Pakistan Census 2017 (pashtun Population)

[Razor]

So no one in South India or East India speak Hindi/Urdu?

I haven't dismissed anybody's Muslim identitity. Millions of Muslims exist in India- that makes the difference between them and Pakistanis even smaller as now we are talking about two groups which not only share a common heritage, history, culture AND religion. My points are in fact further substantiated. Are there any big differences then between an Indian Muslim and an average Pakistani?

As expected you would bring religion into it as well. None of my points are low they are facts staring at you.

You are completely missing the point. Common heritage does not mean the same heritage.

South and East Indians have their own languages. A lot speak Hindi as a second language. But why are you arguing without knowing the facts?

Indian muslims are not Punjabis and Sindhis. So yes there is a difference. You were the one drawing all sorts of parallels between Hindus and Punjabi Muslims.

[Charsi Malang]

You are completely missing the point. Common heritage does not mean the same heritage.

South and East Indians have their own languages. A lot speak Hindi as a second language. But why are you arguing without knowing the facts?

Indian muslims are not Punjabis and Sindhis. So yes there is a difference. You were the one drawing all sorts of parallels between Hindus and Punjabi Muslims.

Punjabi Muslims and Sikhs share a common heritage. Indian Muslims and Pakistanis and also Hindus share a common heritage. They all lived side by side when India and Pakistan were one. U.P in India and Lucknow and places like that were full of Muslims living beside Hindus. The same can be said for other major cities. Pakistanis fall within the Desi cultural sphere.

Stop trying to make out that Pakistanis on the whole are completely different from their Desi neighbours when even a blind person realises how close they actually are. All of these groups with the exception of groups like Baluch, Pashtun, and those in the Northern Areas of Pakistan are pretty much the same people culturally.

You cannot split a country and then claim the new country has a totally separate history culture and heritage. It doesn't make sense.

Why do you think Afghan and Pakistani Pashtuns argue so much? Both Afghan and Pakistani Pashtuns are exactly the same racial group but are divided between two countries. Yet somehow they are supposed to act like they are different people.

[Nertj]

Like I said. I agree that Punjabi/Sindhi can be categorised with North Indians, but literally what is your point? It doesn't make them the same people.

We are all Indo-Iranians too apparently, and most Non-Indians can't tell the difference between brown people in general. These are technical categories, not actual identities.

there is no ''brown'' people. lol no one in this part of the world categorize themselves in color. only a fool could suggest that Indians, Pakis, Arabs, Turks, North Africans, Afghans, iranians somehow make up a ''brown people'' who can't be told apart. lmao.

[Razor]

Punjabi Muslims and Sikhs share a common heritage. Indian Muslims and Pakistanis and also Hindus share a common heritage. They all lived side by side when India and Pakistan were one. U.P in India and Lucknow and places like that were full of Muslims living beside Hindus. The same can be said for other major cities. Pakistanis fall within the Desi cultural sphere.

Stop trying to make out that Pakistanis on the whole are completely different from their Desi neighbours when even a blind person realises how close they actually are. All of these groups with the exception of groups like Baluch, Pashtun, and those in the Northern Areas of Pakistan are pretty much the same people culturally.

You cannot split a country and then claim the new country has a totally separate history culture and heritage. It doesn't make sense.

Why do you think Afghan and Pakistani Pashtuns argue so much? Both Afghan and Pakistani Pashtuns are exactly the same racial group but are divided between two countries. Yet somehow they are supposed to act like they are different people.

Tell me where I said Sindhis/Punjabis and north Indians are wholly different? Seriously, you are living, breathing example of strawman. Can't argue with a person who sneaks in his own attacking points.

My only argument in this thread is that a lot of stuff you are passing off as "Indian" is attributable to Mughal and Muslim culture. Besides this, half of India doesn't actually fall within this sphere, not racially, culturally or linguistically.

You can dance around naming conventions all day long, but your definition of India is nonsensical and so perfectly in line with the colonial British and nationalist Hindus who claim Afghanistan too, so it's ironic to say the least.

[Friends of Baloch]

Tell me where I said Sindhis/Punjabis and north Indians are wholly different? Seriously, you are living, breathing example of strawman. Can't argue with a person who sneaks in his own attacking points.

My only argument in this thread is that a lot of stuff you are passing off as "Indian" is attributable to Mughal and Muslim culture. Besides this, half of India doesn't actually fall within this sphere, not racially, culturally or linguistically.

You can dance around naming conventions all day long, but your definition of India is nonsensical and so perfectly in line with the colonial British and nationalist Hindus who claim Afghanistan too, so it's ironic to say the least.

You're Indian, like all other Punjabis and Sindhis are. Your culture, language, people and history are all associated with India and Indian civilization. Nothing you say will ever change that.

