Pakhtana marrying a Kafir :p

[abassinafghan]

thats maybe true that we have absorbed some kind of people over the time

, BUT those claims are the same as if you would say we are the decendents of the israelits , its nothing more than a claim ...

the theory of turkic ghilzian , were created for two reasons , one to bring miscredit to gilzian(made up by iranians and munguls ) , second to divide us , by claiming that we are not one people ... espicially by british ethnolougs who had their own use of this story !

and i am not a ghilzai by my self !!!!!!!!

besides the theory has got too many weak points , how does it come that those turkic tribes were pashtunized ? how does it come they didnt keep their turkic origin ?especially if they come as conquerers !!! till today arabs are recognized by their names and they keep also by their own ...

i mean turkic people like the uzbeks or the turkmens , till today could keep their language , than it brings us to the point , who were those turks ???

modern day turkey is full of people in all shapes and sizes in all colours , they have no special phaeno typ theirselfes !!!!!!!!! and no most of them were not left overs of the ottoman empire !!! just look for the anatolians , the galaters , cherqesses and azeris and others ... till today no one knows where the turks really came from , and why most of them dont look like mongols even their language are supposed to be decendent of mongolian ...

and dont belive everything you read online regarding your origin ....

[RevolutionThroughReason]

no It's not the claim of being descendants of Israel is based on some mythology. The claim of being descendants of Khaladj Turks is based on Historical Documentation ad Anthropology.

Two very different grades of veracity here.

The Ghiilziyan being Turks was not made by the Iranians or the Moghuls; it's a very recent concept based on Modern Scholarship; So I am not sure where you're deriving any of this from.

The Turkic People like Uzbeks and Turkmen kept their language because they did not intermix much. Just like in Anatolia; they used to speak an Iranian language but eventually they adopted Turkish. Linguistic Exchange is very plastic and elastic.

Central Asians similarly may have been like the Turks of Anatolia; an Indo European peoples who became Turkified. regardless the people who became the Ghilziyan were not originally Pashtuns; so if there were Pashtuns at that time, they would had to have married Pashtun women. The question also remains, where did the Pashtuns come from? Because no one really knows when Pashto became a spoken language. We have no evidence of it prior to the first millenia.

[abassinafghan]

Historical Documentation ad Anthropology

so are the claims of the israelit theory , even the second president of israel , a antropolog wrote in his memoires that pashtuns must be the ten lost tribes .

recent concept based on Modern Scholarship

the recent conecpts are most based on british colonial theories who had their own agendas in dividing our people by spreading such claims , and also the iranians used those claims during mir wais nekas rule ...



you have brought up no point or fact , just repeated the claims of others like parrott

? Because no one really knows when Pashto became a spoken language. We have no evidence of it prior to the first millenia.

well just compare sanskrit ,sogdian ,avestian or kurdish with pashto in a grammatical way , and compare the words and word roots .....


afghan aka pashtun ancestors are mostly , kushan/heptalit, scythian , and proto indo arians , just look up herodots works and look for pakts and the region which he describes ... look up what habibi wrote about it , spare me with your american or brits who claim we make up 30% of the population

and even if some pashtuns may have greek , arab , or turkic origin it would be just a tiny amount , because how could turks in post islamic time , just merge and adopt in such a huge scale , the local traditions in the occupied country which in general were considerd inferrior , and dont leave any sings ? hints ? or root ? .

as i said before till today arabs can be recognised in afghanistan , how does it come that those so called turks can not be recognized ?

how does it come that they were integrated so well ? in a country and society where even today donkeys like you discuss for the sake of division and turkish bakshish so useless discussions with out any proof besides stupid internet articles ...

[RevolutionThroughReason]

so are the claims of the israelit theory , even the second president of israel , a antropolog wrote in his memoires that pashtuns must be the ten lost tribes .

This is false; there is no documentation of this what so ever. There is no evidence that the Second President of Israel was an Anthropologist either; unless you care to demonstrate this.




the recent conecpts are most based on british colonial theories who had their own agendas in dividing our people by spreading such claims , and also the iranians used those claims during mir wais nekas rule ...

you have brought up no point or fact , just repeated the claims of others like parrott

That's better than just making up claims on the spot; so at least I have a source, yours are baseless.

well just compare sanskrit ,sogdian ,avestian or kurdish with pashto in a grammatical way , and compare the words and word roots .....

That just means that Pashto has a common descent with these languages; It doesn't mean Pashto exist or co-existed with these languages The relatedness of Pashto would not prove its antiquity. It may give clues but that's about all. Proof would be some reference from a nearby source of the languages spoken by these people.


