Arabic should become the single official national language in all muslim countries

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Are a you a Bangla of Afghan origin? I am as well, my name is Sakib Rehman Uddin Shah Nawaz Khan. I am a pure Pakhtun like you.

That doesn't sound like a Pashtun name.

[Bengal_Tiger]

why should every muslim country become like Saudis and follows it's culture? this is nothing but imperialism

1. This Arab-wannabe Wahabi, "Shamlawar Khurasani" guy, living in Amsterdam - not in his beloved Arabia - would never be accepted by Saudis as he is not from an Arab tribe based in Saudi. They would regard him as inferior and as dirt.

2. Saudi Arabia is slowly distancing itself from Wahabism and the guy that might become the future king, ibn Salman, is known to want to make Saudi more like the UAE, slightly more liberal and ditch Wahabism.

2 Wahabis killed their parents in Saudi recently, they were ISIS supporters and it prompted discussion on Ibn Taymiya one of the main Wahabi scholars.


Killing of mother in Saudi Arabia sparks debate about Islamic scholar

DUBAI | BY SAMI ABOUDI



One of Saudi Islamist militant twins, who according to Saudi authorities murdered their mother and tried to kill their father and younger brother for trying to stop them from joining Islamic State in Syria, is seen in this undated handout photo, Saudi Arabia. Saudi Press...

REUTERS

Driven by radical beliefs, twin brothers allegedly killed their mother in Saudi Arabia after she tried to stop them from joining Islamic State in Syria in a case that outraged Saudi Arabians worried about rising Islamic militancy.

The June 24 killing, in a country where respect for elders is seen as a bedrock of society, whipped up a storm of debate over the possible influence of a medieval Islamic scholar revered as a forerunner of Saudi Arabia's Wahhabi school of Sunni Islam.

Saudi interior ministry spokesman General Mansour al-Turki said the pair were suspects in the killing.

"The only thing (we have established) is that they (the twins) follow Takfiri ideology," Turki told Reuters, using a phrase which Saudi authorities use to refer to Islamist militancy. "The case is still under investigation," said the spokesman, who declined to give further details.

Reuters was unable to contact the 20-year-old twins, or their lawyers or family members, and could not independently confirm if the alleged killing was influenced by Islamic State or religious ideology – or what the mother actually said.

In a statement after the attack, the interior ministry said that the twins, Khaled and Saleh al-Oraini, were arrested on suspicion of stabbing their 67-year-old mother Haila, their 73-year-old father and their 22-year-old brother at the family home in the capital Riyadh.

The mother, who died of her wounds, had objected to her sons joining Islamic State jihadists in Syria, Saudi media reported.

The father and brother were in hospital in a serious condition, while the alleged attackers were arrested trying to flee across the border to Yemen, media said. Reuters was unable to confirm the status of family members or the whereabouts of the suspects.

"Had this come from drug addicts or ignorant youth, it would not have been unusual," Saudi writer Mohammad Ali al-Mahmoud told Reuters. "The shock is that it came from a pair of religious children acting in the name of Islam."

This is the fifth killing of family members by suspected militants in Saudi Arabia since July last year, the online Saudi news website akhbaar24 reported on June 26.

There have been similar cases of other killings of close relatives by Islamic state members, including a widely reported incident in January in which a suspected militant killed his mother in public in the Syrian city of Raqqa because she had encouraged him to leave the group.

The killings compounded fears of radicalization in the kingdom. On Monday, suicide bombers struck three cities in an apparently coordinated campaign of attacks as Saudis prepared to break their daily fast observed during the holy month of Ramadan, killing at least four security personnel and themselves.



IMPASSIONED DEBATE

The case has caused impassioned debate because Islam teaches that devotion to caring for elders is a pathway to heaven.

Some scholars and media commentators have asked if it was the teachings of Ibn Taymiyya, a 13th century Islamic scholar from Damascus known for his fatwas (religious opinion) about takfir that were behind young militants killing family members they regarded as apostates.

