Where are you drawn to?

[ذو الفقار]

Never been to KSA but I would recommend you to go to your own country. Every time I go to Afghanistan and visit places like Cheshm-e Ob-e or Shamali I feel like I am in heaven. Unfortunately Western materialism and Taliban religious fanaticism have destroyed our society but still you can see that most of Afghans are genuine people. No show off, no BS. I guess Pakistan must be the same.

I've live in Pakistan for about 3 years. Recently came back to Canada in April 2016. It was definitely a worthwhile thing to do, though I did have some bad experiences and didn't always feel welcome or like that place was my home. One thing I loved about it was seeing all those beautiful mosques everywhere and the Adhan blaring from the loudspeaker. For someone who was born in Canada and never been across the Atlantic Ocean until I was in my mid-20s, it was like a culture shock, but a pleasant one.

I only think one day I will be able to visit Mecca and Medina. Living there permanently is out of the question so long as the Saudi regime is in power.

[ذو الفقار]

There are two critical Verses in the Qur'an al-Karim concerning the reality of the Sacred Space which I would like to share with you all:

Have you made the providing of water for the pilgrim and the maintenance of al-Masjid al-Haram equal to [the deeds of] one who believes in Allah and the Last Day and strives in the cause of Allah? They are not equal in the sight of Allah. And Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people. (Sura 9:19)

Allah is addressing the polytheists of Mecca here and reminding them that their apparent good deed of facilitating the pilgrimage and maintaining the Sacred Mosque is still inferior to that of one who is a Believer and is struggling in the cause of Allah (i.e. "Holy Mission").

Mere maintenance of shrines and facilitating of pilgrimages to it, if it is done by the wrong kind of people who are obviously themselves profiting from their custody over them, is not in the least comparable to an ordinary Believer who is engaged in a holy mission with sincerity and piety.

This is a strong message not only for the Saudi regime which boasts of its custody over the Sacred Mosque, but to all the mosque and shrine keepers, especially those who are profiting from their custody of such places.

Next verse:

But why should Allah not punish them while they obstruct [people] from al-Masjid al- Haram and they were not [fit to be] its guardians [AWLIYAA]? Its [true] guardians [AWLIYAA] are not but the righteous, but most of them do not know. (Sura 8:34)

Though Allah is originally addressing the polytheists of Mecca, once again the general meaning of this Verse applies to the Saudi government of today as well. the Saudi government has introduced many innovations concerning how it maintains custody over the Sacred Space. They have imposed quotas on the number of pilgrims, the locals charge rent for the pilgrims staying at the hotels (a violation of the Shari'a).

Allah says only the righteous (Muttaqoon) have the right to have custody over the Sacred Space. The Saudi family can by no stretch of the imagination be considered Muttaqoon, therefore, according to this Verse, their custody and control over the Sacred Space is invalid. Like the polytheists of Mecca, they are squatters and illegitimate guardians that illegally control God's House. Hence I say that the Saudi occupation of Mecca and Medina is akin to the Zionist occupation of Masjid al-Aqsa and Jerusalem, perhaps even more serious.

*Note: the first verse I have quoted is especially interesting if you study its background or Asbab-al-Nuzul. It was apparently revealed concerning the statement of the Prophet's uncle Abbas رضى الله عنه when he was asked by sayyidina Ali كرم الله وجهه why he wasn't going to make Hijra to the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم in Medina, to which Abbas replied: "Am I not doing something much better than migration? Do I not quench the thirst of the pilgrims to the House of Allah and tend to the Sacred Mosque?"

The Abbasids (progeny of Abbas) later ruled the Muslims for the longest period, considered by many, though erroneously, as the golden age of Islamdom. Like the Saudis now, and the Ottomans before that, the Abbasids maintained control and custody over the Sacred Space. It is as though Allah is saying to the Believers don't be deceived by whoever maintains custody over the Sacred Space at any given time. Though they may boast of the good deeds related to their facilitating of Hajj and the Hujjaaj, and the maintenance of the Shrine, it is nothing compared to the goodness that is present in other Islamic movements or groups which are doing a superior good deed in the path of Allah.

[کیش]

If you don't believe Isa Bin Maryam (peace be upon him) will return to Earth. Pray behind the Mahdi and then kill the Dajjal like the Rasul Allah (peace be upon him) said, you are an Ahmadiyya or some other heretic sect.

You're a smary guy, but denying a major sign of the hour can lead you to the fire. Allahu'alam.

[maneatinglizard]

I'm not a Qadiani.

I don't fear the Saudis either. I will preach what I believe to be truth. The Saudis don't own our sacred spaces. It belongs to God.

