Problem with Islam?

[Toramana]

What is a cultural Muslim wrora? I respect what you belief in but you lost me there.

Shlombay, I mean I am an ordinary Muslim and want to keep my Islam to myself...

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Mahzala is my favorite member. She is exactly how I want every Muslimah to be but she cant hide that there is another woman on the staff who socializes and has insulted and contradicted Islam with every chance she gets. MeemWawMeemNoon knows what I am talking about.

PF is our community and we will not let anyone take over this site. We aren't giving up without a fight. Forever will I remain on PF and forever will this site remain ours. I love all atheists but those Muslims who say they are Muslim yet even say God isn't one or can be more are the problem.

My other posts, read into them.

As shlombay noted, those who declare themselves Athiest, good for them. NO PROBLEM. Just don't attack Islam without reason, even if you get the backing of a sell-out.

Just this request.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Takbeer!

allah u akbar

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

GOD BLESS ADMIN KHAN FOR SUCH A PERFECT SELECTION. WHERE IS THAT FOOL ANYWAY. HE SEEMS TO BE HIDING. HE THINKS HE IS TOO GOOD FOR US NOW.

She's alone, she needs help. Aside from her, we don't have anyone else who won't join along when Islam is being used as a means to making people laugh.

[*Mahzala*]

Mahzala, did you not hear momin? He said takbeer..

Allahu Akbar =)

I thought him quoting yours, and my silent response, would suffice.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

admin khan and tor khan always help me. So i cant act like they dont do anything.

Tor khan is my go to man. I just pm him and my problem gets resolved.

You should try it. You cant expect things to get done by it self.



This is not a video game ok?

Leave those two aside. They are roses of the same garden. They are good guys.

[*Mahzala*]

we always like to read your posts.

Dont you ever be silent. We need you to re affirm our beleifs.

You have been appointed as our leader. Subhan allah.

Likewise Shlombay. Your presence here is always noticed, but not often spoken aloud. I have been trusted to a responsibility, nothing more, nothing less. Leadership is something I am yet to learn. I have a long way to go.

Khuday de sta darajaat uchat ki, pe de duniya au pe haghe, che te ma pe dumra kha alfaazo yadaye.

[Manzareh]

Islam would not get attacked if it was not for pretentious Muslims siding with its enemies all the time. These "Muslims" join the side of Islam's enemies when the attacking happens, and then disgracefully put on a smile as if nothing happened. When confronted, they say that they were trying to help Muslims by trying to make them see what its enemies were trying to say--all the while attacking Islamic tenets by quoting the Quran out of context.

This is the state of some people on this forum who have gained the respect of the enemies of Islam, and are trying to preserve that respect at all costs.

Ive noticed this too and i find it extremly dissapointing and appauling

[Manzareh]

Manzareh, my first post directed towards you since you've joined. So I begin with a welcome. You're among the handful who raise this topic. I agree with your concern and I thought the same in the first stages of this websites creation. You may think what changed my views about responding to and refuting certain claims, ridiculing and the mockery that is coming out. While in my own personal life, Islam is at the forefront where every decision and act begins and ends at it, I have changed my stance on this forum, for many reasons. The most prominent, and the one I desire to share, is that some of our very own Muslims advance Islam in every topic that is conferred, and step out of line, yet they justify their ill-manners as a teaching of this flawless religion. I have a problem with that.I am a Muslim, yet I am not someone who will argue that the words of non-Muslims mean little because he doesn't have a foot-long beard or because she doesn't wear a khimaar that sweeps the streets she walks . I am a Muslim, living in a western country, yet I am not someone who intends to over power the people of this country with violent measures to accept my Deen. I am a Muslim, and a human, who has committed all sorts of bad, and good, but neither of it gives me the right to sale so high that when I am reminded of my past, my fall is so hurtful I begin to demean and humiliate others. I have a problem with that. And these kinds of arguments have been debated here, and the result is insult after insult directed at the person at the receiving end, which is almost always, a non-Muslim or a deviant. That said, we've (as staff) drew a fine line between mocking Islam in the name of questioning, and many a time, via our private communication mediums, this is conferred to the extent that warnings about a members presence here are issued. Pointing out the loopholes and inconsistencies in other religions, including Islam, is one thing. Degrading its followers and its teachings, is another. This site gives very little room to the latter, however, if such debates do proceed, it is solely that - a debate. As I said, I agree with your concern, but at the end of the day, the only thing that can change it, is our own behavior and approach, and not diffused responsibility.

