If the Taliban were ISI stooges, why did they refuse to recognize the Durand line?

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hahahaha ......this guy accused me of changing goal posts but then he suggests that I should leave out killing civilians?

That's what CHANGING Goal Posts is, if you leave out murdering civilians, then you ignore the central point of credibility.

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oh and Kundhal lets not scapegoat by saying U.S. walk near civilians; We already established the U.S. kills civilians and no one here advocates them, so we expect the U.S. to be immoral, The Taliban claim they're the insurgency of Afghans, what's their excuse?

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looks like I scared Kundhal off lol

[کیش]

Syrians aren't in Saudi Arabia, so they don't have to fight the Saudi Family as that doesn't directly affect them, that's the job of the people of Saudi Arabia.

And if Taliban were following Islam; why are they bending over and letting the Saudis dictate to them how to run the show, why are they deliberately allowing Afghans to die just to get a few foreigners.

The Syrian Resistance isn't doing that. as proven. In Islam the sanctity of Muslim lives precedes all else; the Ka'aba is an object of symbolism, not an idol. stop treating it as one.

Your case is debunked

Syria and Saudia Arabia are all European creations; North Africa and South Asia is too. Before they were separated by borders it was one ummah. This is what it means to be apart of a Muslim body: helping a fellow believer when the appropriate time call for it; protect the holy cities--Mecca, Madina, and Jerusalem-- when they are occupied by non-muslims. So you have to ask yourself: I'm i muslim because my parents, ethnicity, and home "country" are? or I'm i a muslim because god send Muhammad to mankind; not just for the Quraysh.

No one is saying the Kaaba is an idol, but dont you pray towards it? Did the Prophet not take Mecca from the Quraysh, or did he ignore that? Moving on, the Syrians only arose when their own people needed it. Where have they been during the occupation of Jerusalem, just over their western borders? The Israeli's have humiliated them since their creation, and these Syrians only united to topple a fellow Syrian. Are they scared to pour over the border in Israel? Are the Yemeni, Syrians, and Egyptian people scared to unite and tell the Saudi's to back off? No, these people can only fight within their neighborhoods. They aren't muslims, just nationalist attempting to look over themselves.

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modern Afghanistan is a European creation, what's your point? Almost all of Modern Asia except China are European creations.

You're NOT saying the Ka'aba is an idol; you're ACTING and BEHAVING like it is, which is much worse. The Ka'aba is not meant to be treated the way you treat it, it's a special place and a special object but it's not some cosmic absolute of Deen. Human life, Muslim lives these are what counts. The Prophet did remove the pagan idols from the Ka'aba, but he did it AFTER his people were safe from harm. That's the difference.

The Syrians united to topple a fellow Syrian who's tyrannizing them, but as for why Egypt, Yemen and Syria dont topple the Sauds, because you have to walk before you can crawl. Muhammad(saw) did not topple the Quraish until he was victorious in Madinah. Even Nabi(saw) once said start within yourself FIRST then others.

the sooner you learn that, the sooner you'll actually BE a Muslim.

[Ghundal]

looks like I scared Kundhal off lol

really?

Case closed.

I proved you contradict yourself. You say insurgencies are not credible if they have outside safe havens and outside support in regards to Afghan insurgency, but ignore these conditions in regards to Syrian insurgency. I objectively pointed this inconsistency out, and you continue to goal post change in response.

Whats more left to do/ to prove? I proved my point.Viola!

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where is the quote where I make such a claim Kundhal , QUOTES, you have to show QUOTES to prove your case, not merely utter whatever claim you can muster

or else you're making a straw man argument; until then my assertion stands the Taliban are apostate traitors, deal with it.

And furthermore answer this ...watch hell avoid this everyone.

"why are the Taliban so willing to perform a suicide attack when civilians are around?"

[کیش]

modern Afghanistan is a European creation, what's your point? Almost all of Modern Asia except China are European creations.

