Shia Islam for Dummies: Ask Those who Know

[Abu Hurayrah]

[Shakir 3:166] And what befell you on the day when the two armies met (at Ohud) was with Allah's knowledge, and that He might know the believers.
[Shakir 3:167] And that He might know the hypocrites; and it was said to them: Come, fight in Allah's way, or defend yourselves. They said: If we knew fighting, we would certainly have followed you. They were on that day much nearer to unbelief than to belief. They say with their mouths what is not in their hearts, and Allah best knows what they conceal.


[Shakir 3:176] And let not those grieve you who fall into unbelief hastily; surely they can do no harm to Allah at all; Allah intends that He should not give them any portion in the hereafter, and they shall have a grievous chastisement.

[Shakir 8:16] And whoever shall turn his back to them on that day-- unless he turn aside for the sake of fighting or withdraws to a company-- then he, indeed, becomes deserving of Allah's wrath, and his abode is hell; and an evil destination shall it be.

[Shakir 3:144] And Muhammad is no more than a messenger; the messengers have already passed away before him; if then he dies or is killed will you turn back upon your heels? And whoever turns back upon his heels, he will by no means do harm to Allah in the least and Allah will reward the grateful.

[Shakir 3:151] We will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve, because they set up with Allah that for which He has sent down no authority, and their abode is the fire, and evil is the abode of the unjust. (COWARDS WHO RAN AWAY IN AUHAD)

[Shakir 9:26] Then Allah sent down His tranquillity upon His Messenger and upon the believers, and sent down hosts which you did not see, and chastised those who disbelieved, and that is the reward of the unbelievers.


[Shakir 8:20] O you who believe! obey Allah and His Messenger and do not turn back from Him while you hear.
[Shakir 8:21] And be not like those who said, We hear, and they did not obey.

[Shakir 8:23] And if Allah had known any good in them He would have made them hear, and if He makes them hear they would turn back while they withdraw.
[Shakir 8:24] O you who believe! answer (the call of) Allah and His Messenger when he calls you to that which gives you life; and know that Allah intervenes between man and his heart, and that to Him you shall be gathered.

Who am I to say something about your leaders? I am no one, but the above ayas are something. Now say who is Allah to say such words against your "sahaba" (astaghfirullah), and be among the transgressors? After leaving the Prophet (SAW) all of your so called sahaba became disbelievers as per the above ayahs. And I have never read in history they ever accepting the Islam again (I mean, when you become disbeliever you HAVE TO RECITE THE KALMA E SHAHADA AGAIN WITH THE INTENTION THAT YOU ARE KAFFIR AND WANT TO BECOME MUSLIM). So, who are you Abu Hurayra to say something regarding that which Allah has stated in Quran?

"And it is not for a believing man or woman that they should have any choice in a matter when Allah and his Messenger have decided a matter; and whoever disobeys Allah and his Messenger; surely strays off a manifest straying."

Are you still here and stil you are trying to prive your khariji aqeedah?

- The verses you post are about the hypocrites who REFUSED to go to Jihaad when it was fardh.

- The verses are NOT about the SAHABA OF UHUD. You said:

I am not a follower of those who "run away" (i.e. the marathon champs of Ghazva e Auhad), so I hope you would think twice next time before speaking

It was about the battle of Uhud and the Sahaba who did not follow the order of the prophet peace be upon him. You was making fun of them while Allah forgave them for their mistake.

But now you are whining and crying, posting ayaat about the munafiqin and trying to prove what? There where propably munafiqin in Madina? Yes there where, but what are you exactly trying to do? If you have the courage, you answer don't run away or use caps-lock too much. Just do not lie and don't post stuff out of context, and as a tip, consider certain things which you have said as faulty and make tawbah.

I don't know what you really did here, posting verses from Surah Tawbah, Al Anfal etc.

My question again, Allah forgave those Sahaba who did not follow the order of the prophet (s.a.w) at the battle of UHUD, who are you Haider Bangash 0.0 to make fun of them? This was the topic, the Sahaba who disobeyd the command of the prophet. Nothing more, nothing less.