You're worse than a standard Qadiani. Not only do you believe in Ghulam Ahmad, but you also believe that he received revelations about you, and that you also receive revelations. You're also an anthropomorphist and hold various deviant Shia beliefs as well.

If you don't fear the Saudis, then by all means go to the Haramain and start telling people about your Ilhams, and how Ghulam Ahmad received a revelation about you. Make sure to do it as loudly as possible so that your "truth" can be spread to the masses.

Just don't be a little dawoos like your false prophet and claim bravery while hiding comfortably under the protection of the kuffar as you do their bidding.

[Friends of Baloch]

Remember what happened to this little piece of paki monkey crap when he thought he could go to Saudi Arabia and question Al-Saud?



Reality slapped his ugly paki two-face.

[Kakar-Wardak]

I think you should go but be careful they might behead you for your deviant beleifs.

[Firdousi]

Remember what happened to this little piece of paki monkey crap when he thought he could go to Saudi Arabia and question Al-Saud?



Reality slapped his ugly paki two-face.

Not a huge fan of Zaid, but the way the Saudi government arrested and condemned him was 100% wrong. It was disgusting. Whatever the fool said he said it in his own country.

[ذو الفقار]

If you don't believe Isa Bin Maryam (peace be upon him) will return to Earth. Pray behind the Mahdi and then kill the Dajjal like the Rasul Allah (peace be upon him) said, you are an Ahmadiyya or some other heretic sect.

You're a smary guy, but denying a major sign of the hour can lead you to the fire. Allahu'alam.

I do believe those things, but I make Ta'wil of how Isa bin Maryam عليهما السلام will return. I somehow doubt he will literally descend from the clouds, Wallahu Alam.

I don't deny that he will come and slay the Dajjal. I don't deny the coming of the Mahdi either. Btw, there is no explicit strong daleel that Isa bin Maryam will pray behind the Mahdi, more authentic Ahadith says he will lead the prayers himself.

Therefore, I'm no heretic. Heresy involves denying something fundamental of Islam, like the Angels, Qiyama, the Qur'an, one of the 5 pillars, and so on.

[ذو الفقار]

You're worse than a standard Qadiani. Not only do you believe in Ghulam Ahmad, but you also believe that he received revelations about you, and that you also receive revelations.

By revelations I mean Ilhaam, not Wahi of Nubuwwa. Ilhaam is Zani ath Thuboot, meaning it is not something absolutely certain, denial of which entails Kufr.

It is like an inspired intuition. No one has ever declared someone a heretic or disbeliever on account of an inspired intuition.

I accept Ghulam Ahmad as a great saint and reformer, but not as a Prophet.

You're also an anthropomorphist and hold various deviant Shia beliefs as well.

Wrong on both counts. Tell me one belief of mine that amounts to anthropomorphism? The textbook definition of anthropomorphism (Tashbih) is to believe that Allah resembles His creation in any way. If a person affirms that Allah does not resemble anything, that person has escaped the heresy of anthropomorphism.

Likewise, tell me which of my belief is a deviant Shi'ite one? I affirm that all of the Prophet's Companions were saintly Believers and the best generation of Islam. I affirm the superiority of Shaikhain (Abu Bakr & Umar RA). I reject the Twelver doctrines of Imamate, Bad'a, Taqaiyya, Mut'a, Ismah of the 12 Imams, Tahrif of Qur'an, cursing of the Sahaba, and all other Shi'ite heresies.

[کیش]

I do believe those things, but I make Ta'wil of how Isa bin Maryam عليهما السلام will return. I somehow doubt he will literally descend from the clouds, Wallahu Alam.

I don't deny that he will come and slay the Dajjal. I don't deny the coming of the Mahdi either. Btw, there is no explicit strong daleel that Isa bin Maryam will pray behind the Mahdi, more authentic Ahadith says he will lead the prayers himself.

Therefore, I'm no heretic. Heresy involves denying something fundamental of Islam, like the Angels, Qiyama, the Qur'an, one of the 5 pillars, and so on.

Doubting the Messiah Isa (peace be upon him) returning on the shoulders of two angels is denying the dozens of Hadiths of the Rasul Allah (peace be upon him).

During Isra, the Prophet (peace be upon him) led the prayers over all the other Nabis and Messengers. The Mahdi will lead the prayer over the Messiah (peace be upon him) as he will be the successor to the Rasul (peace be upon him), the official Khalifah of Allah. The Mahdi's ranking is very high.

Ex. This hadith from Abu Dawud.

Narrated Abdullah ibn Mas'ud:

The Prophet (ﷺ) said: If only one day of this world remained. Allah would lengthen that day (according to the version of Za'idah), till He raised up in it a man who belongs to me or to my family whose father's name is the same as my father's, who will fill the earth with equity and justice as it has been filled with oppression and tyranny (according to the version of Fitr). Sufyan's version says: The world will not pass away before the Arabs are ruled by a man of my family whose name will be the same as mine.


