Why can't a Muslimah marry a Jew of a Christian? (Split)

[Roshina]

I have a comment Meemwawmeemnooon.

why cant a Muslimah marry a Jew or Christan?

You do know, Afghanlady, that the Quran never said a Muslim woman cannot marry a Jew/Christian man, right? It specifically tells Muslim men that they CAN marry women from the People of the Book (Jews/Christians), but it never says a Muslim woman cannot.

Unfortunately, many have interpreted that to mean that a Muslim woman CANNOT marry a man from the People of the Book. The Quran tells both Muslim men and women not to marry disbelievers and polytheists, however.

Hadiths may tell women not to marry anyone unless he's a Muslim, though. And we find our own justification for it, claiming that man is naturally dominant to woman, so if a Muslim woman marries a non-Muslim man, then their kids will be raised as non-Muslims. This is actually untrue because, since the woman is primarily the one who raises her children (while the husband primarily is the one who works), the kids turn out to follow the mother's religion in most cases.

Neglecting to permit something is not equivalent to outright denying it.

Now, since it's in hadiths, the problem goes back to: How exactly DO we decide which hadiths are authentic and which ones are universal and which ones aren't? Some Muslims will say that ALL hadiths in Sahih Bukhari and Muslim are authentic (examples from PF members of this group of Muslims would be Mujib brother) while others say that, no, only SOME hadiths from Sahih Bukhari and Muslim are authentic (examples of PF members who hold this opinion include Sangar).

But nothing changes the fact that the Quran never tells women they cannot marry Christians and Jews.

[Mujib]

But nothing changes the fact that the Quran never tells women they cannot marry Christians and Jews.

The Qur'an does indeed prohibit Muslim women from marrying non-Muslims. The Qur'an prohibits Muslims from marrying non-Muslims:

Do not marry unbelieving women (idolaters), until they believe: A slave woman who believes is better than an unbelieving woman, even though she allures you. Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: A man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever, even though he allures you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to the Fire. But God beckons by His Grace to the Garden (of bliss) and forgiveness, and makes His Signs clear to mankind: That they may celebrate His praise. (2:221)

The only exception to this prohibition is a Muslim man's marriage to a Jewish or Christian woman, and it has conditions. That permission is given by another verse in the Qur'an.

[Mayana]

I have a comment Meemwawmeemnooon.

why cant a Muslimah marry a Jew or Christan?

Because in Islam, a man is the head of the household, he is obliged to provide for his wife and children.
So, viewing as Islam came after Judaism and Christianity, if a Muslim man marries a Jewish or Christian woman, she will still be granted her right to practice her religion because Islamic teachings can consider Jews and Christians because it came after those two religions. Since the head of the household is obliged to let her follow her religion, a Jewish woman who marries a Muslim man can be guaranteed her right to practice her religion under Islamic law.

A Muslim woman who marries a Christan or Jew cannot possibly be guaranteed her right to practice her religion under Christian or Jewish law, because Islam came along later than Judaism and Christianity and hence can't possibly be mentioned in the teachings. Since the head of the household (the husband) is not obliged to let her practice her religion, she undergoes the risk of having to give it up or being forced out of it. You should never have to chose between spouse and religion.


An interesting anecdote on that note.. in Judaism, the children are supposed to follow the religion of the Jewish mother, in Islam, they're supposed to follow the religion of the father.. so sometimes, this leads to dilemmas in Jewish-Muslim marriages, because the rulings are not in agreement.. =/

[Dreamer]

I have a comment Meemwawmeemnooon.

why cant a Muslimah marry a Jew or Christan?

Jewish law states any offspring follow the mothers faith... An Orthodox jewish man would therefore only marry a jewish lady or get his wife to convert 2 ensure his children were jews. As for Christians it would be hoped the wife would convert, no obligation is put on a jewish/christian woman 2 convert 2 Islam if they marry Muslim man

[eusuphxai]

@dreamer I thought you can convert to judaism!

