pashtuns, or Mokarram Shah, a Pashtun prince from Ḡūr, and the daughter of a Persian notable...
—M. Jamil Hanifi

-Others suggest that they descended from the Khalaj or Khilji dynasty, who entered Afghanistan in the 10th century.

-Or a lost tribe of israel which almost every pashtun tribe can be........

[Midnight_Sun]

Some oriental scholars hold that the Ghilzais are the descendants of a mixed race of Hephthalite and Pakhtas who have been living in Afghanistan since the Vedic Aryan period

-Ḡalzī tribal genealogies in general trace their early descent from the union of either Shah Ḥosayn, a Ghurid (q.v.) prince, and Bībī Mātō, a granddaughter of Qays ʿAbd al-Rašīd, the putative ancestor of all Pashtuns, or Mokarram Shah, a Pashtun prince from Ḡūr, and the daughter of a Persian notable...
—M. Jamil Hanifi

-Others (Ancient Muslim Historians, Modern Anthropologists) suggest that they descended from the Khalaj or Khilji dynasty, who entered Afghanistan in the 10th century. (Partially correct)

-Or a lost tribe of israel which almost every pashtun tribe can be........

Fixed.

[Midnight_Sun]

This is also very interesting:

An antique and oriental rug dealer found a peculiar weave in a Kochi rug that resembled weaves of the ancient Tocharian people, here is a link:

.:Afghan Rugs: Pashtun Sleeping Rug:.

[salimat]

salam, im a Ghilzai descendent, you say you have some history books, i would love to read and find out more about my background, could i find these books and where ? Thanks.

[Shahidulla]

Fixed.

Yes most likely . But i found out these theories on the net.

[Kushan Prince]

There are 2 sects of main tribes which all pashtun tribes originate from. One is Durrani and the other is Khiji which the Ghilzai's come from. So no Turkic past IMO.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

There are 2 sects of main tribes which all pashtun tribes originate from. One is Durrani and the other is Khiji which the Ghilzai's come from. So no Turkic past IMO.

No Turk in YOUR OPINION ..asi fi opinions mattered when it comes to genealogy.

The evidence says otherwise ..we were Turks at one point and definitely not originally Pashtun. the "Pashtuns are 5000 years old" storyline is mythical. Let's throw that away.

[Kushan Prince]

No Turk in YOUR OPINION ..asi fi opinions mattered when it comes to genealogy.

The evidence says otherwise ..we were Turks at one point and definitely not originally Pashtun. the "Pashtuns are 5000 years old" storyline is mythical. Let's throw that away.

My dad told me this so whatever.

[Shahidulla]

No Turk in YOUR OPINION ..asi fi opinions mattered when it comes to genealogy.

The evidence says otherwise ..we were Turks at one point and definitely not originally Pashtun. the "Pashtuns are 5000 years old" storyline is mythical. Let's throw that away.

no lets not, that pashtuns were turks is one of the most uncommon litle theory. stop this crap

[RevolutionThroughReason]

no lets not, that pashtuns were turks is one of the most uncommon litle theory. stop this crap

I didn't say ALl Pashtuns were Turks, i said my tribe Ghilzais were Turks which we probably were since the Khalaj and Ghilzais are related.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Yes most likely . But i found out these theories on the net.

see you're conceding to Midnight Sun who is affirming what I wrote.

[Shahidulla]

I didn't say ALl Pashtuns were Turks, i said my tribe Ghilzais were Turks which we probably were since the Khalaj and Ghilzais are related.

Yes i know but that isn't the only theory as i said. So why throw the rest away?