Does Pakistan make sense?

[BLS_1919v2.0]

what i actually mean is that there is a big question mark that if we can handle an independant state even if we have one?
what happened in afghanistan is not all US mistake, its our ignorance and foolish pride too!

No you see you are missing what I am saying. I just told you it was our fault, had we been smart we would have not done those things.

BTW if we can't handle our own independent state, then we should let others run our affairs for us right? So I guess NATO and pak army should tell us what to do...I mean like you said we are probably not able to handle ourselves :-)

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

dude, i didnt mean dat v shud b slaves nor do i support an independant country now!
who will run it?? ANP? JUI? KARZAI? AFGHAN LEADERS? All of em suck!

so vn u dnt have anyone honest and commited to lead u, wot wud u do??
"Every boy is alexander", u knw wot this actually means? it means all want to be kings and all want to lead, which sounds like civil war nd i think this phenomenon has been in afghanistan for 20 years, but v havnt learnt anythng!

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

sir in pakhtunkhwa, our own pakhtuns are ruling, have u seen wot they have done?? Provincial gov is a thief! "BABA" (asfand e yar wali) takes so much in bribe and corruption that we can make a whole new city from his wealth, b4 him JUI was there, all they did in 5 years was to place boards having "Hadiths" on them on main roads!

i agree, pakhtunkhwa wud be better, but whoz suited to run it??

[Azmal]

sir in pakhtunkhwa, our own pakhtuns are ruling, have u seen wot they have done?? Provincial gov is a thief! "BABA" (asfand e yar wali) takes so much in bribe and corruption that we can make a whole new city from his wealth, b4 him JUI was there, all they did in 5 years was to place boards having "Hadiths" on them on main roads!

i agree, pakhtunkhwa wud be better, but whoz suited to run it??

I don’t get what your trying to say... can you be more clear.

Do you support statu quo meaning exploitation of Punjab, using Islam as tool to undermine and rule Pashtons?

[BLS_1919v2.0]

sir in pakhtunkhwa, our own pakhtuns are ruling, have u seen wot they have done?? Provincial gov is a thief! "BABA" (asfand e yar wali) takes so much in bribe and corruption that we can make a whole new city from his wealth, b4 him JUI was there, all they did in 5 years was to place boards having "Hadiths" on them on main roads!

i agree, pakhtunkhwa wud be better, but whoz suited to run it??

Look you are just taking reactionary stances. No one said they are all angels. However even a corrupt government is better than one that abuses the population for foreign policy. That is the issue. The army, GHQ and their lotta parties made a mess of Pashtunkhwa and Afghanistan. If you guys think this mess will be cleaned up so easily then you are mistaken. If we have our own sovereignty we can challenge such corrupt people...it is the army and GHQ which is the biggest hindrance. Every government is to an extent corrupt, but there is a difference between a abusive policy and pure incompetence.

BTW if you don't think your people are capable of running their affairs it is logical to imply then that those affairs should be taken care of by someone else.

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

@samima: the president is having fun ok, cz he dsnt give a ****! bt the one the pakhtuns elected by majority to be our leaders, wot did they do? do they give a damn? no they dnt! and v, the pakhtuns chose them by majority so dnt argue dat they dnt represent. v, as a nation are foolish and dnt learn, instead of following the wisdom of sir syed, vr trying to get a land that our people are not suited to run.

@BLS: yea i was wrong there, i mean thr is no1 to run it, simply no1, pashtuns should educate themselves and develop their nation, the exact same formula sir syed formulated for muslims of subcontinent to dominate.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

@samima: the president is having fun ok, cz he dsnt give a ****! bt the one the pakhtuns elected by majority to be our leaders, wot did they do? do they give a damn? no they dnt! and v, the pakhtuns chose them by majority so dnt argue dat they dnt represent. v, as a nation are foolish and dnt learn, instead of following the wisdom of sir syed, vr trying to get a land that our people are not suited to run.

@BLS: yea i was wrong there, i mean thr is no1 to run it, simply no1, pashtuns should educate themselves and develop their nation, the exact same formula sir syed formulated for muslims of subcontinent to dominate.

He did more than that, Sir Syed served Britain while our elders were fighting them. You know doing the service of British goes a long way in ensuring rewards in the near future.
It is kind of what muslim league did. Too bad our elders didn't do that and 'dominate' ;-) [sarcasm].

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

yea sure, our leaders took money from ISI and US to act like pet animals and really re-built afghanistan as an extraordinary muslim developed state!

