Kandahar Cultural Capital (split from Karachi Violence thread)

[Niazi]

^ And it was about time! My point with Zahir Shah was that at least he bothered to make Pukhto an official language, isn't it? Unfortunately there are enough naive Pukhtoons in Kabul who think creating schools in Pukhto will 'divide Tajik's and Pukhtoons', while they don't realise that we can't be divided even more than this and should stop taking Islam and division as an excuse for keeping our language alive!

it wasn't Zahir who made pakhto national languege but people like great Muhamed Gul muhmand and few more whom encourage Hashim khan Zahir uncle to encourage Zahir ,Once Zahir said oh Pashto ra ki kashida hameen Farsi behtar ast, Hama farsi mefahman

[Michin Khel]

Dear shlombay why you are over-obsessed with kandaharism? why you are bringing kandhar vs kabul and kandhar vs peshawer in discussions? please overcome this problem.
Regionalism is not so healthy for our fragile and already divided nation.

[Zahed]

Shlombay buddy, no matter what why u twist it but Shayesta khor pretty much chewed u up. I'm in touch with huge no of Qandaharis 'n none of them believes the nonsense u do. just look at Qandahars mayor 'n then wonder why Qandahar is in such state, the fact they refused a mayor like Sherzai in Qandahar showed u 're pretty screwed urselves up.

[Shayesta]

What on earth does official have to do with anything?

What on earth has official got to do with anything!? Then why don't you just say what on earth Pukhto has got to do with anything? Damn, that was senseless!

Afghanistan is Pashtun majority, Pashto is spoken, Pashto was always taught in schools. Just because now the west recognizes you are all so hyped?

Just because West recognizes what, Pukhto? Who the hell is West to recognize our language in our country? Be more specific please.

Afghanistan and Foreign investment.
Omg can someone teach her a little something about Afghanistan.

Hmmm, apparently none is updated enough like yourself so just for the sake of 'putting me in check', could you please do the favour then?

Kandahar city, Kabul city, Both are the most important cities of Afghanistan. When something or a bank has a branch in Kabul they make sure its in Kandahar as well!

And those very same branches are also to be found in Mazar, Herat, Jalalabad and you name it. So? Does it mean all those provinces reach the same level of importance?

Since you have never visited Kandahar, be quiet.

Says the one who never visited Laghman and Kunar but yet claims Pukhto is lost there? Indeed my friend; Be quiet.

Oh my God, No offence but how old are you?

Oh but why would you take offence in my age wrora? I am 20 years old, you?

Kabul has bomb blasts on a weekly basis, while Kandahar sees a bomb blast like 2-3 times a year.

Really? Then how come that all those weeks I spent there I didn't heard of even one bomb blast while Kandahar and Helmand are on news regularly?

Do I have to show you sources that show the importance of Kandahar?

What are you waiting for?

Afghanistan is a Pashtun majority nation, Kandahar is the capital of Pashtuns, cities like Peshawar are trying to reach up to its status but they cant due to their rapid usage of Urdu and Desification. Such as counting in Urdu.

Why would you take pride in being only Pukhto speaking province while Pekhawar has progressed much more then Kandahar and is doing much better than Kandahar as well? And is it today Pekhaweri's living in Kandahar or Kandahari's living in Pekhawer, Quetta, Karachi, etcetera?

That is because people like you fall for lies of the west and take it as a source. No one is ruling Pashtuns, No one. If you think the west rules Kandahar try again, They have shadow governors everywhere.

What lies am I falling for? The fact over 40 countries are commanding on us in our own land? The fact despite of Afghanistan being our own country we are being treated like an immigrant? Despite of the fact you claim Kandahar to be oh so strong yet all the tents from Arzaan-Qeemat to Khair Khana road in Kabul was resided by Kandahari's? What lies am I falling for, ha?

They were obviously talking about a city of it! Not the entire province.
There is a difference between a city and a province.

LOL, dude, what the hell you talking about!? If Kabul is only province of Afghanistan which exceeds population of one million, then how can Kandahar top that rate!? Or are you trying to say Kandahar city got a million people but the province of it got less than that? LOL, seriously, stop confusing us both!

Kandahar was the de-facto capital during the Taliban regime! Ahmad Shah Masood was scared of em and he met his fate.

That didn't answer my question. I asked why Ahmad Shah Massoud left Kabul out of fear for Taliban if everything was about Kandahar anyway?

Mohammad Najibullah? The same man who stood up with the N.A? You support him or something?

