Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Where are you drawn to?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Where are you drawn to?

    بسم الله الرحمـن الرحيم

    Lately I find myself being having a strong desire to be in Mecca or Medina. I've lived in the West all my life but I don't consider it home. It is more like a way station for me, a kind of purgatory where I must bide my time until God decides something else. I can feel events churning around me and I am getting the inspired intuition that something big is about to go down in the Holy Land, particularly the sacred cities of Mecca and Medina.

    How can you be content with an ordinary but mundane life in the West? Perhaps some of you have seen the misery of war or your impoverished homelands and are thankful that you escaped such a "hell" and have found refuge in Europe or America. I can certainly understand that. But I'm sure as time goes on you will feel out of place there and a part of you will want to return home or at least wish your home was safe to return to.

    I recently discussed with some people about some of my innermost thoughts and they have warned me about the danger of "religious adventurism". That is just a derisive term for dedicating your life to a holy mission. In the West we Muslims are free to practice our Religion in the sense of praying 5 times a day and going to the Mosque. Some Muslims will be satisfied with doing just that and nothing more. There is an "essentialist" streak to the Muslims of this generation which emphasizes only fulfilling the fundamental religious obligations, the 5 Pillars for example, but never going beyond that. I see this attitude among the vast majority of the religious mosque-goers.

    But before setting off on any holy mission to do God's work, you have to undergo a critical phase of deep introspection. I would say this is the Hajj of your heart before the outer Hajj to Mecca.

    A person who wishes to embark on a holy mission has to accomplish many preliminary tasks. Chief among them is purification of the soul from egotism, pride and vanity. How does one truly become a selfless person of utmost humility who is able to endure the arrogance of others, directed at himself, without allowing his own ego to respond in kind? Additionally, how does one achieve such a state where egotism is killed without acting?

    No change in a person's inner self is instantaneous. It requires, training, discipline, and effort. There should be a raging battle in every Muslim's heart of this kind. I definitely know that I am in the depths of this battle with myself. Like everyone else, there is a devil within me too that is constantly trying to keep me down and discourage me from the holy mission I wish to go on.

    I have to confront my most dreadful fears. One of those fears is "ruining your life". This one is especially tough on those who think that they have a shot at a normal and fulfilling life and true happiness in this very world.

    But divine inspiration has made me realize that this world isn't meant for such mundane satisfaction and happiness. You may see such satisfaction all around you in the faces you encounter everyday, but it is a deception. The life is about struggle and confrontation, not about peace and satisfaction.

    Where I live, I see so many elderly people, both within my family and among strangers, who have lived absolutely normal but pointless lives. They seem fulfilled and content and for a moment I thought they have accomplished the meaning of life. They will die in peace and happiness when their time comes.

    But as I said, this is a deception. Such people have in fact wasted their lives and in the next world it will be a great cause of regret and perhaps even torment for them.

    I realized that we are not cattle. We are not meant to simply go on eating and satisfying the needs of the body. At the next level, we are also not simply meant to find warmth in families and fulfilling relationships. Yes that is part of life but definitely not its purpose.

    I person should undergo the labors of introspection, isolation, and a degree of self-denial. It is in that state that many spiritual truths are opened up and a person acquires the greatest knowledge and wisdom. These "labors" are meant to sharpen the spiritual senses and give them greater power.

    The Prophets were the most eminent class of those people who were truly in communion with God. The purity of their souls meant they possessed a great degree of spiritual power. What truly made them different from other people was the fact that they were involved in a holy mission.

    Now the holy mission does not necessarily mean becoming some kind of priest or holy man. In our Islamic context, an Alim or Sufi. But it does mean dedicating your life to accomplishing some aspect what of what God finds praiseworthy or otherwise enjoins upon mankind. Someone can make Tabligh his holy mission, another the work of fighting demons (Ruqya/exorcism), and another soliciting donations for the construction of mosques and Madaris. Utmost sincerity is a prerequisite for any of these holy missions.

