Pashtun with a Israelite past?

[Manzareh]

So far the only credible explanation for us is the Bani Israel theory. The fact that so many of us know of this confirms its growing credibility.

Prince, this is just it, the Bani Israel theory is not a credible one! iv posted evidence for this in this thread from a historical perspective, from genetic research and a load of credible historians that refute this. People here dont even have an answer to the posts i make here because

they are fooling themselves. The Bani Israel theory is a made up fairy tale and deeply exagerrated, a minor amount of jews may have traveled to our region after being exiled and settled there and thats the max that could have, anybody with any knowledge of history will tell you how wild it sounds for jews to come from jerusalem and overtake Pactyan warriors.

they even mention Afridis to be the main jewish people when the history of the Afridis or Apartye is well known, we even know the exact branches of pashtuns and how they are derived from Qais's sons. so this alone debunks any Israeli theory.

even morally it doesnt make sence for the pashtuns to be the lost tribe as the lost tribe were weak people in their faith (pashtuns are the strongest in whatever they believe in, its in our blood) the lost tribe ran away and was exiled (this is great bezati and pashtuns would not do this)

There has been DNA test that iv proven in this post of which Emal has shared with us that show no Jewish connection.

you have to remember that the first time this Bani Israel theory was introduced was in the 16th century, before the Lodhis in India this theory was not even mentioned, it was mentioned in the Maghzan-e-Afghani and then people talk about it like pashtuns have known this for thousands of years. were did this theory suddently pop out from? why havent our ancestors talked about this?? because its made up, pashtuns just used it to attach themselves to Quranic stories.

they always claiming to be someone some greek, some jew, some arab only because these things are mentioned in the Quran.

[Manzareh]

hes a jew that wants pashtuns to drop islam and move to israel to fight for the israeli state. this is his own words.

Jews are very cunning, they think pashtuns are gullable people that have a stone age mentality, as if pashtuns are going to be a tool and a slave to the zionist regime. they view themselves as the 'all wise' and pashtuns as easy meat and a possibility of 60 million pashtuns being trained up like guard rotweilers. the pashtuns are true warriors and they will fight and give up their lives, the jews no this, they think we are easy meat in order to do their dirty work. think about it, if pashtuns execpt to be Israelites (which will never happen) then the Israelis have a MASSIVE regional advantage, infact they will probly claim the $3 Trillion dollars worth of minerals in Afghanistan as Israeli property as it belongs to "the Israeli people" and that their great great great great great grandfathers used to live there, just how they say the same bull**** when invading palestinians and bulldozing houses with 5 year old kids inside. they will start off with "we are brothers" then "get the f**k out".

[randolph85]

israelis have money but they are morally bankrupt. in the sight of god, your riches mean nothing, its how decent of a person you have been and most importantly if you were a practicing believer.

israelis have a warped sense of life. they believe their race makes them superior, but the joke is on them because its the faith in God that makes the person, not his roots. do they forget we are all from adam and eve?

[randolph85]

005.041
O Messenger! let not those grieve thee, who race each other into unbelief: (whether it be) among those who say "We believe" with their lips but whose hearts have no faith; or it be among the Jews,- men who will listen to any lie,- will listen even to others who have never so much as come to thee. They change the words from their (right) times and places: they say, "If ye are given this, take it, but if not, beware!" If any one's trial is intended by Allah, thou hast no authority in the least for him against Allah. For such - it is not Allah's will to purify their hearts. For them there is disgrace in this world, and in the Hereafter a heavy punishment.

[Yos from tribe of Judea]

you talk about this torah awakening in israel but half your people are still non religious and your cities are filled with filth. this is all while you are trying to expand into islamic lands. how about applying your torrah law to your godless people before you even think about intruding into islamic lands. shut down your gay bars, night clubs, legalized prostitution, and porn instustry before you even contimplate stepping foot on pure islamic lands.