Salaams Mahzala, thank you for your indepth post expressing your personal feelings, however to me your beliefs seem somewhat confusing, it seems asthough your desperate to keep everyone happy which i think is impossible. Being a Muslim and a Pakhtun iv been raised never to backdown from something that i think is right, if answering a non-muslim back is stepping accross the line then i will gladly step accross the line, although im not the strongest of muslims i have more honor than to just sit back and listen to people blaspheme about this blessed Islam and do nothing about it incase it ruins my rep in a internet forum. I take an attack on the Quran personal, more personal than an attack on my identity as a pakhtun. As you will get to know im a blunt person and i wont be indirect about matters, saying this id like to mention that im ashamed that our moderators such as Shlombay glorify blatent enemies of Islam such as M16 and Pir_rokhan (which recently posted a large article blaspheming about the 'koran' and hadiths)..maybe im wrong.

"I am a Muslim, yet I am not someone who will argue that the words of non-Muslims mean little because he doesn't have a foot-long beard or because she doesn't wear a khimaar that sweeps the streets she walks"

This is one of the reasons i decided to post this thread, to Islamicly remove and misconceptions of our religion, i think its our duty as muslims to address the Kufaar in there derrogative claims againts us instead of simply ignoring them as the impression i get from alot of Muslims here.

Were not here to over power the people of this country with violent measures to accept the Deen. Were not here to demean and humiliate others. Were not here to Insult a non-Muslim or a deviant. Were not here to degrade people..WERE HERE TO STOP IT HAPPENING TO US..as as you know the debates about our religon come to us as non muslims join for what other reason? not saying they do not input positivly at all but its obviously also an attack, as muslims we have to defend an attack.

"the only thing that can change it, is our own behavior and approach, and not diffused responsibility"

i believe that is only part of the change. but thats only my opinion.
take care sis.

[*Mahzala*]

Manzareh, as I said in an earlier post of mine, our concerns are the same, our expressions are different. My desires do lie in always saying things that do not cause disappointment, however that is not my sole aim, nor a desperation. In fact, I have tasted many things on this forum, backbiting, backstabbing, ridiculing, mockery - all on a personal level. So for me, keeping people happy, when I was at the receiving end of the latter, should not even be the last of my concerns. I'd prefer the pleasure of my Creator at the expense of upsetting a mass of people for my differences in beliefs and opinions. My post was merely something I have come to learn and attitudes I have decided to adopt on online spaces.

As I said earlier, my Deen is my pride, my identity and my honour. Certainly, I care little for an online reputation when I have to weigh it alongside defending my religion, but at the same time, my religion teaches me respect and honouring of other individuals for their beliefs and opinions, and avoiding ways that can demean and humiliate others, even if it is through being outright. Lack of a better explanation, but when I joined an online space as this four years ago, I expressed the same concerns. My experiences have brought me to the conclusions I have made above. I am not suggesting you are new to cyberspace or anything of the like, but I had misconceptions, grave ones about certain members, put them on cloud nine in my little world, and when some expressed their true colours, I was hurt that they justify their actions in the name of Islam.

I feel the way to solve many things is dialogue and we can do that here, better than many places. In a nutshell, for I feel it is misunderstood, my initial post in this thread was only to say that before we begin to ask for our rights of others, we should question the image of Islam we are putting out there, to the masses, lest we come across as two-faced, confused or hypocritical. I have said this before, the reason for my absence in coming to the defence of my religion lies solely in the lack of knowledge on my part. If I have something to say, I do.

[Manzareh]

Roshina could you be more specific and mention names instead of he/she, am not even sure wether your above post was directed to me or not? i'l take it as it is me as youve failed to type the name of the person your refering to. Well i didnt say anything about a moderator directly insulting islam, if that was the case i would have left the group as i would be under the impression that if the leaders of this group are like this then i regard the group as being 'lost'. i gave a name of a moderator Shlomabay (which i also respect after seeing his posts) but have also seen him write on M16's wall saying "your an asset" and there is a person called Pir_rokhan which i have seen on a couple of occasions take the piss out of islam and yet i noticed a post from Shlombay saying how he values him and that hes a scholar, please note i have nothing againt Shlombay or anyone for having there own opinions as its a free world, if your into secularism and not too bothered about islamic values then its your decision. and im not whining and as you can see standing up for my religion. thanks

[Manzareh]

Its not your duty to address the Kuffar about claims against Islam.