    There is a connection between physical places and spiritual awakening. Such physical places which induce a spiritual awakening are known as sacred spaces, for us, those are especially Mecca and Medina, the nerve center of Islamic spirituality and religious activity.

    To be continued ان شاء الله
    [SIZE="4"][FONT="HardTimesW01-Roman"]My Blog
    [url]www.salvation-from-hell.com[/url][/FONT][/SIZE]

  • #2
    Are you a religious person? If not, I can assure you that you would not find peace in Mecca or Medina. How horrifying that must be for a person to find them self in Mecca or Medina and discover that none of that fulfillment is for them. Like you said, personal mission doesn’t have to be about priesthood or prophecies. People dedicate their time towards a thing and slowly, they lose interest in other activities of life and maybe for a change, breaking out of that habit helps them resolve and sort out other things in life which they see as the accomplishment of their missions or fulfilment when in reality, it’s just a diversion from the chain of monotony they desperately wanted to escape.
    You want fulfilment for the mundane life in the west and have grown up roaming the streets of New York, you are not going to find the answer or peace on top of some monastery in Asia. You find it in the street lights of New York. Abandoning the identity you have developed until that point and letting go of who you have become till that point in life is just that ; not fulfilment.
    Good old concept of looking for things where you lost them. To yearn for the next best thing in life is human nature but to lust for it beyond a certain extent, considered a sin. There is no spirituality in that. Those people “wasting” their lives by living ordinary lives understand this better than you do.
    It is in vain to think of a wilderness distance from the heart.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Sikandar. View Post
      Are you a religious person? If not, I can assure you that you would not find peace in Mecca or Medina.
      I am a religious person, in the sense that I am a Muslim who follows Islam, though not perfectly being an extremely sinful person who falls short of the mark.

      And as a religious Muslim, Mecca and Medina is specifically for people like me a sanctuary from the maelstrom.

      I don't know if you've ever been, but I haven't, at least not yet. Perhaps I never will either, Allah knows.

      But the very yearning to go there is an expression of faith and worship in its essence. Its that yearning that really matters to God. Mecca and Medina come to symbolize a mental state of peace and security that a struggling Muslim is always desiring for.

      My emotional attachment to these places where I have never even set foot symbolizes my rejection of nationalism and being a "son of the soil". This is something very difficult for the peasant-minded people to grasp. The concept of "home" is very critical aspect of the human condition. I love the saying "Home is where the heart is". Though physically my body is in Canada, my heart and soul lives in the Holy Land. I believe the Muslim is meant to be in a psychological state of feeling exiled or the outsider, and never feel that this world or his country is his "home". The true home is in the Next World, with the Holy Land being the portal to it, the place where the Heavenly intersects with this planet.

      So this feeling of being drawn to Mecca & Medina, and the decision to move there, is essentially a psychological migration. You have to first move there in your mind before the question of moving there with your actual body even arises.

      People dedicate their time towards a thing and slowly, they lose interest in other activities of life and maybe for a change, breaking out of that habit helps them resolve and sort out other things in life which they see as the accomplishment of their missions or fulfilment when in reality, it’s just a diversion from the chain of monotony they desperately wanted to escape.
      A Holy mission isn't just another activity. It is an activity that is enjoined by God Himself. This is why I gave the example of Prophets, they were chosen by God and appointed for a specific task. They had no choice in the matter. Non-Prophets have the luxury of living their personal life, so long as they fulfill their religious obligations to God and obey His commandments. But non-Prophets are not obligated with any specific task or mission in life. Yet if a non-Prophet such as myself feels a divine calling to a mission, he should definitely heed it, because that calling is divine inspiration to the heart. To dedicate one's life to a holy mission is a great thing from the Islamic perspective. It should not be compared to someone adapting a personal hobby like knitting sweaters.