Islamic State embraces the concept of takfir, often quoting Ibn Taymiyya to exhort its followers to kill other Muslims seen as apostates, including relatives. The word takfir is derived from the Arabic word kafer, which means unbeliever.

It was Ibn Taymiyya who inspired the founder of Wahhabism, the 18th century Sheikh Mohammed Ibn Abdul-Wahhab. Wahhabism, the religious movement espoused by rulers of Saudi Arabia, demands rigid adherence to what it sees as Islam's original practices and a rejection of more modern ideas.

These links, as well as shared practices such as the use of beheading as a means of execution, led some Western commentators to accuse Riyadh of sympathy with groups like Islamic State which holds territory in Iraq and Syria.

However, Western-allied Riyadh says Ibn Abdul-Wahhab was a reformer. The Saudi government rejects any talk of links between his message and that of modern jihadists, denouncing Islamic State and al Qaeda as terrorists and religious heretics.

But Riyadh's official stance has not prevented scholars and commentators from seizing on the latest killing to dissect the degree to which Ibn Taymiyya is responsible for motivating today's jihadists.



LEGACY OF IBN TAYMIYYA

"Some are angry at me for pointing out the legacy of Ibn Taymiyya in the religious violence that is sweeping us," prominent scholar, Abdul-Salam al-Wail, professor of sociology at King Saud University, wrote on his Twitter account.

"To the Shaikh al-Islam (Ibn Taymiyya), human life is cheap and his legacy clarifies this," he added, using the honorific of the renowned scholar, who spent time in jail for his beliefs and who resisted Mongol invaders.

Wail said that while Ibn Taymiyya was a prolific scholar for his time, he pointed to his fatwas that permit a son to kill an apostate father, saying they contradict the essence of Islam.

The case drew a rare intervention from the Saudi Islamic affairs minister, Saleh bin Abdul-Aziz Al al-Sheikh, who was quoted as saying that Ibn Taymiyya's fatwa allowing a son to kill his father had been taken out of context.

"The statement by the Shaikh al-Islam, may God have mercy on him ... is intended for if they meet at war in which the son is on the side of the faithful and the father is on the side of apostates," he was quoted by Rashed bin Othman al-Zahrani, deputy chairman of the Electronic Islam Academy, as saying.

"This means that only in this case and it does not contradict the verse which states: be kind to thy parents," the minister added in comments published in al-Hayat, al-Jazirah and other Saudi media outlets.

Reuters was unable to contact the minister to confirm his comments.

Joining debate over the case, several writers and scholars said it was time to remove the sanctity from traditional theology that permits such actions, saying ancient teachings are not always appropriate in the modern age.

Writing on Twitter after the killing, columnist Mohammed al-Sheikh called for reviewing "our readings of the theological heritage of Ibn Taymiyya" to clarify it belonged "to a different time and different circumstances. Otherwise, terrorism will not end."

Al-Mahmoud said the first step in fighting militant ideology would be by opening up Ibn Taymiyya’s teachings for debate.

"What is needed now is to drain this swamp, by opening the door to criticizing our heritage," the writer, al-Mahmoud, told Reuters. "What is needed is to shake the confidence in these teachings that are being imported from our distant past."

(Reporting by Sami Aboudi, editing by Peter Millership)

Killing of mother in Saudi Arabia sparks debate about Islamic scholar
| Reuters



*Shamlawar Khurasani is a well-known "Takfeeri" (one who calls Muslims infidels/apostates).

For him practically everyone besides himself (and who knows who else) is an infidel, so while he would not claim that he believes forum members here whom he has declared as infidels/apostates here should be killed right now, he does believe they should be killed when a "legitimate" (according to his Wahabi beliefs) authority/court has the power to do so.

[Bengal_Tiger]

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

What do either of these stories have to do with making Arabic the Linga Franca of Muslims?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

I think it would be better if Farsi became the official language of the entire Muslim world, let's be honest the most superior moslims were Farsi speakers. Those Farsi speakers made the Caliphate what it was.

