Khurasan discussion

[Sheenka]

i agree wid u timbaktu

[شمله ور خراساني]

You are contradicting yourself first you say that the pushtun population is 1/3 then you say it is 1/2 the population of afghanistan.

Are you saying this just for the sake of argument, or are you unaware of the fact that less than half can be 1/3 or 1/4 or 1/5 or 1/6?

I am not contradicting myself. You are just saying random things.

Nobody agrees with you on the percentage of popualtion of pushtuns in the country. The tajic nationals can fabricate this all they want but you can never defeat the truth

I don't care if anybody agrees with me. If the Pashtun population really is the absolute majority in Afghanistan, please provide any evidence for that. So long as there is no evidence, why should I change my stance?

And you are saying that the tajic nationals can fabricate all they want but "you" can never defeat the truth. Have you excluded me out of Pashtun identity because you can't convince? LOL.

Its not just germany its every country in the world, Every country has minorities. And afghanistan is not new. the areas west of the indus was always refer it as afghania.

Your comparison with Germany was totally useless. And now you are trying to justify it with even more ridiculous claims. If area's west of Indus was Afghania, then where did Afghania end? In Badghis? Herat? Sare Pul? Balkh? Be specific.

The pashtuns never called themselves afghans until later on after the 1600.

You are saying here that Pashtuns never called themselves Afghans before. But then:

It was the persians and other groups west and north of tham even the arabs called the pashtuns afghans for thousands of years before that.

You say that the name Afghan was given to Pashtuns by others. Now how are you going to defend that Afghanistan is a Pashto name? Lol. Three of you tried hopelessly to convince me that Afghanistan is a Pashto name. And now you are going against your own fellow Pashtun Nationalists. Give it up.

What is khoroson the persian empire used to call the eastern side of them khorason "sun rises" side then why not call it "mayr khwa",

Khurasan is geographically the modern day Afghanistan. Convince me that it is not and it is some place else.

maybe we should call it gandhara or bukhara or maybe the west himilayan republic you cant get more ethnic neutral than that.

Gandhara was the name of Pashtunkhwa. And the areas south and east of Kabul. What about northern Afghanistan? Changing it from Afghanistan to Ghandara is the same as Afghanistan.

Bukhara is north of Amur River. That's not even inside the modern Afghanistan. And West Himalayan Republic is again, not a specific name.

or you could do what alexander did rename every city alexanandria and you know how long that lasted. if it aint broke dont fix it

Look, I don't know if you are being serious or you are trying to argue just for the sake of argument.

The fact is that Afghanistan is extremely ethnically diverse. We have over 15 languages, so manyu different ethnicities, tribes and cultures.

In order to safeguard our future as a stable and prosperous country, we need to create a common identity and image which represents all of us. If you don't want Afghanistan to be called Persia or Tajikistan, likewise, others might hate the name Afghanistan. Because they do not consider themselves as Afghans.

So why not go for cooptation and create a diverse community of people here every group and ethnicity is represented without having to sacrifice anything?

I don't know why people show so much hostility to the name Khurasan?

It looks as highly irrational to me.

[شمله ور خراساني]

I think Sangar wants to rename it Khorasan because there is a hadith which says "an army will rise from khorasan which nobody will be able to stop and they will fight alongside the mahdi and give victory to muslims against forces of evil. I think he wants to be part of that army.
At the moment khorasan is a already a province in eastern iran. Afghanistan is OK for now and nobody has a problem with it except a minority of seperatist and supremasists.

that hadith is weak.

And trying to fullfill prophecies is not my kind of thing. I am not one of those.

[شمله ور خراساني]

Sangar the reason people have so much hostility is due to you shamelessly trying to rename the country that millions have spilled their blood for. Pashtuns have created this country and died for it and here we have a mullah trying to tell us that we should rename it. Do you even know what renaming a country means? Peoples tears have soaked over Afghanistan and you want to change it and meet Tajik facists agenda?

I don't care what you tell me about the past. Ahmad Shah Baba fought and united us Pashtun tribes and established Afghanistan. I am sure those Pashtuns woul have chopped your head off if they were alive and read this thread.

I am going to change the name of Afghanistan in to Sarzameena Shad Bad Khurasan! And there is nothing you can do. Go and resurrect people from their graves to come and chop off my head! I am wearing a steal collar.

[Catya Sher]

What does that name mean, I'm sure it's a joke about the controversy?

It's only the 50th time in a few days people are threatening you with this - very bizarrely in some of the cases where the punishment wasn't remotely related to the charges, raising the eyebrows of objective readers -

Glad you are ready with that -
and... a good sense of humor!

[شمله ور خراساني]

What does that name mean, I'm sure it's a joke about the controversy?

It's only the 50th time in a few days people are threatening you with this - very bizarrely in some of the cases where the punishment wasn't remotely related to the charges, raising the eyebrows of objective readers -

Glad you are ready with that -
and... a good sense of humor!

