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Originally posted by Firdousi
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Actually it was not Arabs who brought Islam to India it was Persians, Afghans and Mughals... -
Well thank you for that scientifically inaccurate commentary, but since you have some weird fetish for Negroid Admixtures I find it highly peculiar that based on your photos you have an Afro which suggests you might be projecting your inferiority complexes that typically afflict Desis, like Indians, Pakistanis and BangladeshisOriginally posted by Forreigner View Post
If I recall correctly you've flip flopped a few times about your claim of having Pashtun ancestry and even went as far as to claim "Pathan" ancestry, a word a Pashtun would ever use. From 1/18th to 1/16th and from your mother's die. IN Pashtun geneaology, only your Father counts in determining your Pashtun links.
But since you're self-admitted Indian,its typical of South Asians like for example Banglay Torkhar, to have an inferiority complex and claim Pashtun ancestry. But sadly this gives you absolutely zero credibility in being Pashtun. Since my father's full Pashtun, I don't have to worry about your self hatred issues.
Originally posted by Forreigner View PostOriginally posted by Forreigner View PostOriginally posted by Forreigner View Post
Maybe you should fix your own self hatred issues first rather lecture Afghans and what's their culture and who they share common ground with?
You can take your Pashtun wannabe Bangalay house slave with you.
Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."
Originally posted by ذو الفقارComment
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You're the one with no understanding of history. You were adamant that the term Tajik was confined to Mawara al-Nahr yet I proved you wrong. Why don't you stop spreading propaganda and trying to strip Tajiks of their history on forums like Historum?!Originally posted by Afghanfootball
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It was Afghans, Turks and Mughals that converted your ancestors to Islam. But Islam first reached you guys by Muhammad Bin QasimOriginally posted by Forreigner View Post
Muhammad bin Qasim - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
‘Imād ad-Dīn Muḥammad ibn Qāsim ath-Thaqafī (Arabic: عماد الدين محمد بن القاسم الثقفي; c. 31 December 695 – 18 July 715[citation needed]) was an Umayyad general who conquered the Sindh and Multan regions along the Indus River (now a part of Pakistan) for the Umayyad Caliphate. He was born and raised in the city of Ta'if (in modern-day Saudi Arabia). Qasim's conquest of Sindh and southern-most parts of Multan enabled further Muslim conquests on the Indian subcontinent.
Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."
Originally posted by ذو الفقارComment
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Not Arab, and Proud of It
Amazigh children in Tunisia with the Amazigh flag.
Tunisia’s long-suppressed Amazigh minority is finding its voice for the first time in years.
BY ASMA GHRIBIAUGUST 9, 2016 - 9:01
Not Arab, and Proud of It
At first glance, there’s nothing about the 25-year-old Tunisian musician Abdelhak Mahrouk that makes him stand out. He has an earnest but unkempt air, wide-set, downturned eyes, and a messy mop of black hair that comes to a slightly crooked widow’s peak. His wispy goatee makes him look young for his age.
Ask Mahrouk to speak in his native tongue, and you’ll soon notice a difference. Though entirely fluent in Tunisian Arabic, his home language is Amazigh, the idiom of the indigenous people of North Africa (often known in the West as “Berbers,” but members of the group regard the term as derogatory). Until his first year in school, indeed, Mahrouk spoke no Arabic at all. “My teacher didn’t speak any Amazigh, and she was very tough,” he recalls. “I didn’t even understand her when she talked to me. She thought I was a bad student and that I wasn’t taking her seriously. So she hit me.”
One of the most important gains of Tunisia’s 2011 uprising is the voice it gave to the country’s racial, sexual, religious, and even ethnic minorities like the Amazigh, who are descended from the people who inhabited North Africa before the Arab invasion. Even today Amazigh is widely spoken in Algeria and Morocco, where it has recently become an official language alongside Arabic.