      You want fulfilment for the mundane life in the west and have grown up roaming the streets of New York, you are not going to find the answer or peace on top of some monastery in Asia. You find it in the street lights of New York. Abandoning the identity you have developed until that point and letting go of who you have become till that point in life is just that ; not fulfilment.
      I speak in the context of Muslims. Our identity is Muslim. As a born Muslim belonging to a Muslim family, I have always known my identity as Muslim. The question of me abandoning my identity I have developed until this point does not arise or apply to me. It just so happens that I live in Toronto (the New York of Canada btw), and am a born Canadian citizen. I went through the Canadian education system but apart from that quintessential Canadian experience there is nothing about me that is Canadian. That may also be due to the fact that Canada is merely a country, a mere territory, and arguably not a nation. Nonetheless, I do not consider myself as belonging to Western civilization or society, my fulfillment is in following my destiny and being true to myself, which is my Islamic identity and my attachment to the Holy Land.

      The mass of humanity live ordinary mundane lives. They die and leave behind no legacy. I'm not saying anyone should have a desire to leave behind a legacy, as that impugns sincerity and selflessness. In my view, legacy is what you bring on Judgment Day, not what people remember you for in this world. A person could be completely unknown and forgotten, but because he dedicated his life to a holy mission, he is dear to God, a pearl among rocks.

      My point is you should be a pearl and not a rock. Be someone special and unique by dedicating your life to something special and unique which is also Holy. Don't become part of the riff-raff. Elevated people with high purpose are those who go against the grain, don't fear opposition from society but rather welcome it, and that takes courage and heart.
      [SIZE="4"][FONT="HardTimesW01-Roman"]My Blog
      [url]www.salvation-from-hell.com[/url][/FONT][/SIZE]

      Comment


      • #4
        Here is a thought. A man is so convinced of the intensity of his piety that he believes he can redeem and rectify himself for raping an innocent child while he is supposed to be worshipping God and serving humanity. He does this not because he wants to participate in the sexual act but because he wants to be left with a choice no other than dedicating every living moment of his life to being devoted to God and his creation. It is almost like putting a nail through the back on one’s hand. Because he knows, if he doesn’t commit the horrible deed, he will have other options that will easily lead him stray. He wants to eliminate every possible option.
        Wanting to be a pearl is not a very unique desire and personal journeys don’t begin with concern for others. You are in need for a vacation, my friend. God, however, is in Toronto as much as you might find of him in Mecca.
        It is in vain to think of a wilderness distance from the heart.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Sikandar. View Post
          Here is a thought. A man is so convinced of the intensity of his piety that he believes he can redeem and rectify himself for raping an innocent child while he is supposed to be worshipping God and serving humanity. He does this not because he wants to participate in the sexual act but because he wants to be left with a choice no other than dedicating every living moment of his life to being devoted to God and his creation. It is almost like putting a nail through the back on one’s hand. Because he knows, if he doesn’t commit the horrible deed, he will have other options that will easily lead him stray. He wants to eliminate every possible option.
          Wanting to be a pearl is not a very unique desire and personal journeys don’t begin with concern for others. You are in need for a vacation, my friend. God, however, is in Toronto as much as you might find of him in Mecca.
          I don't know what you are trying to say here, but why shouldn't even a child rapist have the potential for redemption? In my view, no sinner is too beyond the pale for redemption. Society may consider that child rapist sentenced to life in prison as the absolute epitome of evil, but God is Merciful, if anyone turns to Him sincerely no matter what he has done, God hears his prayers and is willing to overlook.

          God is with us everywhere. As I explained, for me Mecca and Medina are more a state of mind. It is our Zion, our Promised Land, our Sanctuary. Toronto is not. Toronto is a symbol of this world, while Mecca is a symbol of God. Truth cannot be attained by a heart which belongs to Toronto. A heart can only experience the unveiling of the spiritual truths and wisdom if it is first captivated by Mecca and Medina, not Toronto.
          [SIZE="4"][FONT="HardTimesW01-Roman"]My Blog
          [url]www.salvation-from-hell.com[/url][/FONT][/SIZE]

          Comment


          • #6
            ^^^^ This is what happens when people idolize the icongraphy and not worship what the iconography is supposed to stand for.

            Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."


            Originally posted by ذو الفقار
            don’t try to be smart.

