Marriage to non-Pashtuns

[Sangeen]

Sangeen,

I think you should take it easy. You have raised some issues. I think what you are saying is that it is difficult for you to find someone due to social and traditional constraints? Am I right?

Well, in that case, maybe you should go to some respected individual who is already married (without any arrangement), and you will find your answers.


I don't know why you are ranting about pashtunwali.

I read what you said. What I take from it is that you wish the culture was less restrictive??

right?

You are trying way too hard to find a problem with me. Let me make it easier for you.

I don't have a problem ALHUMDOLILLAH.. HONESTLY... relax.

Now let me tell you what pisses me off. It is not what you have read about the pashtunwali in textbooks or what you think it is that pisses me off. It how the pashtunwali is on ground that bothers me.

I have written in my previous post and since you have decided to overlook it. I will write it one more time. I do hope you will bother to read it this time.

Cultures like Pashtunwali, are dynamic entities, the get influenced by the environment and they change with time.

Now look at your environment for the last few hundred years. we have been the subject of tricks of foreigners, subjected to wars and led by idiots, fools and now by out right traitors. All what we have got left are the stories of our glorious past.

But these stories will not reduce the child mortality rate in Afghanistan neither will it raise the literacy rate in Pakistan. What annoys me is that whenever I speak to any Pashtun he starts rattling old glorious stories of wars etc like a broken record.

Lets face it, Afghanistan is the world's poorest country. Our main export is "Heroin" Imagine that...... all what we great Pashtuns can give to the world is Poison. Thats all what we have reduced ourselves to.

There is something seriously wrong and something must change. And this "something" is our culture of rashness ignorance following petty hindu traditions and Injustice to our women.

If you think it is all fine please do carry on. But in my opinion there is something seriously wrong.... very very seriously wrong.

Now reference to your second last post and the stuff you mentioned about ppl making stores etc. ...I agree with you on all that. And i can also understand where the girl was coming from and i did mention it to my friend that he should try to understand. But he said and i quote "i dont want to make petty compromises if something that is mine. I will not use it while being scared of others". In good old day we Pashtuns were straightforward, there were no ifs and buts with us.

We would know what is ours and we will use it. Thats why everyone respected us. We were not afraid of others making stories about us cause first there were no low lifers amongst us to make stories and secondly even if someone will dare making false stories they will end up paying with their life.

That was the time when the low life story-makers were afraid of decent men. Now it is the decent man that is afraid of the low life story-makers.

Think about it ... what must be the state of this society where a liar is more confident and his actions are taken as norm compared to that who is merely exercising ownership of his right.


just try thinking about it.... i am talking about principles... thats what pashtunwali is all supposed to be.... OR IS IT?

[Sangeen]

Khorey, he is right there here. Islam say about divorce? and what does your culture say about divorce?

This is what is wrong with our Afghan/Pashtun society....we are so worried about what 'others say.' Really? isnt that Backbiting??? which is completely frowned upon in Islam?if you talk about others marriages....what business do they have to talk about 'you and your husband' or 'you and your wife' Marriage matters are behind close doors and should stay like that....sadly people do not get that


I am sorry, i could actually care less what people say if i am getting divorced. I have been given the choice, by religion to get married....and i have been given the choice by religion to end the marriage if needed to. I get married through Islam way, and i will end the marriage through Islam way. If the marriage was bad and me and my children were miserable...i will ask for a divorce. Obviously i would make sure to make my marriage work, and do everything in my power to keep it....but if it does not work then it just doesnt.

AT least someone is reading.

[Catya Sher]

Superb post 1148.
That should be the starting place of a new thread perhaps.

It's one of the most vital things that need to be looked at honestly.

Brushing under the carpet these problems will not help anyone = especially in the long run.

[faye]

sangeen, that is a beautiful post. it made me cry.

[Sangeen]

Thanks Faye, you know what you gotta do next.

and @Catya Sher.. please do start another thread if you want to. I do believe the discussion is side tracking here. just like our culture has side tracked over the last few decades.

[Nokia_Apridy]

janga janga toor sha...

Admina Ta ba Poy ka awo za darta Odas warkam

da PARSIWANU topic na da zka ba Da bkawas lekey...

da Yu bal Poy ka da sa shi ta GADAGEY ?

[qunduz92]

we are the way we are today due to foreign interference, and the bloody wars they have imposed on us.

[Nokia_Apridy]

kakargirl everyone is not your brothers. different people have different rules and principles for reasons only known to them and God by which they choose to live their life. okay??

DZJ everyone sta Ghunday na da...

Chay da ODAS da nawe num ya hem ma Akhla da DRANU PUKHTANU

Khwandu Myandu...