[Palwasha]

Muslimah's are forbidden to marry non-Muslims, be it Jews or Chrsitians. As Mujib has also rightly stated.

But nothing changes the fact that the Quran never tells women they cannot marry Christians and Jews.

“It is not permissible for a Muslim woman to marry a kafir (non-Muslim), whether he is Jewish, Christian or an atheist because the man has authority over his wife, and it is not permissible for a kafir to have authority over a Muslim woman. There are decisive texts from the Qur’an which refer to the prohibition of such marriage. For example, Allah Almighty says:

“And give not (your daughters) in marriage to Al Mushrikun* (atheists) till they believe (in Allah Alone)” (Al-Baqarah: 221)

And “And never will Allah grant to the disbelievers a way (to triumph) over the believers” (An-Nisaa’: 141)

*Jews and Christian can be described as Mushrikeen, since they do not believe in Allah alone; Christians deem Jesus (PBUH) to be the son of God, and Jews take Ezra (PBUH) to be the son of god.

Islam came after Judaism and Christianity

I just wanted to point out khoray, that Islam has been here since the beginning. It is the Qur'an which came later. (Which is what you may have meant.)

[Dreamer]

^wrong.... jews and christians are reffered to as ahle kitab.... they are distinct from mushrikeen, anyway the jewish belief of ezra being son of God was limited to one Jewish sect, that sect was practically dead even in the prophets time , this is confirmed by early biographies of the prophet and also by Hz Abdullah Ibn Salaam a jewish rabbi who became a muslim at the time of Prophet.... they maintain absolute unity of God

[Dreamer]

@dreamer I thought you can convert to judaism!

One can convert to Judaisim but they do not like it, conversion is only done by three rejections from their community supposedly to make sure you are serious, female conversion does have precedence since the mother of Bani Israel i.e Rachel who most hebrews trace decent from herself stated when she married Prophet Yakoob/Jacob/Israel PBUH that "your people are my people"
anyway the testimony of faith or sheema of Jews is "hear of Israel, the lord our God is ONE"

[Zarawar]

Why can't you chug a jar full of thick salty water.

[Dreamer]

wrong section friend.... try the random thread

[Roshina]

Guley and Mujib,

The Quran says that to both men and women, that do NOT marry disbelievers/unbelievers/kufffars. However, the Quran does not consider Christians and Jews kuffars or disbelievers at all. It considers them People of the Book, and they always hold a special place in the Quran, especially those who are righteous, are chaste, do good work, etc.

You're also forgetting that anything that's in parentheses is the translator's/interpreter's thought and has no basis in the original Arabic text itself. What you need to be focusing on is the actual Arabic, and not the "(i.e.,...)" or "(XYZ)." For example, there's nothing in verse 2:221 that says, "Don't marry your daughters off to ..." but yet, that's how it's translated! The original text only says, "Do not marry . . ." It should read:

"Do not marry idolatresses unless they believe; a believing woman is better than an idolatress,..."

Clearly, the second part indicates that it's talking to men, not to women, since, well, it says a believing woman is better than an idolatress.

Since the Ahl-e-Kitab (People of the Book = Jews and Christians) are not deemed idolaters and/or disbelievers or unbelievers by the Quran, any argument saying that the Quran forbids women from marrying Jewish and Christian men is flawed because the Quran forbids BOTH men and women from marrying disbelievers but then it allows men to marry Christians/Jews while never specifically allowing or disallowing women to do the same.

Now, show me a verse in the Quran that tells Muslim women that they may not marry men from People of the Book (Jews/Christians), when it specifically tells Muslim men that they CAN marry women from the People of the Book.

If I need to prove further that People of the Book are not seen as disbelievers or idolaters by the Quran, I will be happy to when I have time. It's exactly for this reason -- that they're NOT considered disbelievers by the Quran -- that we're told we can eat their meat/food as well.