After leaving the Prophet (SAW) all of your so called sahaba became disbelievers as per the above ayahs

And this explains to all of us that you was performing (taqqiyah) like all shi'as are supposed to do. It is Mustahabb for you. Now everyone knows that according to you and your aqeedah , the sahaba are non believers.

And you are, cursing the Sahaba without knowledge, like a fool, on the 27th night of Ramadan. Masha allah.

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

Are you still here and stil you are trying to prive your khariji aqeedah?

- The verses you post are about the hypocrites who REFUSED to go to Jihaad when it was fardh.

- The verses are NOT about the SAHABA OF UHUD. You said:

It was about the battle of Uhud and the Sahaba who did not follow the order of the prophet peace be upon him. You was making fun of them while Allah forgave them for their mistake.

But now you are whining and crying, posting ayaat about the munafiqin and trying to prove what? There where propably munafiqin in Madina? Yes there where, but what are you exactly trying to do? If you have the courage, you answer don't run away or use caps-lock too much. Just do not lie and don't post stuff out of context, and as a tip, consider certain things which you have said as faulty and make tawbah.

I don't know what you really did here, posting verses from Surah Tawbah, Al Anfal etc.

My question again, Allah forgave those Sahaba who did not follow the order of the prophet (s.a.w) at the battle of UHUD, who are you Haider Bangash 0.0 to make fun of them? This was the topic, the Sahaba who disobeyd the command of the prophet. Nothing more, nothing less.

Consult with your Mullah or scholar because the above verses are from Surah Ale Imran (and only SOME are from other verses) and they are all very well related to GHAZVA E AUHAD and other Ghazwaat). Throughout this whole discussion, I had to explain everything to you like you are baby and that's the main reason I ended this discussion, and here you are again, acting childishly. The verses I posted are only a few aya above the verse that YOU POSTED, It's funny how you just copied one verse without reading the whole Surat (i.e. Ale Imran), and the verses before and after the verses that you posted.

And this explains to all of us that you was performing (taqqiyah) like all shi'as are supposed to do. It is Mustahabb for you. Now everyone knows that according to you and your aqeedah , the sahaba are non believers.

You are frustrated lol. I am not afraid of you or any other of your brotehrs, or anyone for that matter, so I don't need to do "taqqiyah" dear. And as I said in my earlier post, according to you everyone who sees the prophet(SAW) is a SAHABA. What a joke. So stop putting words in my mouth. I don't consider your leaders as SAHABA. Sahaba to me are those like "ABUZAR GHAFAR (RA)", SALMAN (RA), BILAL (RA), etc. So don't desperate dear. And according to our aqeeda and per above ayahs, MUNAFIQEEN ARE DISBELIEVERS. So munafiqeen won't become muslims or SAHABA by your sayings. Call them "sahaba" 100000 of times, but they will be defined as MUNAFIQEEN by Quran. Nothing you can do to change it now.

[Abu Hurayrah]

Consult with your Mullah or scholar because the above verses are from Surah Ale Imran (and only SOME are from other verses) and they are all very well related to GHAZVA E AUHAD and other Ghazwaat). Throughout this whole discussion, I had to explain everything to you like you are baby and that's the main reason I ended this discussion, and here you are again, acting childishly. The verses I posted are only a few aya above the verse that YOU POSTED, It's funny how you just copied one verse without reading the whole Surat (i.e. Ale Imran), and the verses before and after the verses that you posted.

Why are you running away? We where talking about the Sahaba who disobeyed the prophet on the mount of Uhud. Why aren't you answering instead of directing me to my ''mullah''? Come on, don't be afraid. And even if certain Sahaba where crisized in Surah Imran for dosobeying the prophet peace be upon him, then after, Allah excuses them and he forgives them like I posted.

Surah Al Imraan
Aya: 152
And Allah did indeed fulfil His Promise to you when you were killing them (your enemy) with His Permission; until (the moment) you lost your courage and fell to disputing about the order, and disobeyed after He showed you (of the booty) which you love. Among you are some that desire this world and some that desire the Hereafter. Then He made you flee from them (your enemy), that He might test you. But surely, He forgave you, and Allah is Most Gracious to the believers.