            Comment


            • #7


              There is no redemption for the man who depends on God’s mercy to forgive him for a sin before he commits it. That was a metaphor. Don’t read too much in to it.
              It is in vain to think of a wilderness distance from the heart.

              Comment


              • #8
                Sorry, but Qadianis are not allowed into Makkah or Medinah.

                You might be able to get away with sneaking in under your Western passport, but if they caught you preaching your Qadianism and claims of prophecy within the country (and they would, considering you’re smart enough to give out all your personal info on the internet even when no one asked for it), you’d get kicked out. And ituats only because of your Western citizenship. If you tried to pull that with a Pakistani citizenship you’d be jailed.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by ذو الفقار View Post
                  بسم الله الرحمـن الرحيم

                  Lately I find myself being having a strong desire to be in Mecca or Medina. I've lived in the West all my life but I don't consider it home. It is more like a way station for me, a kind of purgatory where I must bide my time until God decides something else. I can feel events churning around me and I am getting the inspired intuition that something big is about to go down in the Holy Land, particularly the sacred cities of Mecca and Medina.

                  How can you be content with an ordinary but mundane life in the West? Perhaps some of you have seen the misery of war or your impoverished homelands and are thankful that you escaped such a "hell" and have found refuge in Europe or America. I can certainly understand that. But I'm sure as time goes on you will feel out of place there and a part of you will want to return home or at least wish your home was safe to return to.

                  I recently discussed with some people about some of my innermost thoughts and they have warned me about the danger of "religious adventurism". That is just a derisive term for dedicating your life to a holy mission. In the West we Muslims are free to practice our Religion in the sense of praying 5 times a day and going to the Mosque. Some Muslims will be satisfied with doing just that and nothing more. There is an "essentialist" streak to the Muslims of this generation which emphasizes only fulfilling the fundamental religious obligations, the 5 Pillars for example, but never going beyond that. I see this attitude among the vast majority of the religious mosque-goers.

                  But before setting off on any holy mission to do God's work, you have to undergo a critical phase of deep introspection. I would say this is the Hajj of your heart before the outer Hajj to Mecca.

                  A person who wishes to embark on a holy mission has to accomplish many preliminary tasks. Chief among them is purification of the soul from egotism, pride and vanity. How does one truly become a selfless person of utmost humility who is able to endure the arrogance of others, directed at himself, without allowing his own ego to respond in kind? Additionally, how does one achieve such a state where egotism is killed without acting?

                  No change in a person's inner self is instantaneous. It requires, training, discipline, and effort. There should be a raging battle in every Muslim's heart of this kind. I definitely know that I am in the depths of this battle with myself. Like everyone else, there is a devil within me too that is constantly trying to keep me down and discourage me from the holy mission I wish to go on.

                  I have to confront my most dreadful fears. One of those fears is "ruining your life". This one is especially tough on those who think that they have a shot at a normal and fulfilling life and true happiness in this very world.

                  But divine inspiration has made me realize that this world isn't meant for such mundane satisfaction and happiness. You may see such satisfaction all around you in the faces you encounter everyday, but it is a deception. The life is about struggle and confrontation, not about peace and satisfaction.

                  Where I live, I see so many elderly people, both within my family and among strangers, who have lived absolutely normal but pointless lives. They seem fulfilled and content and for a moment I thought they have accomplished the meaning of life. They will die in peace and happiness when their time comes.

                  But as I said, this is a deception. Such people have in fact wasted their lives and in the next world it will be a great cause of regret and perhaps even torment for them.

                  I realized that we are not cattle. We are not meant to simply go on eating and satisfying the needs of the body. At the next level, we are also not simply meant to find warmth in families and fulfilling relationships. Yes that is part of life but definitely not its purpose.

                  I person should undergo the labors of introspection, isolation, and a degree of self-denial. It is in that state that many spiritual truths are opened up and a person acquires the greatest knowledge and wisdom. These "labors" are meant to sharpen the spiritual senses and give them greater power.