Again you premise is wrong. The LAND OF ISRAEL, is not Islamic, we have no desire nor are we allowed by the law of the Torah to rule in any other land aside from the land of Israel. All we want is our 28,000 square km, by the way you can fit our tiny 8,000 miles 8 times into a place like Florida

[randolph85]

good luck with that, champ.

the land of israel has been under muslim rule far longer than it has under jewish rule. under muslim rule the land was pure and holy, under jewish rule there are gay parades and strip clubs. jews have reestablished sodom and gomorrah. you taint an otherwise pure land.

[Yos from tribe of Judea]

Yos, if you want to follow Torah, then give up Israel, as according to the teachings of the Torah you can not have a homeland till the Messiah returns. If not, you are just as bad as the Zionist seculars.

There many Jewish communities who will not return to Israel because of this known Biblical fact.

If you are really looking for an answer please read, my lengthy response here.


The philosophy of Neturei Karta seems to be based on two main points. The first point is a passage from Gemara Kesubot,111a, God made the Jews take two oaths and the world take one. To the Jews "Not to ascend to the Holy Land as a group using force, not to rebel against the governments of countries in which we live," and "Not to push the end away with our sins ", see Rashi for the last one. For Neturei Karta this means that the State of Israel is a sin, we came back in force and rebelled against the nations.

This is easily answered; there was no rebellion against the nations. We were granted permission by Britain, League of Nations and the United Nations to recreate our homeland in the Land of Israel. Second the first two oaths might be contingent on the third, if the non-Jews treat us harshly, which they did, then we can rebel and go up to the land. Third even if the oaths are not connected, we saw clear signs of redemption, which nullified the oaths themselves. This is similar to the Halacha where one swears not to enter his house. If the walls of his house collapse, he is freed from his oath and may step on the remains of the house.

The second point is that redemption can not come about through non-believers, furthermore Netueri Karta believes that man can not play a role in bringing the Redemption and must completely rely on the Almighty to do all the work.

I will now come to show that we indeed did see the signs of Redemption and that we were certainly justified in taking an active role in the process of Redemption. Furthermore I intend to show that God cherished the Secular Jews who restored His land and why we should continue to respect the State of Israel even though it does not always go in the path of the Torah.

There is a Halacha that we only follow the majority opinion when it is coupled with clear reasoning; furthermore Tosfot in Gemara Yevamot explains that we follow the minority if the minority is sharper in Torah than the majority.

I would like to begin by discussing what constitutes the beginning of redemption. I would like to bring several gemara's which expound on this very issue.

The first Gemara I would like to mention is a Gemara in Sanhedrin 98: a "Rabbi Abba said, 'There is no greater sign of redemption than this, as it is written in Yechezkel, 'You O mountains of Israel will give forth your branches and give forth your fruit for My People Israel will soon return'. " (Yechezkel 36) One could argue that this Gemara is of an Aggadic nature and therefore cannot be used as a proof, but there are two other gemarot that bring this gemara into the realm of Halacha.

In Gemara Migilah 17: b, "Why do we recite the blessing of the re-gathering of the exiles after the blessing of the year, because it is written in Yechezkel, 'You O mountains of Israel will give forth your branches and give forth your fruit for My People Israel will soon return " (Yechezkel 36) This exact Gemara is also repeated in Gemara - Brachot Yerushalmi, I do not remember the exact page, but I remember that it is in the first perek. The copy that I saw was on my old army base in the Jordan valley, which I no longer have access to. The Tur and the Beit Yosef accept these gemara's as halacha, see Orach Chaim 115-121.

It is clear that, not only do chazal agree that redemption will begin with the restoration of the Land, but they enshrined this concept by incorporating it into the Shmona Esrai, the Eighteen Benedictions. This could also be the reason why chazal (great rabbbis) used the phrase towards the end the of the second blessing "Makes salvation sprout". The first sign of the redemption will be with the sprouting of the Land. So now that we understand how the redemption will begin, we must make the connection to the State of Israel.