BUT if the argument is that the People of the Book ARE, indeed, disbelievers since Christians have their belief in Trinity, then the response becomes: Since Christianity has evolved between the time that verse was revealed and today, Muslim men are no longer permitted to marry Christian women, since they're essentially disbelievers. But this argument is not supported by the Quran, since it makes it clear that they CAN marry. It just never says women cannot marry Christian/Jews, but that no Muslim (man or woman) may marry a disbeliever.

[Palwasha]

^I guess this would also be a reply to your post.

^wrong.... jews and christians are reffered to as ahle kitab.... they are distinct from mushrikeen

Yes, they are referred to as Ahle Kitab, but they can fall under the term Kafir or Mushrikeen, when looking at various verses of the Qur'an.

During the time of the Prophet, Jews and Christians refused to believe in him (The Prophet PBUH), and were therefore labelled 'Kaafir' by Allah.

Mushrikeen are those who associate partners with God; Jews and the Christians also associate partners with Allah (SWT), so they can technically be seen as a type of Mushriks: '' They (Jews and the Christians) have taken their scholars and monks as lords besides Allah, and (also) the Messiah, the son of Mary. And they were not commanded except to worship one God; there is no deity except Him. Exalted is He above whatever they associate with Him.'' [Surah At-Tawbah 9:31]

And anyone who invokes in anything other then Allah is a Mushrik: '' If anyone invokes, besides Allah, any other god, he has no authority therefore; and his reckoning will be only with his Lord! and verily the unbelievers will fail to win through!'' [Al-Mu’minun 23:117]

Allah SWT calls Ahlu’l-Kitaab as kuffar in the first verse and mushrik in the latter:

''The Jews call Uzayr a son of Allah and the Christians call Isa the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouths. (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. How they are deluded away from the Truth! They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Isa the son of Maryam; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).'' [At-Tawbah 9:30-31]

The same repeated in the following two ayat: ''Fain would they extinguish Allah's light with their mouths, but Allah will not allow but that His light should be perfected, even though the unbelievers may detest (it). It is He Who hath sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth, to proclaim it over all religion, even though the pagans may detest (it).'' [At-Tawbah 9:32-33]

Mushrik were evaluated as kafir asli. Kafir asli consists of mushrik who are from the Ahlu’l-Kitaab (i.e., Jews and Christians), mushrik who are not from Ahlu’l-Kitaab (i.e., Hindus, Sikhs, Buddhists and Zoroastrians etc.) and atheists.

In the following hadiths, The Prophet (SAW) also used these two terms in the same meaning: It was narrated from Jabir Ibn Abd-Allah (ra) that RasulAllah (saw) said: ''Between a man and shirk and kufr there stands his giving up prayer.'' [Muslim]

It was narrated from Buraydah Ibn al-Husayb that RasulAllah (saw) stated: ''The covenant that differentiates us from them (mushrik) is prayer; whoever gives it up is a kafir.'' [Abu Dawud; Tirmidhi etc.]

So basically, they are a form of Mushrikeen, but yes, they are referred to as Ahle Kitab.

the jewish belief of ezra being son of God was limited to one Jewish sect, that sect was practically dead even in the prophets time , this is confirmed by early biographies of the prophet and also by Hz Abdullah Ibn Salaam a jewish rabbi who became a muslim at the time of Prophet.... they maintain absolute unity of God

At the time of the Prophet SAW, when the Qur'an was revealed, this was their belief, (that Ezra (PBUH) was the son of God).

[Dreamer]

again wrong.... the sect was dead... Abdullah Ibn salam said as much and he was orthodox jew as most were.... the sect originated after the return from the babylonian exile.... it was practically dead at prophets time

[Dreamer]

perhaps Gulay can then examine the sheema which is said by the jewish faithful if she still maintains that this sect was around

[Palwasha]

^Wrora, please rephrase. =)

again wrong.... the sect was dead... Abdullah Ibn salam said as much and he was orthodox jew as most were.... the sect originated after the return from the babylonian exile.... it was practically dead at prophets time

''And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they!'' [Sura At-Tawba 9:30]