Now you are terribly stuck and trying like a fish in the desert. You are nobody, nothing, if Allah has forgiven them. If you are man enough and have some taqwa left there, take your words and your jokes back, it would be better for you.

You are frustrated lol. I am not afraid of you or any other of your brotehrs, or anyone for that matter, so I don't need to do "taqqiyah" dear. And as I said in my earlier post, according to you everyone who sees the prophet(SAW) is a SAHABA. What a joke. So stop putting words in my mouth. I don't consider your leaders as SAHABA. Sahaba to me are those like "ABUZAR GHAFAR (RA)", SALMAN (RA), BILAL (RA), etc. So don't desperate dear.

why etc.etc. You have no one left, because you made Takfir on all of them.
I am not frustrated, not at all. alhamdolillah. And I did not say that whoever had seen the prophet was a Sahaba. You have to do Taqqiyah, I know, because your holy imam said so, it is Mustahab according to your books while debating a ''nasibi kafir'' like me.

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

I am the one running away? hahahaha. You tell good jokes.

Allah only pardon those who repent. Allah does not pardon those who didn't repent. LOL and all the above Ayas are regarding the marathon champions of Auhad. LOL here use this tafseer site of your sect to check all of the above verses I posted;
http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?...0&LanguageId=2

LOL don't use that wor again "running away" because it makes me laugh. And it's funny, how you interpret things words like "grievous chastisement" and "their abode is the fire" like it's nothing LOL. Again my dear, you only get FORGIVENESS only when you REPENT. Your leaders NEVER repented after deserting Auhad. Show me anywhere, from YOUR OWN books where they repented, haha, but stop RUNNING AWAY haha by posting rubbish such as this

You have to do Taqqiyah, I know,

and I am glad you said MY "holy imam". Alhamdolillah, MY Imam (Ali (AS)) can't be imam of the likes of you, LOL thanks for accepting that today. Your imams can only be those who are champion in the art of running away every chance they get. LOL
And lol, even if I were to accept that your leaders were forgiven for running away from auhad, but that's just one of the sins they committed. Running away from Auhad, was not just deserting the Prophet (SAW), it was also departing from JIHAD LOL (that's another crime). and when the prophet(SAW) called upon your leaders, they didn't listen, that's another CRIME according to the above Ayahs LOL... should I continue counting their crimes? Or is this suffice:
[Shakir 8:16] And whoever shall turn his back to them on that day-- unless he turn aside for the sake of fighting or withdraws to a company-- then he, indeed, becomes deserving of Allah's wrath, and his abode is hell; and an evil destination shall it be. HELL, JAHANAM, LOL show me forgiveness certificate for this crime and the not answering the prophet (saw) crime also. LOL

[Abu Hurayrah]

I am the one running away? hahahaha. You tell good jokes.

Allah only pardon those who repent. Allah does not pardon those who didn't repent. LOL and all the above Ayas are regarding the marathon champions of Auhad. LOL here use this tafseer site of your sect to check all of the above verses I posted;
Altafsir.com - The Tafsirs -

LOL don't use that wor again "running away" because it makes me laugh. And it's funny, how you interpret things words like "grievous chastisement" and "their abode is the fire" like it's nothing LOL. Again my dear, you only get FORGIVENESS only when you REPENT. Your leaders NEVER repented after deserting Auhad. Show me anywhere, from YOUR OWN books where they repented, haha, but stop RUNNING AWAY haha by posting rubbish such as this and I am glad you said MY "holy imam". Alhamdolillah, MY Imam (Ali (AS)) can't be imam of the likes of you, LOL thanks for accepting that today. Your imams can only be those who are champion in the art of running away every chance they get. LOL

Masha Allah, Ali (ra) would be very proud of you.
(I posted a Qur'an verse where Allah had forgiven those Sahaba, that is what you call rubbish).

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

Masha Allah, Ali (ra) would be very proud of you.
(I posted a Qur'an verse where Allah had forgiven those Sahaba, that is what you call rubbish).

lol again putting words in my mouth?

