To accept Islam

[PFgulalai]

You are from Pakistan? I guess you do the same when you apply for your passport!

How have you been sister?

Wassup Bro? Me iz not bad

No, I am from Pashtunnkhwa.

That is ridiculous. No wonder Pakistan is a mess.

Gulalai does Pakistan still have an Ahmadi community?

Your analysis about Pakistan is not wrong....It is a mess!!hahah xd.
I am not sure about the present number but the last time figure was 3 or 4 million???

[Wrayun]

^How would explain 7:35 and 4:69?

Those verses can hardly be interpreted as justification for new prophets.


7:35

O children of Adam, if there come to you messengers from among you relating to you My verses, then whoever fears Allah and reforms - there will be no fear concerning them, nor will they grieve. 7:35

The "messengers" here is obviously speaking to all the communities that had already received messages, in particular those who rejected them. This is made clear by the corresponding verse:

But the ones who deny Our verses and are arrogant toward them - those are the companions of the Fire; they will abide therein eternally. 7:36

4:69

And whoever obeys Allah and the Messenger - those will be with the ones upon whom Allah has bestowed favor of the prophets, the steadfast affirmers of truth, the martyrs and the righteous. And excellent are those as companions.


How do you deduce from above any justification for prophethood? In that case everyone who obeys Allah and the Messenger is a prophet. The verse simply implies that obedient followers are seen in the same light as prophets, martyers etc.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

7:35 refers to messengers, being sent at any time, who will recite Allah's verses.
4:69 refers to anyone following the Prophet (saw) could reach the status of a prophet.

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

Which leads me back to another point I made earlier? Who is the authority in Islam?

Check this out, a comprehensive answer to your question: Concept of Authority in Islam || Imam Reza (A.S.) Network

I hope it helps you out a bit answering your question.

[Mujib]

An excellent introduction:



Islam: Religion of Life

[Wrayun]

7:35 refers to messengers, being sent at any time, who will recite Allah's verses.

The way I see it, the whole surah is directed towards the whole of man kind. When it is referring to prophets/messengers, it is doing so in general sense, and is talking to "children of Adam" as in the whole of humanity, to take in consideration all the prophets/messengers of God that had been sent. Even those who might not have been sent to their own communities. I don't see any indication for future prophets (ie. will be sent any time) there. Instead a general warning to everyone to not reject the prophets already known. It is a warning to all who have rejected the previous prophets/messengers, and to those who have not known them yet.

You are interpreting these verses to your liking in support of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. I can't argue with that, that is in your interest to do so. But I disagree. I don't see any major reason for Mirza Ghulam Ahmad to be a messenger or for that matter any other messenger after the Prophet Mohammad because any new messenger has to outdo the Quran. Their message has to be unique in its own way to stand out, and verifiable as a miracle. All the new age "messengers" have not superseded the Prophet Mohammad in likeness. They have all become obscured in comparison to him. They are more like cult leaders in status, not Prophets.

4:69 refers to anyone following the Prophet (saw) could reach the status of a prophet.

Read that verse again, it clearly states "those will be with the ones whom Allah has bestowed favor of the prophets" not "those will be the ones whom Allah has bestowed favor of the prophets"... meaning that they will be held in the same light with those who are of prophets, martyrs, and of the righteous.

In layman terms, obedient followers will be equal in standard to prophets, martyrs and other pious people.

[Dust]

Dust what is preventing you from embracing to Islam? What is your problem with Islam?

Dust, what has held you back from reverting to Islam?

The million dollar question!

Well, for one, I am not new to Islam. As many of you would have read, I am well verse with Islam and especially with the Quran. In fact, it is part of my research tool. I find that the Quran has layed out many things in simple term that we all take for granted due to progress in "intellectualism."

Intellectualism is very deceiving. Many scholars think that for them to be accepted they should not make reference to any religious scripture for it is man made. Well, what they don't realize is that intellectual thought is also man made, if we were to compare and contrast.

As I have always mentioned that if God does not exist, Muhammad must have been a genius.

The one thing that turns me off from Islam, is the mosque and Muslims' blind reliance on their scholars. I find that most of the sermon givers are totally aloof to what is happening in the world and are only focused on spreading the idea that you will have the other world. You can't do this. Not at all. You are living here today, so how is it possible that you dream about tomorrow. If you don't take care of today, tomorrow will not happen. Life is not about food, sex and sleep, and the Hereafter. There is more to it.