You're NOT saying the Ka'aba is an idol; you're ACTING and BEHAVING like it is, which is much worse. The Ka'aba is not meant to be treated the way you treat it, it's a special place and a special object but it's not some cosmic absolute of Deen. Human life, Muslim lives these are what counts. The Prophet did remove the pagan idols from the Ka'aba, but he did it AFTER his people were safe from harm. That's the difference.

the sooner you learn that, the sooner you'll actually BE a Muslim.

your first paragraph just reaffirms what i said earlier about those borders being created by Europeans.

you completely ignored the Nationalistic point, and are barking Fallacious statements at the Kaaba talk to switch topics.

Acting and Behaving you say? if you pray (im not saying am the ideal prayer either), you pray towards Mecca, towards the Kaaba, no? You suppose to go to Hajj in your lifetime, no? Hajj is invalid today, because of the Qurayshi family the controls it. Mecca is Las Vegas, the islamic version. That is more than enough reasons to be worried.

Back to topic:

Syrians should just back down and stop fighting their own people. i mentioned earlier where was the unity, for their Palestinians brothers? Where are the brotherhood between Egyptians and Palestinians when Gazans are blockaded? don't they care for their brothers. Or, its only important when you are affected selfishlly? Same goes for every other "Arab Spring" movement.

It doesn't seem like you understand what the notion of Islamic brotherhood, and 1 Ummah is. i don't wanna repeat myself.

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Whats more left to do/ to prove? I proved my point.Viola!

yeah you keep telling yourself to sleep better at night, everyone else sees you're a coward who ran away, the onus was on you to prove I made a claim that you said I did. and you didn't deliver. Run along before you get hurt.

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your first paragraph just reaffirms what i said earlier about those borders being created by Europeans.

you completely ignored the Nationalistic point, and are barking Fallacious statements at the Kaaba talk to switch topics.

Acting and Behaving you say? if you pray (im not saying am the ideal prayer either), you pray towards Mecca, towards the Kaaba, no? You suppose to go to Hajj in your lifetime, no? Hajj is invalid today, because of the Qurayshi family the controls it. Mecca is Las Vegas, the islamic version. That is more than enough reasons to be worried.

Back to topic:

Syrians should just back down and stop fighting their own people. i mentioned earlier where was the unity, for their Palestinians brothers? Where are the brotherhood between Egyptians and Palestinians when Gazans are blockaded? don't they care for their brothers. Or, its only important when you are affected selfishlly? Same goes for every other "Arab Spring" movement.

It doesn't seem like you understand what the notion of Islamic brotherhood, and 1 Ummah is. i don't wanna repeat myself.

here you go; you just didn't care to notice or hit the refresh button

"The Syrians united to topple a fellow Syrian who's tyrannizing them, but as for why Egypt, Yemen and Syria dont topple the Sauds, because you have to walk before you can crawl. Muhammad(saw) did not topple the Quraish until he was victorious in Madinah. Even Nabi(saw) once said start within yourself FIRST then others."


If it reaffirms what it says earlier that would discredit the Afghan resistance too no? Why aren't the Taliban fighting the Assads? What happened to all the brotherhood you spoke of? right You're not even following what you preach.

As for what happened between Egyptians and Gazans, we're debating Syria NOT Egypt , ahem ahem and didn't that **** happen during the Mubarak regime? I rest my case.

The statements aren't fallacious, why are Holy Shrines and Sacred Objects more important to you than Muslim lives you? Sounds like under all this facade of Islam, you're a Pagan after all.

[کیش]

here you go; you just didn't care to notice or hit the refresh button

"The Syrians united to topple a fellow Syrian who's tyrannizing them, but as for why Egypt, Yemen and Syria dont topple the Sauds, because you have to walk before you can crawl. Muhammad(saw) did not topple the Quraish until he was victorious in Madinah. Even Nabi(saw) once said start within yourself FIRST then others."


If it reaffirms what it says earlier that would discredit the Afghan resistance too no? Why aren't the Taliban fighting the Syrians? What happened to all the brotherhood you spoke of? right You're not even following what you preach.