"pak sarzamene.." is the persian national anthem of Pakistan. I just played with the wording and turned it to Khurasan.

[Candy]

Is this the National Anthem you want for us???????

YouTube - Khorasan "Afghanistan" National Anthem

[Candy]

If the supposed intention of yours is to be ethnically neutral Khurasan is a very poor choice and I am sure you must know that.

[شمله ور خراساني]

national anthems are invented by Europeans. They are alien to Islam. We don't need a national anthem as muslims. It's bid'ah!

[Catya Sher]

I know no one will like this.

But reality must be faced. People need to see that after freedom from foreign rule is obtained, good relations MUST be instated with neighboring Iran.

I know Iranians are perceived as historic enemies of Pashtuns.
However, it doesn't mean that there can't be a reasonable and AMICABLE relationship.
There HAS to be!
The future national entity will not exist in a vacuum.

All this hostility has to subside and practical arrangements be thought of.

Let's just say: IF the country is renamed -
I maintain that there should be a
NATIONAL PLEBISCITE to determine the new name, if any -

then having a name which would resonate with Teheran wouldn't hurt a thing.
It is NOT kowtowing to Iran.

The argument that there is already a province named that is not really relevant.
The areas of Eastern Iran and Western Afghanistan are culturally linked and would have much trade if Afghanistan becomes independent.

The entire economy would benefit. Where is all the reconstruction aid going to derive from? Iran among many others.
So why be so shrill in denouncing the idea for this ONE reason ?

A province named Khorasan is NOt the same as a country named Khorasan.

Besides let's say some sort of taliban DO get in some positions of power.
It's a way to smooth over all the friction from the past. The detention of Iranian diplomats in Herat, the attack on their Consulate, for example.

People need to be looking around for FRIENDS in the region so as NOT to depend on the same old countries that are there now!

It's time to think for the future and REALISTICALLY so that all citizens will have a better standard of living than ever before, and best, a sense of confidence due to good ties with neighboring nations. A united front of the region is the need of the hour.

[Fish]

Forumers,

Today Afghanistan has bigger issues to deal with rather than having a name change. Name change at the moment will escalate the issue further and create more rift to Afghanistan's problems. Name change will not solve the issues we are facing today, but ignite more fire. If you are truely an Afghan you will understand, if you are pretending to be an Afghan in disguise of Pashtun and Tajik than you are doing a great job, but it will lead you no where.

Khorasan is the past and Afghanistan is the present. Stop worrying about name change and figure out how we can stabilize our country and for a change experience dacade of peace not war.

Once Afghanistan has become stabilized and we move toward prosperty and progress than we can bring up sensitive issues such as Khorasan and others.

If name change ever takes place, my vote will go for "ARIANA." This name is not associated with any race, ethnic, culture and language.

[شمله ور خراساني]

Forumers,

Today Afghanistan has bigger issues to deal with rather than having a name change. Name change at the moment will escalate the issue further and create more rift to Afghanistan's problems. Name change will not solve the issues we are facing today, but ignite more fire. If you are truely an Afghan you will understand, if you are pretending to be an Afghan in disguise of Pashtun and Tajik than you are doing a great job, but it will lead you no where.

Khorasan is the past and Afghanistan is the present. Stop worrying about name change and figure out how we can stabilize our country and for a change experience dacade of peace not war.

Once Afghanistan has become stabilized and we move toward prosperty and progress than we can bring up sensitive issues such as Khorasan and others.

If name change ever takes place, my vote will go for "ARIANA." This name is not associated with any race, ethnic, culture and language.

This is hypothetical discussion. Nobody is changing any names.

So please enlighten us. How is Ariana, neutral? Today, there are no Arians in Afghanistan. All of the current inhabitants are mixed with Jews, Arabs, Turks, Indians, MOngols and god knows what else.

[Fish]

This is hypothetical discussion. Nobody is changing any names.

So please enlighten us. How is Ariana, neutral? Today, there are no Arians in Afghanistan. All of the current inhabitants are mixed with Jews, Arabs, Turks, Indians, MOngols and god knows what else.

Khurasani,

As much as you deny it we both know very well that the name Khurasan is associated with the non-Pashtuns in present history. Here you are igniting the fire of hatred when you announce the name change to Khorasan. You know very well that the Pashtuns will not accept this name and non-Pashtuns will not accept the name Afghanistan because we have people who wish to associate Afghan with Pashtuns only.

Today majority of the people are happy with the name we have except for few who are racist and ethno fascist.

I won't associate you with them Allah swt knows better, but your words and suggestion itself is starting the first step towards disentegration of Afghanistan.

Now my suggestion for Ariana has nothing to do with being Arian or not. As I mentioned Ariana is not associated with any race, language, culture, and language.

Your suggestion of Khoran satisfies one side of the table, but my suggestion satifies both sides of the table.