Arabic is too unscientific a language. Farsi is superior to Arabic. Arabic also sound very harsh and unattractive language. Everytime I hear Arabs speak, it's like they are trying to insult each other. ''Yala yala''...Arabic is very unnatractive language. Farsi sounds more inteligent a language. By Farsi I mean Afghan Dari language as it's sounds superior to the feminine version they speak in Iran and is the original version of Farsi. Iranian Farsi is a *******ized version of the noble language of ancient Iranic peoples that luckily is still spoken in Afghanistan today.

Debatable, even Persian scientists used Arabic as the language of science And even in Modern science, words like Alcohol (from Al Kuhl) and Algebra (Al Jabr) are of Arabic ic origin. I will say however that Farsi is very elegant and accessible, not too many grammatical declensions as say Arabic has. Arabic studied formally can get very confusing.

Farsi because of its ease of use and accessibility might be a better candidate because it has a shorter learning curve. Arabic is a very technical language which can be awkward to use for people not raised speaking Arabic. However, I have scant Farsi knowledge and I can have a pretty functional conversation if someone speaks slowly with me. So you might be right Farsi would be a better option; however, I think Arabic is more entrenched because it's used in the Qur'an and would connect us with both Middle Eastern, African and Asiatic Muslims, since we all use Arabic script and read Arabic scripture. Also it will require Scholars to be accountable for their edicts if people understand Arabic language.

Like I said it's debatable.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

why should every muslim country become like Saudis and follows it's culture? this is nothing but imperialism

That's not what's being argued here.

We're not saying "replace your native language and start speaking Arabic"; we're saying let's use Arabic as a way to communicate between each other as a common international language so that we won't rely on English or European languages and we can divorce ourselves from depending on the West.

In this scenario you have your own native tongue but to communicate, do commerce or transmit scientific knowledge internationally we can use Arabic between each other. It will also prevent Ulama from having a monopoly on Islam and require them to be wholly accountable for verifying their edicts because the populace regardless of where they are will be literate in Arabic as well as their native tongues.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

That doesn't sound like a Pashtun name.

I think he's being sarcastic and making fun of Bengal claims that his "Talukhdar" caste had anything to do with Pashtuns.

[Shapur]

I support the opposite stance. I want the Algerians, Morrocans and other Arabized Arabs to revive their old native languages and get rid of the suedo Arabic that they speak. Variety is the spice of life, its makes things more interesting.

[Karachi]

That's not what's being argued here.

We're not saying "replace your native language and start speaking Arabic"; we're saying let's use Arabic as a way to communicate between each other as a common international language so that we won't rely on English or European languages and we can divorce ourselves from depending on the West.

In this scenario you have your own native tongue but to communicate, do commerce or transmit scientific knowledge internationally we can use Arabic between each other. It will also prevent Ulama from having a monopoly on Islam and require them to be wholly accountable for verifying their edicts because the populace regardless of where they are will be literate in Arabic as well as their native tongues.

It's arab imperialism, nothing else, arabs are treated as superior by you guys, thats why arabs can marry anybody, they do temporary marriages in AFghanistan, Pakistan, India and then leave their wives/kids behind to sufffer, there are so many stories like these. yet still, you open your legs for arabs, just because you are a stupid mullah without common sense

[Firdousi]

It's arab imperialism, nothing else, arabs are treated as superior by you guys, thats why arabs can marry anybody, they do temporary marriages in AFghanistan, Pakistan, India and then leave their wives/kids behind to sufffer, there are so many stories like these. yet still, you open your legs for arabs, just because you are a stupid mullah without common sense

Thats a common attitude among Hindu people like yourself but in the rest of the Ajam-islamic world (Afghanistan, Iran, Turkey,.. and so on) people look down on Arabs. They are despised (I disagree with it though).