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

our nation is so foolishly proud of wot r ancestors did 100 years ago that we might never rise up again

[BLS_1919v2.0]

yea sure, our leaders took money from ISI and US to act like pet animals and really re-built afghanistan as an extraordinary muslim developed state!

I never said they didn't, so what is the point of this. I was talking about the fights against Britain. Here you brought in the Soviet-Afghan war. Fine, fair enough. You are right we did do that, it was a blunder and we suffered. That is why I don't want Pashtuns under either of their yoke since they both are anti-Pakhtun.

Qazi I never said it was a matter of pride or shame. I just pointed out that if you are going to use Sir Syed Ahmed Khan as an example then show the whole story. He didn't just help educate the muslims of India, he also protected British in the 1857 war, and then was their loyal subject.

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

so cant v do the same? didnt it overthrow british in the long run + made muslims much more eligible to rule?

[BLS_1919v2.0]

so cant v do the same? didnt it overthrow british in the long run + made muslims much more eligible to rule?

Do you believe they overthrew the British? I don't think so, if anything WW2 stunted British chances to continue its colonial rule. I think you are indirectly supporting the status quo on Pashtuns....like serve for now and then maybe we will get something out of it later. I don't think we can do such a thing. Our interests are different from theres.

[Qazi Saad Yousafzai]

yes i do think they overthrew the british. When u have a provincial gov that u can elect there is no status quo, if u elect the right ppl, its ur gov, nd if u elect the wrong ones, its ur mistake. status quo wud be if u wudnt have the right to choose ur representatives or u wudnt be given rights. nd ur serving ur own provincial gov, no CM or governer is punjabi or anything. So y do u mention this serving thing again and again. Even if the provincial gov is serving aliens, u elected them. BLS do u actually live in k.p??

[BLS_1919v2.0]

yes i do think they overthrew the british. When u have a provincial gov that u can elect there is no status quo, if u elect the right ppl, its ur gov, nd if u elect the wrong ones, its ur mistake. status quo wud be if u wudnt have the right to choose ur representatives or u wudnt be given rights. nd ur serving ur own provincial gov, no CM or governer is punjabi or anything. So y do u mention this serving thing again and again. Even if the provincial gov is serving aliens, u elected them. BLS do u actually live in k.p??

As of now I don't live in Pashtunkhwa, I am student abroad. Status quo goes beyond elections it has to do with the setup, the foreign policy, the way FATA has been used, and our share within their idea of security dilemma v theirs.

BTW I don't agree with your assessment on the British...clearly they didn't but that is up to you.

[muhsina]

Qazi sahib

Your whole logic is that as we are not capable hence we should become servants of Punjab and adore Rawalpindi and keep kissing the boots of GHQ and follow ISPR propaganda and see our own leaders and people with hatred and think that all our elders were damn fools and Sir Sayed and Iqbal and all these confused people were the real sages and hence we should glamorize Punjabis and be loyal servants of Punjabis and safeguard their imperialism.

I do not agree for the following reasons:

1) We might be incapable but we are not more incapable than your Punjabi heroes. We have Pakhtuns leading in all the fields in Pakistan. They might not be Pashto speaking and would have adopted Urdu, like yourself I guess to be in the good books of their bosses, but you subtract them from Pakistan and you see you are left with nothing.

2) Let us suppose we are incapable. Do you think that we are incapable by birth? Don’t you realize that Pakistan is an army owned state and not a state with an army? When your major chunk has been going un-audited to your defense which has been a liability and not an asset what percentage do you expect to be invested in education? One percent, 2 percent at the most 5 percent and how much of that 1 percent has been given to Pakhtunkhwa again 1 percent of the total 1 percent. You expect that with 1 percent going to education in Pakhtunkhwa you will have Einstein’s everywhere.

3) The military dictatorships have ruined the whole banana state of Pakistan but Punjab has always been their favorite as these guys do not mind military govts. However the same dictatorships brought kalachankov, death, destruction, jihad and Taliban to Pakhtuns of PK and Afghans. You expect that if ANP secured govt after 60 years they should do wonders .Have your Punjabi leaders done wonders in these 60 years? Of course considering that most of the media is pro Punjab and pro establishment and they won’t give coverage to Asfandyar or Mahmood Khan who are atleast genuine leaders and not the illegitimate products of military regimes but still Pakistani media would give max coverage to the army fabricated leaders who believe in the Sir Sayed and other morons to be their saviors.

more later....