It is your duty to address your fellow Muslims in the Muslim world to stop terrorising people in the name of Islam and thats including Muslims.

Nobody in the UK needs to be addressed about Islam, people already know about Islam and if the British really Hated Islam, they would have put anjum chaundry on trial for treason but yet the British Public are very tolarant and kind.

If a 7/7 was committed by christians in the Muslim world, every christian would have been attacked across the Muslim world, yet we are so supple and kind enough to brush it off our shoulders.

Pir rokhan posted a great thread about contradictions of Hadith and Quran, Bukhari was a violent minded Hadith writer who has contradicted not only the Quran but also science.

Have a great day

You show all the signs of a scared individual that is clearly not looking for answers, you come into a group full of muslims and post major topics like 7/7 bombings, and attack the whole Quran and Hadiths all in one post knowing its not possible to answer back giving the vastness of the topics. but to break it down to you:

1) Who the hell are you to tell me where my dutys are? your a nobody.

2) "If a 7/7 was committed by christians in the Muslim world, every christian would have been attacked across the Muslim world,"

ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND? ARE YOU DEAF? DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW MANY MUSLIMS HAVE BEEN KILLED,ORPHANED AND LIVES DESTROYED BY CHRISTIAN COUNTRIES?? although every muslim council of any standing has condemned the 7/7 bombing or any violence, what the hell is 7/7 complared to MILLIONS of muslims affected by the Iraq war, and also things like the Palestine genocide commited by Israeli terrorists widely supported by chiristian countries. open your eyes before you open your mouth.

3) "Pir rokhan posted a great thread about contradictions of Hadith and Quran, Bukhari was a violent minded Hadith writer who has contradicted not only the Quran but also science."

it wasnt a great thread as it had so many points it wasnt possible to address each and every point which made it a one sided post that didnt enable a reply which made it an incredibly crap post. your have opinions of Bukhari and that he was a violent mided hadith writer, but thats all it is, its just your opinion, the same way i think your a lost case that has nothing better to do but post BS on this forum about people you have a problem with but then again it doesnt mean i'm right.

and cheers, i am having a great day obviously as im a muslim

[Manzareh]

and M16 iv asked you about 7 times to state your religiouos beliefs if you have any. and your ethnicity. unless of course your ashamed

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

MI6,
oh the logical fallacies which ruin the dishonest mind.

Despite facing many opposition from Muslims, I have never turned against them. You will never find an example of Ahmadis conspiring and executing ill against Muslims. NEVER.

The people who have, like some of the people on this forum, brought Islam harships are sell-outs who have made a living by committing treachery against Islam. Don't be fooled by their disgraceful smiles.

You will recognize them becauyse they always agree with Atheists and Islam's enemies, and always have something to say to counter their own brethren, one example is Roshina. Just pay attention you will see. Many already have.

[Catya Sher]

Thanks, Manzareh.
I'm SO glad you are here with us.

Mahzala means really well and I'm sure she's a very kind individual.
But my eyes glaze over her words every time.
She doesn't really SAY ANYthing - it's a mishmash of what Manzareh said:
desperation to keep the peace, keep people calm, give out a carrot to every faction.

Not one carrot is ever offered to the very serious-minded ones, who she and most people make sure to be heard to knock whenever these topics arise.
I'm speaking of SK. Formerly Sangar. With the Arabic script username.

Maybe you won't exactly agree with him, either, Manzareh.
But read his older posts against secularism - there's a great essay I only came across recently dated July 17, 2010, I think, in answer to a JanAssekzai who I guess got recruited or something for he's no longer here...!

Sk is very very strong in his faith and ability to fight these often abrasive types like MI-6, and the entire crew of skeptics of Islam.
If not outright unbelievers in it.

So --- they make sure to denounce every time which derogatory terms.
These adjectives, the people never see as applying to their own juvenile attacks on Islam and unceasing vitriol toward those members with the will power to not cave in to "popular demand" - i.e. the tidal wave of opinion here on THIS site against Islam, against those will uphold its principles.

For example, no one is brave enough to say that Jihad is necessary or important.

Huge numbers of the members are so intimidated by the Western mentality because they were brought up in America or Europe or other so-called Christian lands.
They are too timid to uphold Islam more than celebrating Eid or perhaps fasting.

Only a few have the backbone to NOT give in to the overwhelming secular mindset of the populations amongst whom they reside.
Especially, that which infests the school systems in which they study.