And even this didn't answer my question, I asked why he got killed for power in Kabul? Also at the same time answer me why Northern Alliance members like Ahmad Shah Massoud, Fahim, etcetera let go off Mohammad Najibullah when he seek them for help against Taliban?

Kandahar? Humiliation? lol, Ill tell you its far better off as compared to provinces like Kunar and Laghman. There are Canadians in Kandahar, and they are scared to death by the local Kandaharis.

Have you been to Kunar and Laghman? None of those people are scared of Taliban any more, they have learnt to stand up against them. I went to Laghman just two months ago and the relationship with Tajik's-Pukhtoons, status of our languages and educational form has improved drastically. There you go. And by the way, one of the members in this Forum himself once stated (in another Forum) that soldiers are treating Kandahari's very badly and I think it's the Admin. Lemme ask Admin this right away.

Oh my....where do I begin teaching you? Where?

From wherever you like mister teacher, I have got time and patience.

The west media has corrupted your innocent mindset. I feel bad for you.

Pakistani and Arab slaves a.k.a. Taliban have brainwashed you completely, I feel bad for you.

Look who is talking, That is why we are the only province who use and speak Pashto?

I am not talking about Kandahar, I am talking about Kabul where much more Pukhtoons have lost Pukhto than Tajik's losing Dari in Kandahar. Now for the sake of goodness don't go and disagree on this one as well!

Where are you from? Which province?

I am from Laghman; The very same Laghman which once used to be a Tajik area and 80% of Pukhtoons residing there now originally came from Kandahar: Including my forefathers.

The difference between me and you is I DO NOT speak Dari, while I can bet money you do.

Another difference between me and you is that you are full-blooded Pukhtoon while my grandmother's are Tajik's, but yet we don't even speak one word of Dari at home. And another difference between me and you is that you see yourself as a Kandahari, while before being a Laghmani I am a Pukhtana and therefore I do have the guts enough to point out where we Pukhtoons went wrong.

Because People like you got sold out,

And could you elaborate on who 'people like me' are? Because lemme remind you that since in Islam it's said you are what your father is, and since my forefathers where Ahmadzai's from Kandahar then so am I. And now since you belong to the same catogory as 'people like me', are you a sold out as well?

Just like how the Taliban made Pashto the SOLE national language of Afghanistan and language of business(Again Kandaharis)

And also just like how Taliban killed Hazara's, just like how Taliban raped Hazara's, just like how Taliban burned the fruit-trees in North to dismiss Tajik's and Uzbek's from only income they had, and just like how highly-positioned officials in Herat were kicked out from their places because they couldn't speak Pukhto. In other words; Just like how thanks to Taliban all non-Pukhtoon Afghans hate us. Is that what you are proud of? Just because they 'stood up for Pukhto'?

You do know that right? The same Kandaharis (Taliban) Made Pashto the most important and most used language of Afghanistan from 1996-2001, Did you thank us then?

Do 'you' (Taliban and Taliban-supporters) also want me to thank you for blowing up the statue of Bamiyan? Do you also want me to thank you for closing girls' schools? Do you also want me to thank you for throwing acid on faces of girls in Kandahar, because they wanted to study? In that case; Thanks a lot for ALL of this!

I live in "LITTLE KANDAHAR" come down here sister, I would make you my guest. We have 5 MOSQUES which are operated by KANDAHARIS! We even teach pashto in our mosques along with Arabic. I dont want to give you too much detail but I live in an area that has THOUSANDS of Kandahari families, all you hear is Pashto.

Then that's excellent and really well done! But when and where did I say all Kandahari's in West speak Dari? I said those I met, and you might have heard of Hessen in Germany? Just visit that place once and you will understand what I am talking about.

Its because people have no choice! What have other provinces did for Pashto?

Exactly! I didn't say only Kandahari's have done nothing for Pukhto, I said Pukhtoons in general haven't done much for Pukhto and that's why still Iranian books are used in Afghanistan to give lessons in Dari/Farsi.

You expect us to do everything? We have already done so much! How many professors,leaders,rulers can we produce? seriously? You cant expect us to influence areas thousands of miles away.

I don't expect you to do anything, but I also expect you to accept if you haven't done some things in particular either! Pukhtoons have been in power for centuries but none of them ever successfully managed to make Pukhto a popular language in Afghanistan and that's our own bloody fault only; Whether it has been a Kandahari leader, whether a Paktiawal, whether anyone else; None of them valued Pukhto enough.

We have so many Kandaharis here in this site, They all speak Pashto. yet we have people in Laghman,Loghar and other provinces who lost Pashto. Its a shame.