                  The Prophets were the most eminent class of those people who were truly in communion with God. The purity of their souls meant they possessed a great degree of spiritual power. What truly made them different from other people was the fact that they were involved in a holy mission.

                  Now the holy mission does not necessarily mean becoming some kind of priest or holy man. In our Islamic context, an Alim or Sufi. But it does mean dedicating your life to accomplishing some aspect what of what God finds praiseworthy or otherwise enjoins upon mankind. Someone can make Tabligh his holy mission, another the work of fighting demons (Ruqya/exorcism), and another soliciting donations for the construction of mosques and Madaris. Utmost sincerity is a prerequisite for any of these holy missions.

                  There is a connection between physical places and spiritual awakening. Such physical places which induce a spiritual awakening are known as sacred spaces, for us, those are especially Mecca and Medina, the nerve center of Islamic spirituality and religious activity.

                  To be continued ان شاء الله

                  Well maybe if you acted and behaved like a normal person, you'd be a lot happier here than you are now. I would also love you to move to Saudi Arabia, people like you belong in such a country. However, don't mention that you are Ahmadi or things will get very difficult for you in Saudi - so isn't the West better after all? At least in the West you can choose to be an Ahmadi if you want. In Saudi or other Arab and Islamic countries, nobody can chose anything when it comes to religion.
                  Originally posted by Bengal_Tiger
                  He is a very clever guy, very intelligent. The clown persona he has on here is just for messing around and time pass on the net...
                  "Za d mazaro pa kaat khob kam, zma janan pa double bed kawi khoboona..."

                  "Yaar pa burgero amukhta da - zmung sarry doddy ta laas na lagawina"

                  Khudaya d tol Kandahar gul ky... d yaar d para ba daste gulaan rawrama

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Makkah and Madinah are not spritual places at all. Do you know that everyday there is huge fight on streets of Makkah? I lived there before. The whole place is filled with tense people who are unhappy with their lives. Also Saudis wont allow you to live there unless you work. Stop dreaming about some fake place that does not exist

                    Your better bet to find spirituality is in some isolated place, away from humans, especially away from muslims, who will kill you, if you are qadiani. Probabaly in a isolated desert, mountains or even beautiful beaches

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ذو الفقار View Post
                      بسم الله الرحمـن الرحيم

                      Lately I find myself being having a strong desire to be in Mecca or Medina. I've lived in the West all my life but I don't consider it home. It is more like a way station for me, a kind of purgatory where I must bide my time until God decides something else. I can feel events churning around me and I am getting the inspired intuition that something big is about to go down in the Holy Land, particularly the sacred cities of Mecca and Medina.

                      How can you be content with an ordinary but mundane life in the West? Perhaps some of you have seen the misery of war or your impoverished homelands and are thankful that you escaped such a "hell" and have found refuge in Europe or America. I can certainly understand that. But I'm sure as time goes on you will feel out of place there and a part of you will want to return home or at least wish your home was safe to return to.

                      I recently discussed with some people about some of my innermost thoughts and they have warned me about the danger of "religious adventurism". That is just a derisive term for dedicating your life to a holy mission. In the West we Muslims are free to practice our Religion in the sense of praying 5 times a day and going to the Mosque. Some Muslims will be satisfied with doing just that and nothing more. There is an "essentialist" streak to the Muslims of this generation which emphasizes only fulfilling the fundamental religious obligations, the 5 Pillars for example, but never going beyond that. I see this attitude among the vast majority of the religious mosque-goers.

                      But before setting off on any holy mission to do God's work, you have to undergo a critical phase of deep introspection. I would say this is the Hajj of your heart before the outer Hajj to Mecca.

                      A person who wishes to embark on a holy mission has to accomplish many preliminary tasks. Chief among them is purification of the soul from egotism, pride and vanity. How does one truly become a selfless person of utmost humility who is able to endure the arrogance of others, directed at himself, without allowing his own ego to respond in kind? Additionally, how does one achieve such a state where egotism is killed without acting?