Tunisia’s Amazigh-speaking population, estimated to be less than 1 percent of the country’s population of 11 million, is much smaller. Tunisia’s first president, Habib Bourguiba, and his successor, Zine El Abidine Ben Ali, both intent on forging national unity around the identity of the majority Arab population, pursued policies that oppressed and marginalized the group. So it should come as little surprise that Tunisia’s Amazigh saw the 2011 revolution as a chance to speak up about their grievances, revive their heritage, and preserve it from extinction.
Mahrouk, who hails from a small town in the Sahara, formed an Amazigh-language hip-hop band with his brother in 2013, and today they rap together about their lives and the problems of their community. One of their songs, “Tamurthiw” (“My Country”), is a hymn to ancestral pride. “We’re Amazigh and this is our country,” they sing. “This was my country before Jesus came down.” The lyrics include a shout-out to Masinissa, the ancient leader who united the Amazigh-speaking peoples into the kingdom of Numidia, and whom many modern-day Amazigh regard as one of their own.
The Mahrouk brothers are not alone in their efforts to celebrate their past. Since 2011, many Amazigh have organized to push for more cultural and historical recognition. Houcine Belghith is a member of the Club of Amazigh Culture, a civil society that has taken advantage of post-revolutionary freedoms to overcome the long years of silence. “In the past, we were stripped of our right to be who we are, to protect our identity, and to speak our language,” he said. “They excluded us, marginalized us.”
Belghith recounted how he was once punished in school because he wrote a poem in Amazigh and shared it with his fellow students. His story is hardly an isolated incident. Many of the Amazigh-speaking Tunisians I talked to reported encountering similar ill treatment when they tried to use their language.
Today, at least, the Amazigh can speak freely of the times when they struggled against a state intent on extinguishing their distinct identity. Bourguiba’s strategy for marginalizing the Amazigh included resettlement plans aimed at pushing them to integrate with their Arab neighbors — a policy that succeeded to a considerable degree. Even so, though, a few isolated communities survived — such as the town of Zrawa, the Marhouk brothers’ hometown.
“Bourguiba did good things, but he also did some bad things,” said Jaloul Ghaki, president of the Tunisian Association of Amazigh Culture. “He sent us to school. He made sure we got an education. But his vision of Tunisia didn’t leave much room for our difference.” Ben Ali continued the basic contours of the policy, Ghaki says. “He suppressed the Amazigh language to preserve the unity of the country, as if the unity of the country depended solely on a common language.”
Despite their relatively small numbers, the Amazigh have had a huge and lingering influence on Tunisian culture. The traces are everywhere. You can see it in the food, including Tunisia’s trademark dish of couscous. You can see it in the tattooed faces of old Tunisian women who sport cross-like symbols on their chins. (The mark in question is the letter “T” in Amazigh script, which stands for femininity.) You can see it in traditional Tunisian clothing — even though most Tunisians know the robe-like garments in question as “Arab clothes.” Amazigh activists, like Nouha Grine of the Club for Amazigh Culture, sneer at what they consider an egregious mislabeling. “It’s time for Tunisians to start calling things by their names,” she says. “We need to set the record straight. Those are Amazigh clothes, not Arab clothes.”
Tunisians don’t just eat and dress Amazigh. They also speak Amazigh. Modern Tunisian Arabic is full of Amazigh words (especially names for animals, such as fakroun for “turtle” or allouche for “sheep”). Many Tunisian place names, like Tataooine (which lent its name to a planet in the Star Wars movies) and Medenine, are of Amazigh origin. The name of the very country probably has its roots in Amazigh. Historians trace the word “tunes” to Amazigh inscriptions of the sixth century B.C., though it’s still unclear what the original word meant.
Yet the Amazigh cultural rebirth is also meeting with resistance. Ghaki said some accuse him of leading a separatist movement, while others attack him for advocating for the use of a language other than Arabic, which, they say, is “the language of heaven and the Quran.” “A lot of these accusations are rooted in ignorance,” he said. “Many people in Tunisia do not know that there is an Amazigh community. We once organized a peaceful protest in downtown Tunis. Some guy came to us told us to go protest in our own country. He thought we were Algerians or Moroccans.” Other Amazigh told me of Arab neighbors who accuse them of trying to break up the country, up to and including involvement in alleged Western conspiracies to undermine Arab civilization.