In Parshat Bichukoti (bible), one of the many infamous curses is the one on the Land of Israel. " I will make the Land desolate, and the enemies who dwell within will be desolate. "(26:32) The Ramban explains this to be a blessing and promise for the Jewish People. That the Land will never grow for anyone but the Jewish People. Rabbenu Bachya also explains, BeRe**** 17:8, " This is a great sign for the Jewish People, since they were exiled from their Land no nation was able to settle there. Rather it sits is desolation until its children return. " Also, may there be a thousand separations, the famous non-Jewish author, Mark Twain visited the Land of Israel in 1867. He wrote, " The hills are barren, they are dull of color, they are un-picturesque in shape. The valleys are unsightly desert fringed with feeble vegetation that has an expression about it of being sorrowful and despondent… The Land sits in sackcloth and ashes… This Land is no more of this work-day world. It is sacred to poetry and tradition-it is a dream-land. " (Innocent Abroad end of chapter 56)

It is clear that Hashem has kept his promise, up until the Jewish People decided to return to the Land of their forefather's, the Land did not grow. It is interesting that he wrote this in 1867, just a few short years before the Children of Israel although mainly secular returned. Even though they were secular, did not keep Shabbat or Kashrut, the Land accepted them and she grew accordingly. The Land allowed them to drain her swamps, grow her fields, raise cattle and build beautiful towns and cities. This was all barely 30 years after Twain visited.

This is very much reminiscent of the day of Ezra and Nechemya, the vast majority who returned with them were not only unobservant, but immoral as well, as it says in Talmud Kiddushin 69-70, they were *******s, foundlings and committed sexual misconducts like the people of Sodom and Amora. And yet they were the tools, which Hashem used to bring about that Geulah. Certainly, the secular Jews who started returning in the late 1800s, and who remained the main builders of the land until the State was re-declared in 1948, could not have been much worse.

To better understand that the Mashiach does not need to come about through the most pleasant means we must look at the father of Mashiach, David Hamelech - King David. When we look at Davids ancestry one becomes quickly disturbed. On his fathers side came about through the illicit relations between Yehuda and Tamar. Does not sound like the proper Yichus (linage) for the Mashiach! Even though this was an abomination Chazal tell us, "Hashem was busy creating the light of the King Mashiach." (Bare**** Rabba 85:1)

Now going from bad to worse, we look at Davids mother side. Davids grandmother Ruth came from the Nation of Moav. Number one it was the nation of Moav that seduced the men of Israel to sin in the Midbar bringing a great plague upon them. Second, Moav's founding father was an illegitimate of the worst sort; he was from the illicit relations between Lot and his Daughter Habichira. Habachira called her son Moav, which means, from my father, she was not even embarrassed that she had relations with her father.

But even if one admits that Hashem began our Geulah through the secular Zionist can we continue to recognize the importance of such a state?
I would like to talk about Omri the King of Israel was more evil than any other king before him, read Malachim 16:25, but yet, he merited his kingship to last 3 generations.
Why? R Yochanan said, "Why did Omri deserve Kingship? He added one city to the Land of Israel. " (Sanhdrin 102b)
Chazal tell us that he added that city to undermine the people loyalty to Jerusalem, and even so he merited 3 generations.
Omri's successor, his son Achav was even worse than his father, he allowed his wife to murder all the Torah Scholars, but Hashem still allowed Achav to win wars for His people. Why because Achav and his generation was careful not to speak gossip and Achav fought with all his might for the Jewish People. Achav successor Yehoram, was also just as evil, but he shared the suffering of the Jewish People when Hashem punished them with a drought, by sitting in sackcloth.
We see that Hashem allowed these men to rule because of their love for the Jewish People and the Land of Israel.
Also Yeravam the son of Yoash was given great help by Hashem, even though it says, "He did evil in the eyes of Hashem." Why? "He restored the boarder of Israel from Milvo Chamas until the sea of Arava like the word of Hashem, as he spoke unto the prophet Yona the son of Amitai." (Malachim2: 14: 24-26)

The problems in the State of Israel cannot be compared to the evils perpetrated by the Kings of Israel. After all the State gives incredible amount of money to Yeshivot, builds mikvot and shuls for every community even ones that are dominantly secular, all marriages, divorces and funerals are conducted by the Orthodox State Rabbinate, Shabbat and Chagim are the official holidays of the State, No buses may run from an hour before Shabbat and Chagim until after the holy days, The Army and all official state institutions must keep Kosher by law, all places of public entertainment must be closed until half day on TishaBav.

