Future Map of Loy Afghanistan(pukhtunistan)

[ScimitarXEdge]

Disagree, the Great Game shrank the empire of the Durranis, the state itself became the creation of the Great Game.

[khyaal]

Disagree, the Great Game shrank the empire of the Durranis, the state itself became the creation of the Great Game.

No. Occupied Pakhtunkhwa was part of the main land Afghanistan and not simply part of the empire.

[ScimitarXEdge]

the term afghanistan was never used by any previous Authority of the Durrani empire before Amir Abdur Rahman Khan

[khyaal]

the term afghanistan was never used by any previous Authority of the Durrani empire before Amir Abdur Rahman Khan

I'll look for it. might be there in Elphinstine's book. Do you have it?

But one thing is very obvious that the land of the majority of Pashtuns(afghans) could not simply be part of the colony but not be part of the mainland Afghanistan.

[khyaal]

Apart from that we had punjab with us as our neighbour under a distinct governer separate from that of Sindh and Kashmir which were also colonies like Punjab and were parts of the empire. Besides Peshawar was the winter capital.

[Nick]

Nick! Don't waste your time with Ghaznavi, there seems to be some ulterior motives here. It is the typical BS propagated by Pakis and their affiliates. You will see many who claim to be afghans but in reality the work for anti afghan agenda.

Khyaal brother I know brother Ghaznavi Allah has blessed him with a great handsome face. He is also not as racist as he talks he is very good guy. But here of PF we see him being influenced by western media. He is under pressure and because he visits irani forum tajjikam he thinks Afghanistan truly is a not Afghan-stan and he lost his interest in Pashtunistan simply due to notice ISI' s huge hands in Afghan and NWFP's Pashtun politics.

I don't blame him also his knowledge of history is weak, and not as strong as his narrow sided comments. Alghaznivi is one western educated respected brother, I respect him in personal level. But when come to politics, he only sees the weak-side not our strong side. Again if he reads less BS from tajikam and youtube/wiki and focus on the realities in side Afghanistan and Pashtunistan, he will come to conclusion that Afghan unity by that Iam pashtun unity from both sides of the border is the only solution.

Secondly some of us or many of us made at least one visit to Afghanistan or maybe few of us, (But those whom i know in Canada are rich and have made at least one visit I made 3 visits since getting out of Tajikistan). I too used to be anti-pashtun as as I told few guys and alghaznivi knows this as well, but I changed, and noticed our greater problems and our narrow minded western kafiri influenced mentality is anti-Afghan. Afghanistan lack many form, and boundries of western Politics. You can't play Canadian or American politics inside Afghanistan, or other such countries. What he is saying fits into politics of United states, canada etc but he needs to realize Afghan like usa, israel, pakistan or canada is not artificial but original. Specially when his talking about borders we ask him to read history. Yes we admit we lost Some small parts of kandahar to Iran, some small parts of badakhshan to combined with modern Gromo of soviet union. We lost a small town or small villages at those time to Turkmanistan which almost lead to russian-british war. We lost half of our land and 25% of our blood brothers to India.

Yet still our northern borders were naturally fixed since ages since God knows when. For those of us who went to north they know that amo (Oxus River) is known as killer river taking afghan north and dumping it into what is recently named by russians as Ariel sea. Western border with iran would of been perfect if we had a little more up from iranian eastern sides due to historical arian region ie Herat/farah/badghiz as well as lost kandahari city. Because the two deserts formed a natural boundaries.
Its just east and north eastern and southern border that we have problem with. Its not fixed and that is artificial. Afghanistan's northern Borders and Western Borders are not artificial, I can even bring Iranian sources to prove this such as Shahnameh.

Above all I said Alghaznivi is Afghan and native pashtu speaking it seems he knows Dari as well. And if he says he is Ghazni native, and a qabili then he is right and we must believe him. He is not an ISI agent or pro-Pakistani like many of our hindko or peshawari brothers in this forum. And again we can't reject him as non-afghan as he rejects other people's claims. I also think he has a great love for pashtun people, and a very deep hate to anti-afghan and he thinks his country will break if we continue our war with mighty british kufari puppet government of pakistan. That I think is his views. Again he is a good looking loving person. As I said he has his side of views, and we have ours. He has weakness as I pointed above but also has some points which we need to think about.
I am very sure by the time you finish reading another innocent pashtun is death in pakistan or an Afghan pashtun in Afghanistan. We have to accept the fact that in this war and since abdur rahman khan's era this Loy Afghanistan or Afghans have been cursed for we did not made the forth anglo-afghan war to take back the land and people which was ours and did let our Khyber brothers fight alone, and suffer alone by the hands of british for we were too scared of British. The fact that we were strong back than, and we almost broke theback bone of mighty British.
Allah had given us unity of Islam, unity of Langauge and unity of blood line as well as some 100 years of peaceful Durrani era before we F ed up everything and got selfish. Now both side of this Durand line suffers and had suffer for since the time of Abdur Rahman khan. Wonder why some people curse Abdur Rahman khan or the Mohmmadzai-or greater Barakzai clan.

[Toramana]

Khyaal is living in the past whereas ground realities today have changed altogethor...That is why I find the political views of PMAP (low-cadres) anachronistic and repellent in some cases (e.g. support/justification for tribalism). Anyhow, who talks of the revival Afghan Empire of the 18th Century should have his head examined...