Please show a bonafide example of the Pashto language that existed prior to the past millenia.

afghan aka pashtun ancestors are mostly , kushan/heptalit, scythian , and proto indo arians , just look up herodots works and look for pakts and the region which he describes ... look up what habibi wrote about it , spare me with your american or brits who claim we make up 30% of the population

So before you're saying that I am parroting Modern authors, but you're parroting herodotus. Pakt ..and Pashtun are not the same. We don't even know if they're the same word. Bakt could be related to Bakht, which means lucky or good fortune in Avestan, Pushto or Pukhto refers to "Pusht" and "Pukht" which is a word for the "far country". so we can see here there is a false association.

Scholarship is scholarship; the nationaity of the scholarship is not the issue; it is the quality; a researched analysis is more credible than one which isn'.

and even if some pashtuns may have greek , arab , or turkic origin it would be just a tiny amount , because how could turks in post islamic time , just merge and adopt in such a huge scale , the local traditions in the occupied country which in general were considerd inferrior , and dont leave any sings ? hints ? or root ? .

Well The different origins would vary depending on the degree of contact; Turks would have made more contact; because Turks had several kingdoms in Pashtun regions. My grandfather's origin is Muqur in Ghazni, even though they settled Qandahar for many generations they returned back to Ghazni the Ghaznawiyah were central in Ghazni and much of the Turks intermarried with the locals. In all the Chronicles of the Ghaznavid court it talks about Khaladj who were not called Afghans, as apart of the army. This Khaladj or Qalach in Turkish is very related to Ghalji or Ghilzai. Think about who is the most populated tribe in Ghazni, it is the Ghilzai tribes, mainly Sulaiman Khel, Kharoti , Andar, Taraki, Tokhi and so on. These Turks didn't just disappear, only logical conclusion is that they got mixed in. They learned Pashto and became the Ghilzai tribes.

as i said before till today arabs can be recognised in afghanistan , how does it come that those so called turks can not be recognized ?

Well the "Arabs" are so because many people have special descent, like sayyids which have certain social prestige. Like Sad'at-e-Kunarh. They're actually Syrians, their ancestry traces to Northern Syria. But of course because of need to maintain prestige they didn't marry outside much they just used their "prestige" to marry Pashtun ladies. This happened too with Gilaniyan as well.

The Khaladj were just nomadic people and because of their associations as being Ghaznawiyah warriors they just blended with other groups consequently after the fall of the Ghaznawiyah Empire.

how does it come that they were integrated so well ? in a country and society where even today donkeys like you discuss for the sake of division and turkish bakshish so useless discussions with out any proof besides stupid internet articles ...

Well you proved it yourself; some Turks like Uzbeks and Turkmen didn't mix; the others did. So they didn't all mix so well.

[abassinafghan]

This is false; there is no documentation of this what so ever. There is no evidence that the Second President of Israel was an Anthropologist either; unless you care to demonstrate this.

http://www.ybz.org.il/?CategoryID=48...eID=2590&sng=1

The second president of Israel, Itzchak Ben-Zvi, in his book, The Exiled and the Redeemed, devoted a whole chapter to the purported Israelite origins of the Pashtuns. He explained that the Pashtun tribe Rabbani could be the lost Israelite tribe of Reuben; Shinwari could be Shimon; Daftani could be a corruption of Naftali; Jajani – Gad, Afridi – Ephraim, and so on. He quoted local Jews from Afghanistan who had reported to him in the early 1950s that these fierce tribesmen wore an embroidered Hanukka (Jewish Festival of Lights) lamp on their backs. He had heard that they wrapped themselves in a tallith (prayer shawl), and lit candles on Friday night. They also wore, and to this day, insist on keeping their pe’ot (sidecurls). Abraham Benjamin, a Jew from Herat in Afghanistan, reported that “According to the tradition current among the Afridis (one of the Pashtun sub-tribes), they are descendants of the Israelites, more particularly

http://www.isn.ethz.ch/isn/Current-A...4-a6a8c7060233

This Khaladj or Qalach in Turkish is very related to Ghalji or Ghilzai. Think about who is the most populated tribe in Ghazni, it is the Ghilzai tribes, mainly Sulaiman Khel, Kharoti , Andar, Taraki, Tokhi and so on. These Turks didn't just disappear, only logical conclusion is that they got mixed in. They learned Pashto and became the Ghilzai tribes.

ahhahahaha you making just cnlusions because ghilzai may sound like khaladj ??????



and that is your proof ??????, well if you want to be turk be one , and move to tureky they have high standard of living are very well doing , and start to talk kilding bilding belakshi .

I have a source

what source i can claim all kind of bull**** like kite runner and just because a donkey on two legs wrote it is credible ???

read your own scholars not british colonial ones who has got their own agenda , like todays islam experts ....