Afghans are proud Muslims but we are not wannabes like you coward Hindus. Some Hindus praise Arabs, others wished were Afghans or Iranians and we got also many of them White wannabes like yourself. So at the end of the day, whether you praise Afghans, Arabs or Westerners, it just proves your coward nature.

[Karachi]

Thats a common attitude among Hindu people like yourself but in the rest of the Ajam-islamic world (Afghanistan, Iran, Turkey,.. and so on) people look down on Arabs. They are despised (I disagree with it though).

Afghans are proud Muslims but we are not wannabes like you coward Hindus. Some Hindus praise Arabs, others wished were Afghans or Iranians and we got also many of them White wannabes like yourself. So at the end of the day, whether you praise Afghans, Arabs or Westerners, it just proves your coward nature.

why would hindus praise arabs you dumb****? at least say south asian muslims, they are the ones who are coward, but so are many talib type pashtuns, they are also slave of arabs, they will do anything for arabs

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

It's arab imperialism, nothing else, arabs are treated as superior by you guys, thats why arabs can marry anybody, they do temporary marriages in AFghanistan, Pakistan, India and then leave their wives/kids behind to sufffer, there are so many stories like these. yet still, you open your legs for arabs, just because you are a stupid mullah without common sense

Arab Imperialism would be to erase your culture and language and adaopt Arab culture and language while basically still being subordinate to Arabs. So no this is not Arab Imperialism;

If you're against Imperialism; why don't you stop using English who actually did try to erase Desi cultures and languages and replace them with English and made Desis subordinate to Englishmen.Once again you proved yourself to be a clueless and mentally colonized.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Thats a common attitude among Hindu people like yourself but in the rest of the Ajam-islamic world (Afghanistan, Iran, Turkey,.. and so on) people look down on Arabs. They are despised (I disagree with it though).

Afghans are proud Muslims but we are not wannabes like you coward Hindus. Some Hindus praise Arabs, others wished were Afghans or Iranians and we got also many of them White wannabes like yourself. So at the end of the day, whether you praise Afghans, Arabs or Westerners, it just proves your coward nature.

He isn't Hindu, he's an Ex-Muslim, but regardless everything else you're saying applies.

Karachi suffers from colonial mentality that affects most Desis from Pakistan to India to Bangladesh. He's unfamiliar with any other state of being.

the Irony that Karachi adopts the rhetoric of Perso-Nationalists; who themselves want their Imperialism on South Asians and others.

[Forreigner]

Debatable, even Persian scientists used Arabic as the language of science And even in Modern science, words like Alcohol (from Al Kuhl) and Algebra (Al Jabr) are of Arabic ic origin. I will say however that Farsi is very elegant and accessible, not too many grammatical declensions as say Arabic has. Arabic studied formally can get very confusing.

Farsi because of its ease of use and accessibility might be a better candidate because it has a shorter learning curve. Arabic is a very technical language which can be awkward to use for people not raised speaking Arabic. However, I have scant Farsi knowledge and I can have a pretty functional conversation if someone speaks slowly with me. So you might be right Farsi would be a better option; however, I think Arabic is more entrenched because it's used in the Qur'an and would connect us with both Middle Eastern, African and Asiatic Muslims, since we all use Arabic script and read Arabic scripture. Also it will require Scholars to be accountable for their edicts if people understand Arabic language.

Like I said it's debatable.

It was not like it was adopted by choice. Non-Arabs were without any doubt forced to Arabize, some resisted the Arabization process and/or restored their own lingua and cultures (Iberians, Persians, Tajiks, etc) while many surrendered for good (egyptians) etc.

[Firdousi]

why would hindus praise arabs you dumb****? at least say south asian muslims, they are the ones who are coward, but so are many talib type pashtuns, they are also slave of arabs, they will do anything for arabs

Because they are coward self haters. Average Indian is ugly, smells bad and would sell her mother in order to have our approval. I have come across many Hindus claiming to hail from Afghanistan (I have been several times to India).

Your inferiority complex is hilarious lol