[شمله ور خراساني]

Khurasani,

As much as you deny it we both know very well that the name Khurasan is associated with the non-Pashtuns in present history

First of all, I have repeatedly acknowledged the desire of Tajik fascists who desire a name change. But I dont necessarily support their cause.

And I have explained the reason why I think a name-change is necessary.

But just because Tajik fascists desire something, it does not necessarily mean that is is something bad. There might be something good in whatever your opponent desires.

As rational and educated human beings we should be able to discuss the options and not resort to childish accusations and insults. Which apparently seems to be very difficult for the Pashtun Nationalists here.

Here you are igniting the fire of hatred when you announce the name change to Khorasan. You know very well that the Pashtuns will not accept this name and non-Pashtuns will not accept the name Afghanistan because we have people who wish to associate Afghan with Pashtuns only.

Why are Pashtun Nationalists so hateful? Whats wrong with them? Why the hatred? Why does a suggestion ignite their hatred? Aren't they rational human beings?

Today majority of the people are happy with the name we have except for few who are racist and ethno fascist.

How do you know that the majority are happy with the current name? Have you conducted any research? Opinion polls?

I won't associate you with them Allah swt knows better, but your words and suggestion itself is starting the first step towards disentegration of Afghanistan.

My words start disintegration of Afghanistan? I am the one who is advocated a greater central asian muslim state. I am the one who is advocated a union of nations and different regions under one Islamic common wealth.

While the Pashtun Nationalists on this forum are advocated disintegration of Afghanistan and abandonment of northern territories such as Qunduz, Takhar and Badghis.

So you are either totally ignorant of the ideological conflicts on this forum, or you are deliberately trying to falsely accuse me.

Now my suggestion for Ariana has nothing to do with being Arian or not. As I mentioned Ariana is not associated with any race, language, culture, and language.

You can repeat yourself as often as you like. But you can't convince anyone but yourself that Ariana is not tied to Arian nation. So you better give up this weak argument.

Your suggestion of Khoran satisfies one side of the table, but my suggestion satifies both sides of the table.

How do you know that it satisfies both side of the table? How do you know that there are only two parties sitting around the table?

You should try harder in formulating your arguments. Because making such statements as " my suggestion satisfies both sides of the table" won't get you anywhere.

[Fish]

First of all, I have repeatedly acknowledged the desire of Tajik fascists who desire a name change. But I dont necessarily support their cause.

And I have explained the reason why I think a name-change is necessary.

But just because Tajik fascists desire something, it does not necessarily mean that is is something bad. There might be something good in whatever your opponent desires.

As rational and educated human beings we should be able to discuss the options and not resort to childish accusations and insults. Which apparently seems to be very difficult for the Pashtun Nationalists here.

Here you are igniting the fire of hatred when you announce the name change to Khorasan. You know very well that the Pashtuns will not accept this name and non-Pashtuns will not accept the name Afghanistan because we have people who wish to associate Afghan with Pashtuns only.

How do you know that the majority are happy with the current name? Have you conducted any research? Opinion polls?

My words start disintegration of Afghanistan? I am the one who is advocated a greater central asian muslim state. I am the one who is advocated a union of nations and different regions under one Islamic common wealth.

While the Pashtun Nationalists on this forum are advocated disintegration of Afghanistan and abandonment of northern territories such as Qunduz, Takhar and Badghis.

So you are either totally ignorant of the ideological conflicts on this forum, or you are deliberately trying to falsely accuse me.

You can repeat yourself as often as you like. But you can't convince anyone but yourself that Ariana is not tied to Arian nation. So you better give up this weak argument.

How do you know that it satisfies both side of the table? How do you know that there are only two parties sitting around the table?

You should try harder in formulating your arguments. Because making such statements as " my suggestion satisfies both sides of the table" won't get you anywhere.

Khurasani,

Your arguments are very weak. You are arguing for the sake of winning an argument. I ask you a very simple question and give me an honest answer. I am not personally attacking you, but asking you a simple question.

As a mixed member of this forum having both Pashtun and Tajik blood in you. Would you have brought forth the issue if you were not half Tajik?

Also how do you know majority of the Afghans want name change? Can you bring forth 10 Pashtuns on this forum whom support your name change to Khorasan? Can you bring forth 10 Pashtuns from Afghanistan whom support the name change to Khorasan?

You need to prove me wrong that Khorasan is not associated with non-Pashtuns in Present history. Name one Pashtun who has worked for Khorasan in present history?

My suggestion for Ariana has more valid reasons than your weak arguement which has no fan base inside or outside of Afghanistan. You are personally attacking my suggestion by suggesting no Arian exists in Afghanistan, but you are denying that no Pashtun will accept Khorasan as an alternative to Afghanistan.

I will repeat your suggestion will help one side of the table as you are only satisfying the minority, but my suggestion will help both sides of the table as it will be a name which will include no race, language, tradition and culture.

We can go back and forth, but you know very well, I am right!!