                      No change in a person's inner self is instantaneous. It requires, training, discipline, and effort. There should be a raging battle in every Muslim's heart of this kind. I definitely know that I am in the depths of this battle with myself. Like everyone else, there is a devil within me too that is constantly trying to keep me down and discourage me from the holy mission I wish to go on.

                      I have to confront my most dreadful fears. One of those fears is "ruining your life". This one is especially tough on those who think that they have a shot at a normal and fulfilling life and true happiness in this very world.

                      But divine inspiration has made me realize that this world isn't meant for such mundane satisfaction and happiness. You may see such satisfaction all around you in the faces you encounter everyday, but it is a deception. The life is about struggle and confrontation, not about peace and satisfaction.

                      Where I live, I see so many elderly people, both within my family and among strangers, who have lived absolutely normal but pointless lives. They seem fulfilled and content and for a moment I thought they have accomplished the meaning of life. They will die in peace and happiness when their time comes.

                      But as I said, this is a deception. Such people have in fact wasted their lives and in the next world it will be a great cause of regret and perhaps even torment for them.

                      I realized that we are not cattle. We are not meant to simply go on eating and satisfying the needs of the body. At the next level, we are also not simply meant to find warmth in families and fulfilling relationships. Yes that is part of life but definitely not its purpose.

                      I person should undergo the labors of introspection, isolation, and a degree of self-denial. It is in that state that many spiritual truths are opened up and a person acquires the greatest knowledge and wisdom. These "labors" are meant to sharpen the spiritual senses and give them greater power.

                      The Prophets were the most eminent class of those people who were truly in communion with God. The purity of their souls meant they possessed a great degree of spiritual power. What truly made them different from other people was the fact that they were involved in a holy mission.

                      Now the holy mission does not necessarily mean becoming some kind of priest or holy man. In our Islamic context, an Alim or Sufi. But it does mean dedicating your life to accomplishing some aspect what of what God finds praiseworthy or otherwise enjoins upon mankind. Someone can make Tabligh his holy mission, another the work of fighting demons (Ruqya/exorcism), and another soliciting donations for the construction of mosques and Madaris. Utmost sincerity is a prerequisite for any of these holy missions.

                      There is a connection between physical places and spiritual awakening. Such physical places which induce a spiritual awakening are known as sacred spaces, for us, those are especially Mecca and Medina, the nerve center of Islamic spirituality and religious activity.

                      To be continued ان شاء الله
                      Good question, Zulfikar. Myself I am a bit tired of Europe. Its boring, tasteless, individualist and cynical AF. I used to love living here but now I don't feel comfortable anymore. I especially dislike the way people behave here, with no dignity and honor. While living in the ME, most of men I came across were strong and masculine traits. You could talk to them about some serious stuff but here in Europe 30 year old "men" only care about getting drunk on weekends and some petty talks that can't stimulate my brain.

                      I wish there was peace and stability in our own countries so I could move there. Unfortunately we are unlucky people. The Islamic world is going through a lot of instability and for the time a better system comes it will be a bit late for us.

                      Never been to KSA but I would recommend you to go to your own country. Every time I go to Afghanistan and visit places like Cheshm-e Ob-e or Shamali I feel like I am in heaven. Unfortunately Western materialism and Taliban religious fanaticism have destroyed our society but still you can see that most of Afghans are genuine people. No show off, no BS. I guess Pakistan must be the same.
                      "For thirty years, I endured much pain and strife,
                      I awaken the Ajam by this Persian [language]. "

                      -Ferdowsi.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Iblis_Efreetzai View Post
                        ^^^^ This is what happens when people idolize the icongraphy and not worship what the iconography is supposed to stand for.
                        Mecca and Medina are not merely "iconography". Allah describes the Valley of Becca as "blessed" and a place of "guidance for the worlds" (Sura 3:96) and as a land of safety (Sura 95:3)

                        That is our sanctuary. It may not be possible for all Muslims to live there permanently, but it is certainly encouraged to visit there and spend time there as a way of refreshing one's faith, as that place is the nerve center of Islamic spirituality and religious activity.