[IamDZJ]

Admina Ta ba Poy ka awo za darta Odas warkam

da PARSIWANU topic na da zka ba Da bkawas lekey...

da Yu bal Poy ka da sa shi ta GADAGEY ?

ka da parsiwananu topic wey no da zeno zeno spikyano tla ratla pa key na wey. da kho d pakhto zor dey chi spiyano ta hum d insanaano gundey haiseyat warkawol kegi.
maa bandey ba zan na spakawey nan. zma hasey na pa sar dard dey. zrra ba darbandey tash kam.

[Nokia_Apridy]

we are the way we are today due to foreign interference, and the bloody wars they have imposed on us.

BA da BA Dar Ogaday Khbray kray wu khu dalta

ka Dranay Khwanday Dasey shtey chay da Hagu Mayanday DA Migrate famly

na raghaley di ....Zka zmung MAyanday di KHu za YArgama

Chay da MOOR pa Khuna ka Hagu Waduna wakru nu saba

ba da haga BACHEY PUKHTANA NA balkay PARSIWAN wei...

wala chay KHUNA PA PLAR Psay zi

[qunduz92]

to all the so-called pakhtuns who advocate marriage outside of ethnicity, go ahead and be our guests. while you're at it, though, you'd better renounce pakhtunwali and ties to pakhto as well.

the fact is that if you went to the millions of sar-terai lewani pakhtana back home, telling them to marry out, they will kick you back to where you belong. no matter how hard self-concious, malicious trolls try, they will not give up their traditions spanning thousands of years.

the genuine pakhtana, the real pakhtana matter. at the end of the day, it is their decision and opinion that counts and i can assure you the culture there is extremely stubborn and xenophobic and it will stay that way. the opinions of online trolls will never reach them or count. if superpowers tried and failed, a handful of trolls dont have much of a chance either.

we are proud of who we are and wish to continue our legacy as God's battleaxe nation with whom He (swt) crushes superpowers whenever He (swt) wants, He (swt) carries out their demise through us. usamah went from sudan to afghanistan, and lured america in intentionally because whenever people are fed up with superpowers the solution is to trap them in afghanistan. its our undiluted, preserved culture of standing up for haq, nang aw ghairat, that causes us to always be there for our Lord and fulfill our duties to Him swt. i am sure if the prophet Nabi (saw) were alive, he would love us and our culture. our culture, after all, is from God as well due its foundation being based upon the Mosaic law. having a culture as such, reinforces our identity as practicing muslims and is a driving-force of its own. some of the closest arabs to the prophet (Saw) who came directly from his line and fought jihad in afghanistan never reprimanded us for our pakhtunwali but rather extolled us as a glorious nation dear to them.

[Alchemist]

Sure, but that doesn't explain how someone is immodest in every SINGLE aspect of life - just by having a boyfriend. So, do you wanna explain to me HOW if Girl X has a boyfriend, she's immodest in every aspect of life and every aspect of practicing Islam (or how Boy X having a girlfriend is immodest in every possible way)? Is that ALL there is to modesty, just not having a boyfriend? Or does modesty go beyond that and that's just one element of it?

If you wanna talk about Islam with me, then you must be willing to listen. Because when it comes to Islam, I don't say anything unless I know exactly 100% what I'm talking about and have concrete evidence or a cogent explanation. And it's with folks like you that discussing Islam is useless and difficult because ALL you can say is X is haraam and that's it. We're not trained to ponder.

[roadrunner]

Roshina's right actually chemist.

I didn't read what she wrote, but she's right.

I've lost count of the number of girlfriends i've had, but I wouldn't really describe myself as immodest at all.

[Catya Sher]

Alchemist,
that barometer reading is absolutely right.

It's a great way to illustrate visually with some humor too, that
immodesty is a quality which runs throughout a person.

It NEVER NEVER NEVER would be isolated in one area only

The whole idea is a cop-out to justify being "liberal' in one department.
It's a way to assuage deep inner guilt, to say that the rest of someone's life
is going to be in great order.

As far as roadrunner, that is preposterous! Your ego is gigantic

Who would speak like that ?

Notice all the I's:
'I've lost count' so aren't "I" Mr Incredible ? - of 'girlfriends'
Talk about boasting !

Therefore no one could ever believe YOUR assessment of yourself
as modest !

..."so I wouldn't describe MYSELF as..."

It is easy to discern a person who is not on ANY spiritual path.

Instead, this person suffers from very severe overblown ego problems.

Besides what he wrote is repellent from any angle whatsoever.

[Alchemist]

Roshina's right actually chemist.

I didn't read what she wrote, but she's right.

I've lost count of the number of girlfriends i've had, but I wouldn't really describe myself as immodest at all.

no...


you are very modest













....and a very good actor