That is what is keeping me. I don't want to get into arguments with "scholars." Because I don't want to lower their respect in front of their people, for I know that most laymen are good-hearted but just that they are blind followers and in-turn are a means to the ends of the leaders. That is why I am seeking authority within Islam. There must be a form of Divine authority out there, if Islam is correct. My only hope is the Quran, for it mentions that a false god is dead and can't speak. That is why I have given up on Christianity, if Jesus is God then he should speak today as he spoke 2000 years ago.

So, all in all, Islam gives me hope only because of the Quran and not because of the people. God is not mentioned to be stationary and limited and influenced by human action. If so, then He must speak today as He spoke yesterday. This can only be true if their exist Divine authority today within the Muslims. Once, I find that authority in Islam, then I will accept Islam, for I know that it was not Muhammad's ingenuity but rather God's revelation.

[Dust]

Check this out, a comprehensive answer to your question: Concept of Authority in Islam || Imam Reza (A.S.) Network

I hope it helps you out a bit answering your question.

Interesting read. I will post my opinion on it later on today or tomorrow.

You are too kind to me. You always give me good material.

[Dust]

An excellent introduction:



Islam: Religion of Life

I am not new to Islam, as I mentioned above, but since you have taken the time to introduce me to this book, I will buy it.

Dera manana, wror.

[Dust]

I am really interested in this discussion between MeemWawMeemNoon and my friend Wrayun.

One question to MeemWawMeemNoon, if Quran declares the Islamic Law to be final, then how is it possible for another prophet to come? This is just a question that popped up, however, I am open to the idea. It goes back to my thirst to know more about Divine patterns.

You two can proceed, I will not disturb you.

[Fahd]

there s one man who can change what u think in MeemWawMeemNoon wrora
it's Dust
Dust keep ask him this questions and my god help u twice to the real islam ameen
i send u pm

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Dearest Wrayun,

the condition of the verse is one who obeys will be blessed with certain favours. We pray for these certain favours every single time we pray Surah Al Fatihah. If we will not be bestowed these favours then why are we asking Allah to guide us; and what are we asking Him to guide us towards?

So, according to 4:69, prophethood is one of the favours of Allah.

[Wrayun]

Dearest Wrayun,

the condition of the verse is one who obeys will be blessed with certain favours. We pray for these certain favours every single time we pray Surah Al Fatihah. If we will not be bestowed these favours then why are we asking Allah to guide us; and what are we asking Him to guide us towards?

So, according to 4:69, prophethood is one of the favours of Allah.

Dearest MWMN,

I disagree, and gave my reasons already. Interpreting those verses like the way you are, make things more complicated. Now Mirza Ghulam Ahmed was a very smart man, I read some of his work in addressing some of the accusations that were raised by the British against the Prophet and Islam, but I don't believe that he was a messenger, nor a prophet.

Any messenger of God, in modern time, will have to match or outdo the Prophet of Islam i.e. Mohammad and the people of this time. Because...we are no longer the simpletons of the past. We would require MORE than ever, to be convinced, today, of any divinely inspired message.

The message has to be judged according to it's time, and how radical it was for that day and age.

Personally speaking of course.

[شمله ور خراساني]

Qadiani, your false interpretation of quranic ayat were refuted by several members on this forum.

Not only did you not take heed when truth was revealed to your qadiani head, but you are shamelessly continued to spread your poison.

You are lucky you are in a "democratic country". Because in Afghanistan we have a good solution for qadianis. I am sure you nasty punjabi priests have told you quite alot about it.

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

Qadiani, your false interpretation of quranic ayat were refuted by several members on this forum.

Not only did you not take heed when truth was revealed to your qadiani head, but you are shamelessly continued to spread your poison.

You are lucky you are in a "democratic country". Because in Afghanistan we have a good solution for qadianis. I am sure you nasty punjabi priests have told you quite alot about it.

Yaar, yo kho ta har cheta ke khpala makhuka wahe. Aw biya jawab ham dase jawab wi che sari ta khanda rashi. If you can't talk in a civilized manner, without insulting others, then don't talk at all.