This is what I called rubbish: you posting personal attacks:

posting rubbish such as this Quote:
You have to do Taqqiyah, I know,

haha not answering the question and only presenting one Ayah? LOL and then you say I am stuck hahaha funny

Now you are terribly stuck and trying like a fish in the desert.

[Abu Hurayrah]

However i think alot of us are being abit too hostile to our brother bangash here he is after all a fellow pashtun and a fellow muslim good thread indeed though

He makes jokes of our Sahaba and you are asking us to correct ourselves, while I did not abuse him or what so ever. Learn to read, then follow the discussion afterwards place your comment.

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

its funny though how it seems like the peeps over here get on better with the pashtun hindu than they do with a shia muslim

tut tut

Haha Suhail, that's because most of the "peeps" here have been brainwashed into thinking that SHias have 2 horns and 1 tail LOL and what not. So it's not their fault LMAO.

[Abu Hurayrah]

The Ansar and Muhajirin Defended the Messenger

Al-Bukhari recorded that Qays bin Abi Hazim said, "I saw Talhah's hand, it was paralyzed, because he shielded the Prophet with it.'' meaning on the day of Uhud. It is recorded in the Two Sahihs that Abu `Uthman An-Nahdi said, "On that day (Uhud) during which the Prophet fought, only Talhah bin `Ubaydullah and Sa`d remained with the Prophet.''

Sa`id bin Al-Musayyib said, "I heard Sa`d bin Abi Waqqas saying, `The Messenger of Allah gave me arrows from his quiver on the day of Uhud and said, `Shoot, may I sacrifice my father and mother for you.''' Al-Bukhari also collected this Hadith. The Two Sahihs recorded that Sa`d bin Abi Waqqas said, "On the day of Uhud, I saw two men wearing white clothes, one to the right of the Prophet and one to his left, who were defending the Prophet fiercely. I have never seen these men before or after that day.'' Meaning angels Jibril and Mika'il, peace be upon them.

Abu Al-Aswad said that, `Urwah bin Az-Zubayr said, "Ubayy bin Khalaf of Bani Jumah swore in Makkah that he would kill the Messenger of Allah . When the Messenger was told of his vow, he said, `Rather, I shall kill him, Allah willing.' On the day of Uhud, Ubayy came while wearing iron shields and proclaiming, `May I not be saved, if Muhammad is saved.' He then headed to the direction of the Messenger of Allah intending to kill him, but Mus`ab bin `Umayr, from Bani Abd Ad-Dar, intercepted him and shielded the Prophet with his body, and Mus`ab bin `Umayr was killed. The Messenger of Allah saw Ubayy's neck exposed between the shields and helmet, stabbed him with his spear, and Ubayy fell from his horse to the ground. However, no blood spilled from his wound. His people came and carried him away while he was moaning like an ox. They said to him, `Why are you so anxious, it is only a flesh wound' Ubayy mentioned to them the Prophet's vow, `Rather, I shall kill Ubayy', then commented, `By He in Whose Hand is my soul! If what hit me hits the people of Dhul-Majaz (a popular pre-Islamic marketplace), they would all have perished.' He then died and went to the Fire,

﴿فَسُحْقًا لاًّصْحَـبِ السَّعِيرِ﴾

(So, away with the dwellers of the blazing Fire!) ﴿67:11﴾.''

This was collected by Musa bin `Uqbah from Az-Zuhri from Sa`id bin Al-Musayyib.

It is recorded in the Two Sahih that when he was asked about the injuries the Messenger sustained ﴿in Uhud﴾, Sahl bin Sa`d said, "The face of Allah's Messenger was injured, his front tooth was broken and his helmet was smashed on his head. Therefore, Fatimah, the daughter of Allah's Messenger washed off the blood while `Ali was pouring water on her hand. When Fatimah saw that the bleeding increased more by the water, she took a mat, burnt it, and placed the ashes in the wound of the Prophet and the blood stopped oozing out.'' Allah said next,

﴿فَأَثَـبَكُمْ غَمّاً بِغَمٍّ﴾

(There did Allah give you one distress after another) ﴿3:153﴾,

He gave you grief over your grief. Ibn `Abbas said, `The first grief was because of the defeat, especially when it was rumored that Muhammad was killed. The second grief was when the idolators went up the mount and The Messenger of Allah said, `O Allah! It is not for them to rise above us.'''