I would love to know how many Laghmani's are here and lost Pukhto? I was even on this Dutch Forum where none of the Kandahari's spoke Pukhto and they were trying to get back to Pukhto. And something actually shocked me was that there were even Paktiawals who couldn't speak Pukhto! And don't worry about the province of Laghman, there even Nurestani's are starting to speak Pukhto as their first language and it's only when they start living in North they lose their language; Just like Kandahari's. More than half of my family is married with Tajik's and guess what? All of them speak Pukhto as their first language.

I am not here to attack you or anything. PashtunForums is all of ours. I am not here trying to "ruin" your PF career. We are learning.

I know you ain't here to attack, attacking is for weak people and at least I believe in solutions per words. I have got a real life career as well and nor am I gonna leave this Forum just because you are being stubborn on your words. All is well.

[Master Khan]

shlombay You don't wanna argue with Shayesta Khor...she is dangerous

[Shayesta]

Great, so you take it out of context and call it senseless?

What was the 'context' about then?

PASHTO WAS ALWAYS SPOKEN MORE IN AFGHANISTAN AS COMPARED TO DARI. JUST BECAUSE THE WEST NOW RECOGNIZES PASHTO AS AN OFFICIAL LANGUAGE DOES NOT MEAN IT NOW EXISTS.

LOL, thanks for informing me that West just recently recognised Pukhto as an official language. Didn't know that yo!

Where do you want me to begin with?

Lemme repeat my quote;

From wherever you like mister teacher, I have got time and patience.

When people like you have never visited Kandahar, Its hard to discuss such a broad topic. The west recognizes how important Kandahar is and its strategic location and value.

I ever denied Kandahar is an important province? You are repeating that Kandahar is the most important city and the city the entire world is after: And now that's what I don't agree with.

This war is against Taliban and Pashtuns.

No way!?

Taliban was created in Kandahar by Kandaharis.

Ehh, no, Taliban was trained in Pakistan, it was Pakistan who supported them with Saudi and American money. Kandahari's and other Pukhtoons were just used as a tool, which was again overthrown when USA (father of Taliban) decided they personally would like to visit Afghanistan once.

It was Kandaharis who once again made Kandahar the capital of Afghanistan for a good 6-7 years.

You have repeated this at least a gazillion times and not even once I disagreed, now can we move on to the future please?

It was Kandaharis who made Pashto the SOLE national language and business language of Afghanistan. Many did not even know what Dari was.

What time-line you are talking about and which provinces?

Okay, Here we go again. You are telling me Laghmanis all speak Pashto just like Kandaharis?

Nope but Pukhtoons there do, even when non-Pukhtoons marry Pukhtoons in Laghman, Pukhto is always spoken at home next to Dari. Did you even know that 'Pukhto singer' Mangal is actually a Tajik? I visited his aunt's home back in Laghman.

Are you aware of the contributions of Kandahar? Can Pir_Rokhan please teach her a bit or two about Kandahar. Ever heard of Pata Khazana? Abdul Hai Habibi? Benawa ? Hotaki dynasty? Abdali Dynasty ? The founder of Afghanistan ?

Yes I have heard a lot of Kandahari distribution and I am very proud regarding that! For me a Kandahari is a Pukhtoon first and then a Kandahari, but for you a Kandahari is a Kandahari first, and then a Pukhtoon. I criticize or defend any Pukhtoon province as a Pukhtana, but you very blindly defend Kandahar just as a Kandahari, even if you have to state that Kandahar is much better than other Pukhtoon province.

I love Kunaris and especially Laghmanis, I heard they can also cook good. But you can not put them on the same tier as Kandahar and Kabul when it comes to politics. You just cant. even Kabul struggles to reach Kandahars status.

I seriously failed your statements about 'status'? What status are you talking about and what do other provinces have to do to reach 'Kandahari status'?

I think you missed the joke, let's ignore it.

I actually didn't but apparently you did.

Kandahar on news recently?

I repeat my quote again;

Then how come that all those weeks I spent there I didn't heard of even one bomb blast while Kandahar and Helmand are on news regularly?

Even Kandaharis ATTACK Kabul (Northern Alliance) Why? Cause they have stood up against their enemies (the west).

Is it? Is that the reason why more civilians die compared to policemen, Westerners, etcetera? Oh please!

Kandahar and Herat are the only the places in Afghanistan that actually look like cities.

I think you missed out on Mazar and Jalalabad?

History has already been made.

And who is gonna make our present? Or do we just have to sit quiet and be proud because we had a wonderful history, even if it doesn't improve our state?