I see in it something Serbian...no matter how much sugar-coated the ultimate message is, Pashtun domination ought return ...one can just imagine the cost of that to Pashtuns and non-Pashtuns alike...few more decades of war few millions more to be dead...

[khyaal]

Khyaal is living in the past whereas ground realities today have changed altogethor...That is why I find the political views of PMAP (low-cadres) anachronistic and repellent in some cases (e.g. support/justification for tribalism). Anyhow, who talks of the revival Afghan Empire of the 18th Century should have his head examined...

I see in it something Serbian...no matter how much sugar-coated the ultimate message is, Pashtun domination ought return ...one can just imagine the cost of that to Pashtuns and non-Pashtuns alike...few more decades of war few millions more to be dead...

Tormana! You are stuck in the brute rationalism of the 19th century. You don't know that previous logic doesn't work today. Your anthropological definitions of tribalism(a British connotation) etc. are very much outdated now.

[کیش]

Idiot dont make me run you over.

it is up to Allah who he makes poor or rich.

believe me ,you too will have to be reintegrated like "ghaznawi"

What happened now? Please run me over!

You call Tajiks, Uzbeks, and prob American soldiers Afghans, would you call Punjabi's, and Sindhis one?

[Nokia_Apridy]

hahaha Idot rora ur really genius idiot really dar kha point

[khushal]

If anything my arguments represent the purest, strongest advocacy for Pakhtun unity, in that it is based on equality and justice, and it rejects failed paradigms like Loy Afghanistan

The last people to speak on idea rejection are the Loy Afghanistan advocates. Their philosophy has been rejected to the dustbins of history

Ajmal Khattak himself, realized the hypocricy of the Kabul regimes position

Loy Afghanistan was in essence, an extension of the Kabul courts power, nothing more.

The problem was not with the idea Loy Afghanistan, but the problem was with the Pashtunistan policies Daud Khan put forward towards Pakistan.When Afghanistan rejected Pakistan entry to the UN and opposed Pakistan in every other way, this policy forced Afghanistan to completely depend of the Soviet Union. When Daud realized the Pashtunistan policy was flawed, he decided to diversify his economic partners and make peace with Pakistan. This forced the Soviets to support a communist led coup against him. When the communists took over Kabul, the Islamists took to the hills and were forced to depend on Pakistan. This was the turning point of Pakistan having leverage over Afghanistan. This was the starting point of Afghanistan changing its dependence from the Soviet Union to Pakistan. When American and the Saudi money came in to the picture, Pakistan's leverage increased 1000 fold. Afghanistan was doomed.

Afghanistan naturally do want their people back along side with them but the way Daud Khan went about doing it was wrong and self destructive. Instead of forcing the issue, he should have let the KP pashtuns decide for themselves if they wanted to join afghanistan or not. If they wanted to join, it should have been their choice and if they wanted it badly, they should have fought for it. Rmember you cant force pashtuns to go a certain way, they have to want it.

[khushal]

the northerners will decide for themselves what is the best option, I am inclined to think they will band together in a state which will self destruct regardless.

at best, it can be linked with pashtun states at a supra national level

While I agree with you that a shamali state would be self destructive. It would not make sense for them to have a self destructive state, and it would not make sense for a Pashtunistan state to have a border with an unstable state.
It is a benifit to the farsiwans and to the pashtuns for them to be in one union. It is more beneficial to have a bigger union with more population but on a federal system with each people to have limited autonomy but allegiance to the federal government. The key is structure of the government and it should work in the interests of everyone.

If you believe that the name Afghanistan is an insult to both pashtuns and nonpashtuns, I believe you are over exaggerating this issue.
Turkistan has a huge Kurdish population, should they change their name. Hindustan has a huge Muslim population, should they change their name as well. I can go on and on. Today people in afghanistan are more concerned about putting food on the table, the last thing on their mind is the name of their nation. As one Hazara villager said "changing the name to Khorasan wont put food in my childrens mouths"

[کیش]

Afg/Pak, need to learn to live together. They need to stop bickering at one another. If they merge nations, the population would be around 200 million, and have mass lands. Call it whatever you want, just merge already, and start refining those minerals!!! Among other ventures.

I hear peoples complaints saying punjabi numbers are too large and will overtake others. I don't know what's the problem with Punjabi's? They are real cool people.

[graveyardofempires]

What happened now? Please run me over!

You call Tajiks, Uzbeks, and prob American soldiers Afghans, would you call Punjabi's, and Sindhis one?

you little Idiot!

you still need to know what you are talking about and dont make me start about who is working for americans.

there are not just tajik,uzbek soldiers in the ANA,there are also Pashtuns.
I call them all Afghans if you like it or not,yes they might be criminal Afghans but they are Afghans.

you can call Punjabis and sindhis your bhaijan's and maybe even phatan.

[graveyardofempires]

Afg/Pak, need to learn to live together. They need to stop bickering at one another. If they merge nations, the population would be around 200 million, and have mass lands. Call it whatever you want, just merge already, and start refining those minerals!!! Among other ventures.

I hear peoples complaints saying punjabi numbers are too large and will overtake others. I don't know what's the problem with Punjabi's? They are real cool people.

LOL

another phatan in making