`Abdur-Rahman bin `Awf said, "The first distress was because of the defeat and the second when a rumor started that Muhammad was killed, which to them, was worse than defeat.'' Ibn Marduwyah recorded both of these. Mujahid and Qatadah said, "The first distress was when they heard that Muhammad was killed and the second when they suffered casualties and injury.'' It has also been reported that Qatadah and Ar-Rabi` bin Anas said that it was the opposite ﴿order﴾. As-Suddi said that the first distress was because of the victory and booty that they missed and the second because of the enemy rising above them (on the mount). Allah said,

﴿لِّكَيْلاَ تَحْزَنُواْ عَلَى مَا فَاتَكُمْ﴾

(by way of requital to teach you not to grieve for that which had escaped you), for that you missed the booty and triumph over your enemy.

﴿وَلاَ مَآ أَصَـبَكُمْ﴾

(nor for what struck you), of injury and fatalities, as Ibn `Abbas, `Abdur-Rahman bin `Awf, Al-Hasan, Qatadah and As-Suddi stated. Allah said next,

﴿وَاللَّهُ خَبِيرٌ بِمَا تَعْمَلُونَ﴾

(And Allah is Well-Aware of all that you do.) all praise is due to Him, and thanks, there is no deity worthy of worship except Him, the Most High, Most Honored.

﴿ثُمَّ أَنزَلَ عَلَيْكُمْ مِّن بَعْدِ الْغَمِّ أَمَنَةً نُّعَاساً يَغْشَى طَآئِفَةً مِّنْكُمْ وَطَآئِفَةٌ قَدْ أَهَمَّتْهُمْ أَنْفُسُهُمْ يَظُنُّونَ بِاللَّهِ غَيْرَ الْحَقِّ ظَنَّ الْجَـهِلِيَّةِ يَقُولُونَ هَل لَّنَا مِنَ الاٌّمْرِ مِن شَىْءٍ قُلْ إِنَّ الاٌّمْرَ كُلَّهُ للَّهِ يُخْفُونَ فِى أَنْفُسِهِم مَّا لاَ يُبْدُونَ لَكَ يَقُولُونَ لَوْ كَانَ لَنَا مِنَ الاٌّمْرِ شَىْءٌ مَّا قُتِلْنَا هَـهُنَا قُل لَّوْ كُنتُمْ فِى بُيُوتِكُمْ لَبَرَزَ الَّذِينَ كُتِبَ عَلَيْهِمُ الْقَتْلُ إِلَى مَضَاجِعِهِمْ وَلِيَبْتَلِىَ اللَّهُ مَا فِى صُدُورِكُمْ وَلِيُمَحِّصَ مَا فِى قُلُوبِكُمْ وَاللَّهُ عَلِيمٌ بِذَاتِ الصُّدُورِ - إِنَّ الَّذِينَ تَوَلَّوْاْ مِنكُمْ يَوْمَ الْتَقَى الْجَمْعَانِ إِنَّمَا اسْتَزَلَّهُمُ الشَّيْطَـنُ بِبَعْضِ مَا كَسَبُواْ وَلَقَدْ عَفَا اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ غَفُورٌ حَلِيمٌ ﴾

(154. Then after the distress, He sent down security for you. Slumber overtook a party of you, while another party was thinking about themselves and thought wrongly of Allah -- the thought of ignorance. They said, "Have we any part in the affair'' Say: "Indeed the affair belongs wholly to Allah.'' They hide within themselves what they dare not reveal to you, saying: "If we had anything to do with the affair, none of us would have been killed here.'' Say: "Even if you had remained in your homes, those for whom death was decreed would certainly have gone forth to the place of their death,'' but that Allah might test what is in your breasts; and to purify that which was in your hearts (sins), and Allah is All-Knower of what is in the breasts). (155. Those of you who turned back on the day the two hosts met, Shaytan only caused them to err because of some of what they had earned. But Allah, indeed, has forgiven them. Surely, Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Forbearing.)