As for what happened between Egyptians and Gazans, we're debating Syria NOT Egypt , ahem ahem and didn't that **** happen during the Mubarak regime? I rest my case.

The statements aren't fallacious, why are Holy Shrines and Sacred Objects more important to you than Muslim lives you? Sounds like under all this facade of Islam, you're a Pagan after all.

Those Taliban have been in war with 50 countries in the last 30 years, they have done their job. The Arabs haven't done anything but be the laughing stock of the world. They gave themselves to tyranny. What took them so long to topple Assad? What took the Egyptians long enough to topple Mubarak. Libyans to topple Gaddafi. Yemeni's to topple their government? The Taliban toppled Najibullah (similar dictator) quick before he became too powerful. The ummah has been in ruins for hundreds of years, way before these countries existed. Their obligations will always be to unite and protect one another, so you won't have to worry about yourself. The Prophet didn't separate his nation after exiling Mecca. He didn't say the ones in Abysinna, are Abysinnans first; And the Bedouins are Bedouins first then Muslim after. The Prophet didn't have the numbers and resources to fully conquer Arabia, when he did, he set forth to it. If you add the billions of Muslims, and their resources, Muslims can command the biggest empire the world ever witnesses. But they are held back by nationalistic purposes "first."

The real question is if anyone is a real Muslim today? Someone the Prophet would be proud and say "This is what the lord was saying."

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The Taliban on average cause more civilian deaths than even NATO; if you consider that "doing their job" your value for Muslim life is less than NATO's which is sickening since you and I both agree NATO cares nothing for Muslims and invades and slaughters civilians regularly. The Taiban's success with Najib was because Najib's backers backed out on him, he was nothing without hiim where as Libyans had a powerful dictator, one who could **** on Najib-e-Gow 4 times over and well Egypt was backed by the U.S. and you know their firepower, heck not even the Taliban can, isn't that the excuse you give for Taliban suicide bombings which kill more civilians than NATO? of course.

The Taliban are exactly a lesson on HOW NOT TO FIGHT; If I were the rest of the Muslim world and watching a bunch of Pedophilic, Child Molesting Criminals, who smoke chars (something you can identify with) claiming to be heroes of Islam and yet killing more Muslims. I'd be cautious about how and when I revolt against a corrupt leader and regime too. Impulsive decisions are not a sign of bravery and sincerity If it was you're be right there with the Taliban fighting with them, you're not because you know they're incompetent.

The Prophets nation came along with him, they were in Madinah, the ones in Abyssinia were safe because the Negus was sympathetic to the Muslims, so there was nothing to worry about with him. The Prophet waited till he could establish a power base, THEN he overthrew Makkah, that's what's happening right now God Willing.

The Obligation is

1.) fix yourself
2.) fix your family
3.) fix your community
4.) fix your society
5.) Fix the world

You don't leap from Step 1 to Step 5, if Muhammad(saw) didnt do that, nor can you. You're not even at step 0 my Ganja using friend.

you're trying hard to grab on to any ploy in the book to justify the Taliban; of which your own relatives are working with the NATO forces to tyrannize Afghans, by your own admission. Seriously fix yourself. The Taliban are far from Islam.

[Ghundal]

Syrian insurgency has no legitimacy. Their actions result in the deaths of Syrian civilians because they know that Bashar Assad will fire on their locations, regardless of whether there are civilians or not in the area. Recently, they are using suicide bombing tactics against Assad forces. Therefore, they have no legality as a legal insurgency.

ALSO,

They receive backing from Saudi Arabian Wahabis and Qatari sheikhs. They operate from safe havens out of Turkey.

Therefore, the Syrian insurgency according to you has no legitimacy

[Ghundal]

and LOL @ your attempt to deny what you have previously said in nearly every debate about the Afghan insurgency that you have had with several people here- Barakzai, Khushal, etc. etc.

LOL

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LOL @ Kundhal saying I made a claim yet not even able to show any proof in his favor