                        I have never been there, but those I know who have consistently tell me that Medina in particular has a serenity in its atmosphere, and anyone who goes there will definitely sense that and have peace of mind.

                        I have also made clear that I oppose the Saudi government and dislike how they have maintained our sacred spaces, especially their construction of skyscrapers and luxury hotels, and attempt to make an industry out of religious tourism as part of their Vision 2030.

                        Mecca and Medina is to us what Zion is to the Jews and what the Golden Temple in Amritsar is to the Sikhs.

                        You will rarely meet a Jew or a Sikh who hasn't spent some time in their sacred space. Having easy access to the sacred space is part of the vibrancy of a nation. If not the political capital, it should at least be the spiritual and intellectual capital of the nation.

                        For those of you who are pushing for greater Islamic unity and sense of nationhood, a most critical step toward that goal would be to ensure easy access for all Muslims to our sacred spaces.

                        It is obvious that so long as the Saudi regime is there it cannot be so. Because the Saudis simply want to maintain the sacred Shrines for the ritual aspects, but will never allow any sort of religious activity in those places which they can't control.

                        I want the sacred towns to be places where all Muslims are able to start their own circles and preach what they want without fear of the government, so long as they are peaceful and non-violent of course. It should be a place of exchange of ideas and a true spiritual marketplace.
                        [SIZE="4"][FONT="HardTimesW01-Roman"]My Blog
                        [url]www.salvation-from-hell.com[/url][/FONT][/SIZE]

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by maneatinglizard View Post
                          Sorry, but Qadianis are not allowed into Makkah or Medinah.

                          You might be able to get away with sneaking in under your Western passport, but if they caught you preaching your Qadianism and claims of prophecy within the country (and they would, considering you’re smart enough to give out all your personal info on the internet even when no one asked for it), you’d get kicked out. And ituats only because of your Western citizenship. If you tried to pull that with a Pakistani citizenship you’d be jailed.
                          I'm not a Qadiani.

                          I don't fear the Saudis either. I will preach what I believe to be truth. The Saudis don't own our sacred spaces. It belongs to God.
                          [SIZE="4"][FONT="HardTimesW01-Roman"]My Blog
                          [url]www.salvation-from-hell.com[/url][/FONT][/SIZE]

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            It's not the places, but the attitude about the places, that denote iconography. Something being blessed doesn't make itself the Blesser. There is room for sacred shrines and relics, but their role has to be put into perspective. There's no special magic those places hold unless your state of mind has changed. People go to Makkah and Madinah and come back barely changed. It wasn't Makkah or Madinah that is supposed to change you, you're supposed to change to extract the merits of Makkah and Madinah.

                            There is no denying the significance of Makkah and Madinah, but keep their role in perspective rather than treating everything as a Golden Calf. One day none of these places will be standing. This was told to us early for THIS very reason, so we don't become too bogged down in iconography.

                            As for your vision that the Haramain should be the nexus of the Islamic spiritual and emotive experience, sure, I agree with that, but not in this rigid absolutist sense.

                            Remember the entire Earth(and consequently the cosmos itself) is a Masjid, where so ever you turn, there is the Face of God.

                            Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."


                            Originally posted by ذو الفقار
                            don’t try to be smart.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Karachi View Post
                              Your better bet to find spirituality is in some isolated place, away from humans, especially away from muslims, who will kill you, if you are qadiani. Probabaly in a isolated desert, mountains or even beautiful beaches
                              You are right, it is good to once in a while get away from the hustle and bustle of life and spend some time in the mountains or wilderness or whatever. This is a spiritual practice known as Khalwa, and our Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم practiced it at the Cave of Hira before the revelation came to him.

                              Perhaps it is the Indo-Aryan blood in me that makes something about the high altitude in coolness atop the mountains particularly magnetic.

                              But this is more for personal reflection and individual solitude. In terms of finding a peaceful community or society there is no substitute for Mecca and Medina.
                              [SIZE="4"][FONT="HardTimesW01-Roman"]My Blog
                              [url]www.salvation-from-hell.com[/url][/FONT][/SIZE]

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X