How many Pashto schools are in Peshawar compare that to EVERY school in Kandahar that speaks Pashto.

Why do you keep jumping to languages? I never claimed Pekhaweri's have maintained Pukhto strongly, completely opposite in fact. I am talking about them economically, educationally and professional where Pekhaweri's are much much better off.

Do you want to know something interesting? No one FROM the city of Kandahar likes to work, or works. Want to know why? cause they all have LANDS and they all lived happily.

And does that land also provide them education, food, money, developement, a future, etcetera?

Speak to a Kandahary ask them how their lives were back home.

Even my family can't stop talking about how beautiful provinces like Nangarhar, Laghman, Kabul and etcetera were and how happy they were during that time. But what's the use of it now since it's today is absolutely ruined?

Kandahar has a lot of refugees. A lot of people from Laghman and other provinces come to Kandahar city and Kabul city to find jobs.

Even Kandahari's had moved to Laghman in huge numbers, I only wish the circumstances were as decent as back then.

Go to Karachi Kala boat, Many of the people who own rich houses and nice bangalas are Kandaharis. we for example own mansions, and boy are we not warlords. WE ARE FROM KANDAHAR CITY.

Woohoo, amazing! So were my forefathers! And I know about a Kandahari being richest man in Karachi and I also know why Quetta is only place in Pakistan where pure form of Pukhto is being spoken is because they are originally from Kandahar. My grandfather is also a very stubborn man when it comes to Pukhto and he literally made his son-in-laws 'convert' to Pukhto, just because he said his grandfather came from Kandahar as a Pukhtoon and he will keep up this wish and identity of his grandfather for as long as he can. I am not blaming Kandahari's for anything my dear, it's just that you felt like I am attacking entire Kandahari nation by saying that out Baba didn't make Pukhto our national language and that his son screwed status of Pukhto even more by changing the capital; Which is a fact.

Kandahar province according to sources that have EVEN been altered by Tajiks is about 1 million.

Do you mind showing me those sources please? Thanks.

Once again, Taliban = Group of students from Kandahar who made a set to seek revenge for our poor people and to seek revenge for our woman who were raped by Tajiks and uzbeks.

I would have been on Taliban side if they indeed only attacked guilty people. My in-laws had no choice than to join Ahmad Shah Massoud because Tajik's in Laghman were overthrown from every single high position. My grandmother's entire family had to leave Jalalabad because they forced to speak Pukhto with Taliban. And God knows what they might have done to the Northerners!

He got killed cause he considered us Pashtuns as dogs. As Pakistanis.

No, he didn't consider us Pukhtoon as dogs and Pakistani's; He considered Taliban as dogs and Pakistani's and how right he was.

I take pride in the fact that N.A got a smacking.

What about our people being smacked back by Northern Alliance after US invasion? What about our females being as young as six years old being raped by Northern Alliance? What about Pukhtoons being driven out from many Northern provinces by these very same Northern Alliance members? And all this out of revenge against Taliban?

I am sorry but unlike other provinces, we care for ALL Pashtuns all over Afghanistan. If I see you suffering Ill be the first to save you.

How can you judge what other provinces are like? Even Nangarhari's care enough to build an entire area named after Amanullah Khan. Our late Badshah Khan didn't choose to be buried in Nangarhar for nothing. There are even 'Loy Afghanistan' supporters in Nangarhar. And even our pride in sports is represented by Nangarhari's. That's why today Nangarhar is full of Pukhtoons from all over Afghanistan.

]
Taliban just took over parts of Kunar again. Ask Kunar1990

Ehh, they are still in Laghman as well, so? When my brother said he feels like there are Taliban hiding between mountains in Islamabad area of Laghman, my husband's cousins all took their guns out and started to fire in the air so that the Taliban comes out, LOL. Even women have gathered the guts to reply back at them.

I have nothing against an average Tajik. I have a lot against those who try to badmouth us.

Same here, that's why I tag the normal ones as Afghan Tajik's and the biased and racist ones as Khorasani's. Makes sense, na?

Its because they choose not to speak Pashto. Many people in Laghman chose the same.

I dare you to find me one Kandahari who speaks Pukhto despite of his parents and him being raised in Kabul.

Great. Can you speak Pashto?

Another difference between me and you is that you are full-blooded Pukhtoon while my grandmother's are Tajik's, but yet we don't even speak one word of Dari at home.

Reverse Psychology does not work. You can be an Ahmadzai yet be a sold out. Depends on your roots and how much dollars it takes you to to go against your people.