Those accusations seem bizarre in light of the notable modesty of Amazigh demands for cultural and historical recognition. To this day, for example, their language is not taught in a single school in Tunisia. Though there are some scattered efforts to help those who want to learn it, they remain entirely informal and small-scale. Grine, of the Amzigh club, said she would like to see it taught as an optional language in schools, alongside other foreign tongues such as Hebrew, Turkish, and Korean.
Because the Amazigh of Tunisia have watched their numbers dwindle and their culture diminish over the years, members of the community have sought to protect and preserve their heritage by marrying within the group. Until the 1970s, marrying an outsider was taboo in Amazigh communities. However, as more of them left their hometowns for the capital and other cities, intermarriage became more common. Some Amazigh, like Belghith, are still opposed to marrying people from outside the group. For him, this would necessarily entail a loss of culture and language, since newcomers will have no familiarity with Amazigh history or traditions. Mahrouk, the rapper, agrees that intermarriage might not be ideal for the survival of an already endangered language. But he also sees diversity as a source of richness as long as every group has the chance to pass along its heritage.
Today, having survived centuries of oppression and discrimination, members of the Amazigh minority are enjoying a cultural resurgence thanks to the new era of democracy and free expression. As Tunisians embrace their newfound freedoms, one can only hope that they will also find room for a fresh appreciation of diversity, and for a more open and honest discussion about the past.
Not Arab, and Proud of It | Foreign Policy
1. The Amazigh are the native people of north Africa before the Arab conquest.
2. Even today most north Africans are not racially Arab but Arabized-Amazighen or "Arabized-Berbers" (Berber being a somewhat anachronistic and pejorative term).
In Morocco it's even official Amazigh ("Berbers") are the majority.
3. Tunisia is an Amazigh country which has gone through Arabization over the centuries.
However it is important for Tunisia to accept the reality of its Amazigh history and identity and not oppress the Amazigh.
Amazigh woman of Tunisia. Before the Arab Spring, Tunisia officially denied the existence of Amazigh ("Berbers") in its country.* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Comment
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Pashtuns and Tajiks do have Mongoloid and Australoid admixture. Nobody is "pure." All the kids here who grew up in the west seem to have a fixation with looking Nordic, lol.Originally posted by Forreigner View PostComment
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We are talking about two different phenomena.Originally posted by Firdousi View Post
Right wing groups in Europe are a reaction to a number of recent developments in Western countries. Old patterns of life and the homogeneous nature of Western societies are changing. Due developments in mass media, Internet and mass communication, politics is becoming populist.
Nationalism in developing countries is an older version of the same ideology. Nationalism in Afghanistan for example is the same as the type of nationalism prevalent in Europe in the late 1900' and early 20th century.
Our societies are extremely diverse. thats why nationalism is only increasing local tensions and hostilities. Tajiks vs Pashtuns, Pashtuns vs Hazaras etc. educated people and people who have jobs and businesses will realize that this ideology is counterproductive.
It is not reactionary and it is not xenophobic like the right wing movement of Europe.
Both ideologies share same roots and have some similarities. But they older version, the one prevalent in Muslim countries, is on its way out.
The modern Western version is on the rise.Originally posted by FirdousiComment
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Hmmm Sounds like typical Desi with inferiority complex Projectiing again.Originally posted by Forreigner View Post
Originally posted by Forreigner View PostI'm not Desi, I have no reason feel inferior about my mixture; Both Afghans and Yemenis are people Desis love to claim their ancestors since both had dominance in South Asia.Originally posted by Forreigner View Post
Notice, Banglay Torkhar, a Bengali with a Pashtun wannabe inferioriority Complex and AFB, a Fake Sayyid and Pashtun wannabe, who hates his own Arab ancestry and has Mongolian heritage. Are the only one's thanking you.
Looks like you've formed an inferiority complex support group.
Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."