[Elias]

Tell me where I said Sindhis/Punjabis and north Indians are wholly different? Seriously, you are living, breathing example of strawman. Can't argue with a person who sneaks in his own attacking points.

My only argument in this thread is that a lot of stuff you are passing off as "Indian" is attributable to Mughal and Muslim culture. Besides this, half of India doesn't actually fall within this sphere, not racially, culturally or linguistically.

You can dance around naming conventions all day long, but your definition of India is nonsensical and so perfectly in line with the colonial British and nationalist Hindus who claim Afghanistan too, so it's ironic to say the least.

What's Muslim culture? Islam isn't a culture and Muslims from Bosnia upto Indonesia don't have the same culture.

Could you please count the cultural similarities between Mughals/Central Asians and Pakistanis/North Indians.

[Razor]

You're Indian, like all other Punjabis and Sindhis are. Your culture, language, people and history are all associated with India and Indian civilization. Nothing you say will ever change that.

I have seen this logic before, and they consider Afghans and Balochis "their" people too. Whatever you say, "Baloch".

[Razor]

What's Muslim culture? Islam isn't a culture and Muslims from Bosnia upto Indonesia don't have the same culture.

Could you please count the cultural similarities between Mughals/Central Asians and Pakistanis/North Indians.

Elias, please.

You know damn well I was referring to the Muslim culture of the Mughals.
For the record, I dont believe in the Ummah either.

I think we disagree on what Mughal culture actually was. I will leave it at that.

[maneatinglizard]

Elias, please.

You know damn well I was referring to the Muslim culture of the Mughals.
For the record, I dont believe in the Ummah either.

I think we disagree on what Mughal culture actually was. I will leave it at that.

Yeah, because your idea of "Mughal culture" is nothing more than an opportunity to deny to your Indic roots.

If you actually had any idea what the Mughals were, you'd have already provided some examples of how you follow their culture by now.

[maneatinglizard]

History is not your strong point maneatinglizard. Lets just leave it at that.

I dont care what or who you insult, but whatever you are saying is not backed up by facts. Before the Brits there has never been any Empire or Nation or Ethnicity or a linguistic group or a culture called India/Indian. Then what on earth are you referring to? A collection of the above? This could very easily include Afghanistan too and you know it.

Winston Churchill said: India is a geographical term. It is no more a united nation than the Equator


A geographical TERM. Google Hunt-Lenox globe and you will see just how many different places were called India. Including China and South east Asia too.

Here is a video showing all the kingdoms, empires and people in the subcontinent. You are CHOOSING to lump all of this into an imaginary creation called India.



But this is not to say that Punjabis and Sindhis are not close to North Indians. Your definition of "India" however is not based on any real facts.

This guy quotes Winston Churchill to justify the delusional denial of his Indic roots.

If you value his words enough to quote them, let's see what else your Uncle Churchill has to say about you and your people:

"I hate Indians. They are a beastly people with a beastly religion"

Good thing you took out the time to inform us of what Churchill considered Indians. If not for your quote, you may have been able to argue that he wasn't referring to all Indians, but we now know you Punjabis were included!

[Razor]

This guy quotes Winston Churchill to justify the delusional denial of his Indic roots.

If you value his words enough to quote them, let's see what else your Uncle Churchill has to say about you and your people:

"I hate Indians. They are a beastly people with a beastly religion"

Good thing you took out the time to inform us of what Churchill considered Indians. If not for your quote, you may have been able to argue that he wasn't referring to all Indians, but we now know you Punjabis were included!

It almost feels like you cannot read.

[Nertj]

It almost feels like you cannot read.

Mughal is Persianized word for Mongol (Persianized Muslim Turks). Saying you are Mughal is no different than if you started identifying yourself as ''British'' since they also ruled the subcontinent and English is the official language in both Pakistan and India today.

[Nertj]

Yeah, because your idea of "Mughal culture" is nothing more than an opportunity to deny to your Indic roots.

If you actually had any idea what the Mughals were, you'd have already provided some examples of how you follow their culture by now.

Mughals were probably like Uzbeks, except more Persian cultural elements. How deluded do you have to be to say Pakis have a similar culture to Turkics like Uzbeks rather than Indians? lol

[salman47]

You are obsessed with skin colour and not once did I mention appearance.
We are talking about Mughal culture and there is tons of literature on this.

you misread my comment, try again!

[salman47]

You are completely missing the point. Common heritage does not mean the same heritage.

South and East Indians have their own languages. A lot speak Hindi as a second language. But why are you arguing without knowing the facts?

Indian muslims are not Punjabis and Sindhis. So yes there is a difference. You were the one drawing all sorts of parallels between Hindus and Punjabi Muslims.

ok f**k the similarities, tell me at least one difference between an Indian and Pakistani(With Indian origins)?