This is only a small part of the Tafsir of the aya in Surah Imran.


The ayat you posted

[Shakir 3:167] And that He might know the hypocrites; and it was said to them: Come, fight in Allah's way, or defend yourselves. They said: If we knew fighting, we would certainly have followed you. They were on that day much nearer to unbelief than to belief. They say with their mouths what is not in their hearts, and Allah best knows what they conceal.

(And that He might test the hypocrites, it was said to them: "Come, fight in the way of Allah or defend yourselves.'' They said: "Had we known that fighting will take place, we would certainly have followed you.'') ﴿3:167﴾,

This refers to the Companions of `Abdullah bin Ubayy bin Salul who went back (to Al-Madinah) with him before the battle. Some believers followed them and encouraged them to come back and fight, saying,

﴿أَوِ ادْفَعُواْ﴾


(or defend), so that the number of Muslims increases, as Ibn `Abbas, `Ikrimah, Sa`id bin Jubayr, Ad-Dahhak, Abu Salih, Al-Hasan and As-Suddi stated. Al-Hasan bin Salih said that this part of the Ayah means, help by supplicating for us, while others said it means, man the posts. However, they refused, saying,

﴿لَوْ نَعْلَمُ قِتَالاً لاَّتَّبَعْنَـكُمْ﴾

("Had we known that fighting will take place, we would certainly have followed you.'') meaning, according to Mujahid, if we knew that you would fight today, we would join you, but we think you will not fight. Allah said,

﴿هُمْ لِلْكُفْرِ يَوْمَئِذٍ أَقْرَبُ مِنْهُمْ لِلإِيمَـنِ﴾

(They were that day, nearer to disbelief than to faith,)

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

He makes jokes of our Sahaba and you are asking us to correct ourselves, while I did not abuse him or what so ever. Learn to read, then follow the discussion afterwards place your comment.

LOL you reallly are funny man. How many times do I have to say that there is a difference between Sahaba and munafiq, now it's not my fault if you consider everyone including munafiqeens to be Sahaba lol. Go learn the difference between the two.

[شمله ور خراساني]

The hindu does not make any threads proselytizing to his religion. Neither is the hindu insulting companions of the prophet muhammad sal allahu alayhi wasallam.

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

hang on there matey ... ALL OF A SUDDEN THE PROPHETS closest companions who allah s.w.t chose to spend there lives with the prophet muhammad pbuh

are munafiqs straight after his death

seriously use your head man

Dear, read the Quranic Ayats I have posted a few posts earlier and tell me what does they mean? And I have not said any particular name here nor did I make "jokes" about "Sahaba" so please don't attribute things like towards me. If stating Ayah from Quran where those who left the prophet (SAW) in auhad is me "joking" about "sahaba" then there is something wrong lol.
Here, start from here, so you get the whole story.

http://www.pashtunforums.com/151682-post405.html

[شمله ور خراساني]

I have a question for Bangash. If the companions were all apostates according to you, why did Ali Radiallahu anhu name his children after them? And why did he even strengthen their kinship by intermarriage?

How can a Muslims give his allegiance to a kaafir, and allow intermarriage with them? Or name his children after them?

[Dreamer]

The question of intermarriage... hmmm
now... Hz Alis childrens "step great grandmother" was Hz Hafsa? that means her father is their step great grandfather... so how can it be halaal? 2 marry ones great grandfather?

[Haider Bangash 2.0]

I have a question for Bangash. If the companions were all apostates according to you

STOP ATTRIBUTING THINGS TOWARDS ME THAT I HAVE NEVER SAID! SHOW ME WHERE I SAID THIS AS IT IS AS YOU SAID "the companions were all apostates" SHOW ME COME ON. Ta ba ado sari bache nawe ka os de rata da show na kro. If you don't show me where I said such thing then you are a liar! I am waiting now for you to quote me where I said this EXACT SAME THING.