Originally posted by ذو الفقارComment
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Banglay Torkhar, no matter how desperately you try, you won't get a bride from another ethnic group. whether they're Berber or Pashtun or anyone else.
You're stuck with this Banglay girls who'll take off their clothes for white europeans before they'll do so for you.
Like her
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Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."
Originally posted by ذو الفقارComment
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Originally posted by Iblis_Efreetzai View PostBanglay Torkhar, no matter how desperately you try, you won't get a bride from another ethnic group. whether they're Berber or Pashtun or anyone else.
You're stuck with this Banglay girls who'll take off their clothes for white europeans before they'll do so for you.
Like her
[IMG][/IMG]
Did you not open a thread against racism as recent as a week ago?? Why aren't you ashamed of yourself??
"To burn always with this hard gemlike flame, to maintain this ecstasy, is success in life."
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Because I'm not rebuking Bengalis as a race, rather Banglay Torkhar's inferiority complexOriginally posted by DaZahroJaam. View Post
He was originally creeping on Pashtuns, now he's trying to do the same with Berbers.
Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."
Originally posted by ذو الفقارComment
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I don't care what he does or does not. I don't like him anymore than I like you. I don't care enough to keep a tab on what you or he does. I didn't even read the rest of your post. I speak based on what you have said here. This, to me, is a clear sign of racism.girls who'll take off their clothes for white europeans before they'll do so for you.
You are a middle aged man with years of education. The amount of money that has been wasted on raising some of you could have gone towards an ant farm with better profit for the society. What a waste of time and resources..
"To burn always with this hard gemlike flame, to maintain this ecstasy, is success in life."
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True i an north indian, but an Indo Aryan, I look like Hrithik Roshan. I am far more related to Afghanis and Pathans than you half yemini half turk.....its funny you claim i am supporter of White Nationalism/supremacy when you are, a Pathan pretender, is supporting Arab supremacy....Arabization is Arab supremacy...i am adcocating afghanis dont want your dirty backward culture but also not advocating they should want to impose western culture...Afghanis have their own distinct beautiful cultures and should take pride in them instead of following others be it arabs or westerners or chinese..Originally posted by Iblis_Efreetzai View Post
My Iranian friend had a point. arabs destroyed their glorious Persia, once a superpower of of the world, a nation, even ancient Greeks admired and respected...look at then today...the arabs dragged them down to their own backward level....
Arabization = Arab supremacy...the Islamic empire/Caliphate fell because they were Arab supremacists and denied non Arabs higher governmenral positions even though most advancements were made by non Arabs....for this reason Arabic as lingua franca has a very brutal supremacist history and symbolism behind it, lets not fool around here.
Anyone proposing such an idea is an Arab day dreaming of restoring their long gone power in the world. In this case both Iblis and shamlawar...Last edited by Forreigner; 08-10-2016, 07:20 PM.Comment
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Yeah...Originally posted by Afghanfootball
A Yemeni-Turk hunting for Albanian women on dating sites with an identity crisis who parrots the phrase "inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex, inferiority complex" 1,00 times a day is wasting his time trying to get Afghans to drop Dari/Pashto as their languages and become Arabs.
It's been almost 3 years since this thread was started, do you think anyone in the Afghan parliament would even take this Yemeni-Turk troll and his nonsense seriously?
lol* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Comment
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Originally posted by Forreigner View Post
Well it's simple Islam is from Allah(swt) and since Allah(swt) knows best, it only makes sense that Islam is the solution
as for the sects; this is happening because people ignore spirituality in Islam; most of the ones looking to stir naimosity also reject the spiritual dimension, Both RuHani and Fiqh are necessary.
As for Afghan and Arabs, you wouldn't know much since you're Indian and have no Pashtun connection; but being I've been to Yemen and Afghanistan I can comment and say they have a great deal of overlap; but distinct from one another.
Also, as economist Kaushik Basu says: "For a nation to progress it is important for people to spend time on science, mathematics and literature instead of spending time showing that 5,000 years ago their ancestors did science, mathematics and literature."
Originally posted by ذو الفقارComment
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