[Kushan Prince]

I will lose all respect to a Pashtana who marries a kaffir.

[Prince_Pukhtun]

each to their own as long as you are not planning to ruin her life at some stage, got rejected by a pashtun girl who went for two punjabi guys instead, and im not even ugly lol or a douche

there is sadly a stigma around pakhtoon men being animalistic, unreasonable, hypocritical which turns many pukhtana off of them, but makes others attracted to them

ultimately rubberduck, if you are a good man, and will treat her right, then go for it

[Kushan Prince]

each to their own as long as you are not planning to ruin her life at some stage, got rejected by a pashtun girl who went for two punjabi guys instead, and im not even ugly lol or a douche

there is sadly a stigma around pakhtoon men being animalistic, unreasonable, hypocritical which turns many pukhtana off of them, but makes others attracted to them

ultimately rubberduck, if you are a good man, and will treat her right, then go for it

There is NO stigma of pashtun men being any of those you mentioned. If that was the case than pashtana's wouldn't be marying pashtun men till this day. Just cause you had a few bad experiences with Pakhtana's, doesn't mean they won't date pashtun men. You don't speak for all pashtuns so i suggest you keep quiet.

[Joey_Gladstonezai]

The vast majority of Pashtany in the West marry Afghans but they are not always Pashtun Afghans. Instead, most seem to be marrying Afghan Tajiks. This is probably due to the stereotype that the latter are thought of as less controlling.

[Kushan Prince]

The vast majority of Pashtany in the West marry Afghans but they are not always Pashtun Afghans. Instead, most seem to be marrying Afghan Tajiks. This is probably due to the stereotype that the latter are thought of as less controlling.

Not true.

The majority of Pashtana's here in the west only stick with their own race. Ask any Pashtana on here, none of them would even consider marrying a Tajik. If Tajik men are really less controlling than get ready for any early divorce and Pashtun women do anything as they please since the husband doesn't care what his wife is doing when he is not home.

[Joey_Gladstonezai]

Not true.

The majority of Pashtana's here in the west only stick with their own race. Ask any Pashtana on here, none of them would even consider marrying a Tajik. If Tajik men are really less controlling than get ready for any early divorce and Pashtun women do anything as they please since the husband doesn't care what his wife is doing when he is not home.

Pashtuns joining a forum called "Pashtunforums.com" obviously are going to represent a different segment of Pashtuns, those who care more about their ethnicity and so forth.

I am talking about the real world and am not making things up, as harsh as it may come across. I know of dozens of Pashtun families all across the country.

[Kushan Prince]

Pashtuns joining a forum called "Pashtunforums.com" obviously are going to represent a different segment of Pashtuns, those who care more about their ethnicity and so forth.

I am talking about the real world and am not making things up, as harsh as it may come across. I know of dozens of Pashtun families all across the country.

It is mostly pashtun men who get married to Tajiks. It has happened in my family in the past with mostly men. However not for Pashtun women since they are not allowed to marry outside their race.

[Joey_Gladstonezai]

It is mostly pashtun men who get married to Tajiks. It has happened in my family in the past with mostly men. However not for Pashtun women since they are not allowed to marry outside their race.

The good part is that it is not a problem in Afghanistan or Pakistan, where rules are strict and parents arrange marriages. Just in the West where younger Afghans generally try not to make negative distinctions between one another and are in charge of their own marriages. They even pat themselves on the back thinking they did the culturally acceptable thing to marry another Afghan-American. Lol.

[Joey_Gladstonezai]

The society is different in the West, Kushan. There are not many Muslims to choose from, let along Afghans, and forget about Pashtuns. Options are limited and most of the younger generation, especially female, are freer to choose who they want to marry. Pashtun males brought up in the West usually do have Pashtun brides arranged for them overseas which isn't a loss since they are usually expected to be stay-at-home moms anyway and it doesn't matter that much if they don't speak English. But the case of Pashtun females brought up in the West is a bit tougher, because it is naturally in the females'interests to want spouses that are better established in the country for reasons of financial security. This is all out of observing how these young Afghan-American minds work, that's all. Although I do know about a number of Western Pashtun girls that married Pashtun men from Afghanistan but unfortunately, it's only if the latter have outstanding credentials--phD students, having a post with the Afghan government, etc.

[Kushan Prince]

The good part is that it is not a problem in Afghanistan or Pakistan, where rules are strict and parents arrange marriages. Just in the West where younger Afghans generally try not to make negative distinctions between one another and are in charge of their own marriages. They even pat themselves on the back thinking they did the culturally acceptable thing to marry another Afghan-American. Lol.

I agree but atleast marrying an Afghan from America is better than marrying a kafir. Atleast he or she has proper education and can speak English.