Your knowledge of Islam is much higher than the average muslim. But your exceeding your boundaries by doubting one of the most important day of Islam, and the history of the worlds. When Isa bin Maryan (peace be upon him) descends, prays behind the Mahdi, and finally kills the Dajjal.

You and everyone else should be praying to be in that masjid Insha Allah.

[ذو الفقار]

Doubting the Messiah Isa (peace be upon him) returning on the shoulders of two angels is denying the dozens of Hadiths of the Rasul Allah (peace be upon him).

During Isra, the Prophet (peace be upon him) led the prayers over all the other Nabis and Messengers. The Mahdi will lead the prayer over the Messiah (peace be upon him) as he will be the successor to the Rasul (peace be upon him), the official Khalifah of Allah. The Mahdi's ranking is very high.

Ex. This hadith from Abu Dawud.

Narrated Abdullah ibn Mas'ud:

The Prophet (ﷺ) said: If only one day of this world remained. Allah would lengthen that day (according to the version of Za'idah), till He raised up in it a man who belongs to me or to my family whose father's name is the same as my father's, who will fill the earth with equity and justice as it has been filled with oppression and tyranny (according to the version of Fitr). Sufyan's version says: The world will not pass away before the Arabs are ruled by a man of my family whose name will be the same as mine.


Your knowledge of Islam is much higher than the average muslim. But your exceeding your boundaries by doubting one of the most important day of Islam, and the history of the worlds. When Isa bin Maryan (peace be upon him) descends, prays behind the Mahdi, and finally kills the Dajjal.

You and everyone else should be praying to be in that masjid Insha Allah.

Coming down on the wings of two Angels isn't necessarily literal. It could mean he will have the assistance of two Angels, or two lieutenants who have been described as Angels. The Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم had a vision in which he saw Angel Gabriel at his head and Angel Michael at his feet. In another Hadith:

Sa`d reported that on the Day of Uhud I saw on the right side of Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) and on his left side two persons dressed in white clothes and whom I did not see before nor after that, and they were Gabriel and Michael (Allah be pleased with both of them). (Sahih Muslim)

As for the Mahdi leading the prayer and Isa bin Maryam عليه السلام praying behind him, you didn't quote any Hadith which states this explicitly. You can't make analogy in the affairs of the unseen. Furthermore, the fact that Isa bin Maryam is a Prophet and the Mahdi is not is compelling reason to doubt this idea. A Prophet is always superior to a non-Prophet, and the default is for a Prophet to lead the prayer.

[کیش]

Do i really have to quote the hadiths about the Mahdi leading the prayer over Isa Bin Maryan (peace be upon him)? You know what i am talking about.

Allah, the lord of the universe is extending life on Earth until the Mahdi comes and establishes the Caliphate. That alone should show you his ranking.

And what is this, you called Ghulam Ahmad a saint and reformer. Astragforullah, only an Ahmadiyya thinks that. The only thing Mirza did was create further schisms within the Islamic ummah.

Mirza Ahmed, just like Elijah Muhammad in the U.S is a small version of Dajjal. A deceiver

[ذو الفقار]

Do i really have to quote the hadiths about the Mahdi leading the prayer over Isa Bin Maryan (peace be upon him)?

Yes please.

[کیش]

Don't insult my intelligence. I have posted and discussed with you about this hadith before. I know what you're doing
It's the classic Ahmadiyya way of deflecting words around to protect your false Messiah/Saint/reformer whatever. Qasim Rashid, a popular Ahmadiyya in America does it all the time.

You are in the border line of lying constantly to us about your Ahmadiyya beliefs. Multiple times you deny being one, and then there's times you call him a saint. Then it's the same rhetoric Qadiani's use in their works. I have read them, that is why i know you are one.

Don't waste my time, sir. Be truthful

[ذو الفقار]

Don't insult my intelligence. I have posted and discussed with you about this hadith before. I know what you're doing
It's the classic Ahmadiyya way of deflecting words around to protect your false Messiah/Saint/reformer whatever. Qasim Rashid, a popular Ahmadiyya in America does it all the time.

You are in the border line of lying constantly to us about your Ahmadiyya beliefs. Multiple times you deny being one, and then there's times you call him a saint. Then it's the same rhetoric Qadiani's use in their works. I have read them, that is why i know you are one.

Don't waste my time, sir. Be truthful

Dude, instead of expending so much effort on attacking me personally just quote the Hadith that says Jesus will pray behind the Mahdi. Kapiche