Can you honestly tell me that I should give fewer honors to this State, than Eliyahu Hanavi gave to King Achav when he ran before his chariot after the incident at Mount Carmel. (Kings 1, 18:46) Chazal say, Achav took all the Torah Scrolls in the Land of Israel and erased the name of Hashem replacing it with the names of all the idols. But yet he was the King of Israel and thus the honor of the People of Israel was upon him.

One may ask that if Hashem has started the redemption than why all the suffering? Why is Lebanon and Gaza bombing us? Why can't we fight back properly? Why is there still so much suffering? Isn't the redemption supposed to stop this?

I saw a beautiful idea.
In Gemara Sanhedrin 98:b, Three scholars, Ullah, Rabbah and R. Yochanan prayed, "Let him come, but let me not see him ", they were afraid of the birth pangs of Mashiach and therefore did not want to be there. Only Rav Yosef disagreed and said, "Let him come and may I be privileged to sit in his donkeys feces". Rav Kook tzl, gives a beautiful explanation, Ullah, Rabbah and R. Yochanan, its not they did not want to see Mashiach, but they would not be able to handle the spiritual downfall immediately before his coming, as it says in Gemara Sota 49:b, " Youngsters will insult their elders, the kingdom will turn heretical". According to Rav Kook, they did not say "let me not be there", but rather, I do not want to see it, I will not be able to handle to great spiritual decline that will occur before Mashiachs arrival. Rav Kook says that Rav Yosef was different. Even if the time before redemption would smell like feces, he still wanted it. Rav Kook adds, the donkey is the only unclean animal that its first born is holy. That is why Rav Yosef used the Donkey, just like the impure donkey brings out something holy so too the geulah can come about from something non-holy, like the secular Zionists.

[faye]

those tiny light blue bits are about as much land as you have left for the palestinians.

[randolph85]

jews had their chance for a holy land for 65 years and turned it into a land of homosexuals and prostitutes. its time to head back to europe and give it back to its rightful owners, the palestinians.

[randolph85]

the pre israel jews who lived in dignity and respect are free to stay, as they didn't turn the holy land into a perversion.

[Yos from tribe of Judea]

jews had their chance for a holy land for 65 years and turned it into a land of homosexuals and prostitutes. its time to head back to europe and give it back to its rightful owners, the palestinians.

You are right in the respect that when we do not follow the laws of God we no longer have a right to stay in the land. This is the main battle that us religious Jews are fighting, we take to the streets and try to show the seculars the way. we go out and show them how to do the commandments like in this picture a man is showing his fellow seuclar Jew who to strap the Teffilin (boxes with verses from the bible) as it says "And it shall be for a sign for you upon your hand, and for a memorial between your eyes, that the law of the Lord may be in your mouth; for with a strong hand did the Lord bring you out of Egypt" Exodus 13:9



You are right we cannot stand this perversion and we know why the Israeli Government themselves expelled 10,000 from their homes in Gaza in 2005. This is divine punishment, and it was the religious Jews who were punished first (all Jews in Gaza were religious) because we did not do enough to bring back the masses from their ways.

[Yos from tribe of Judea]

This was divine punishment for not following the ways of the Torah. I have no doubt about this.

The expulsion of 10,000 Jews from their homes in Gush Katif of the Gaza strip:






This was the great Yeshiva in Gaza before the expulsion



After the expulsion the Arabs of Gaza burned it down

[khushal]

Yos,
What are your thoughts of edward said's theory of a one state solution where palistinians and jews live in one nation with equal rights and privilages and what do you think of the two state solution that is currently the suposed roadmap.

[کیش]

When was this bs "Aryan" theory invented? People say the hebrew theory was invented in the 16th century. I think this Aryan theory was invented around when Timur Shah the Dawus was letting those Aryan fools control him.

[graveyardofempires]

If he consider Pashtuns to be of israeli origin then naturally he would expect from us to shift our loyalty to israel, like Afghanistani Pashtuns who expect from Pakistani Pashtuns to be more loyal to Afghanistan than Pakistan.

what a moronic comaprison
you should eat ... and ...