In other words; You can be a proud Kandahari who has made a great history for Pukhtoons, but yet be an idiot enough to fall for Pakistan's destruction towards Afghanistan a.k.a. Taliban. Fair enough?

Expect a lot of Tajiks and Hazaras to die again.

And that's exactly I do not want because I am also a human being and unlike Taliban, West, etcetera, I do care for human life..........

I am starting to feel bad for you. You honestly think people blew up schools and innocent people under the name of Pashtun and Islam?

No, I also don't think statue of Bamiyan is blown up by Taliban in name of Pukhtoons and Islam. Surely that was also a propaganda by Northern Alliance. It indeed wasn't Taliban who also closed the girls-school I was in in Jalalabad.

[Farhan88]

Shlombay wror, I'm not trying to be funny or anything but its actually Shayesta khor who is beating some sense into u. Throughout she discussed this subject as a Pashtana while u 're only reacting as a Kandahari. She's showing her concern about Pashtun's present and future while u 're stick in the past. She's absolutely right by asking what good our great history is bringing in our today? And the answer is NOTHING. Ahmad Shah Abdali surely was a qahraman but marrying a Parsibana was his greatest mistake, because that's what made his son a Parsiban as who decided to make a Persian city ur capital. No matter how great our personalities were, but Bacha Khan indeed was the only one who was really concerned about Pashtuns and our language, that's why he's possibly the only one I respect with all my heart as for me he was a PERFECT Pashtun. I got a Kandahari mate who told me how foreign soldiers storm houses in Kandahar ''in search for Taliban" and many women face humiliation that way. U should be thinking about what we can do NOW and in the FUTURE for our people, stop taking pride in ur past.

[MazloomyarMaseed]

I also agree with Farhan.

Kandaharis didnt make Taliban, Afghans and Pashtuns over all, made up the slave ships that Pakistan sent to make Afghanistan its new province.

[Muslimah]

Great job shlombay! Totally being serious!

[Muslimah]

That article pretty much sums it all up!

just to throw something in there
Military bases are set up in kandahar - because thats centre to all the action and resources they need.

and liwaney - A+ .. me so proud

[Farhan88]

Salam. Welcome to the community.

Thanks mate and thanks for the pm as well, appreciate it. And once again what u 've done is take pride in past. Yes we did 've a great history where we can be proud of, but 've we ourselves lived that great history? No. 'Re our children gonna experience same beautiful past? With our current situation, I doubt it. All Shayesta khor said that its of no use if ONLY Kandahar is a 100% Pashto speaking province because aint gonna improve status of Pashto in entire Afghanistan, so basically what she was saying is that we as PASHTOONS 're ruining our language, she didn't blame Kandaharis for this. That's just what u made out of it. Nowhere I saw her attack Kandaharis buddy. I remember Shayesta from CK where she was also a very active member and I remember her love for Pashto and Pashttoons and she was so proud of Pashtoons that she used to compare Pashtoons with others to make herself feel better, and now u 're doing exactly the same my friend. But now I sense dissappointment and sadness into her regarding, and very unfortunately u missed that bit. Read back ur comments from the start and u 'll what she said and what u made out of it.

[Farhan88]

I also agree with Farhan.
Kandaharis didnt make Taliban, Afghans and Pashtuns over all, made up the slave ships that Pakistan sent to make Afghanistan its new province.

Unfortunately we 've lost our ghairat wror, some lost their imaan to US out of money, and some 've lost it to Taliban out of stupidity and false Pashtoon pride. None cares about an average Pashtoon anymore, a lot of my Swati mates promised on their lives that they saw some Taliban in Pak army and I 've got Jalalabadi friends who 're 1000% certain Taliban and US 're one. And why shall I doubt it since Pak sent Taliban to Afghanistan to destroy our motherland and US did that to create ethical tension? Those Tajiks I personally know aint bad people but majority of them left their country because under Taliban rule they had no rights whatsoever. And just to clear some minds, those Tajiks don't support NA either.

[MazloomyarMaseed]

Unfortunately we 've lost our ghairat wror, some lost their imaan to US out of money, and some 've lost it to Taliban out of stupidity and false Pashtoon pride. None cares about an average Pashtoon anymore, a lot of my Swati mates promised on their lives that they saw some Taliban in Pak army and I 've got Jalalabadi friends who 're 1000% certain Taliban and US 're one. And why shall I doubt it since Pak sent Taliban to Afghanistan to destroy our motherland and US did that to create ethical tension? Those Tajiks I personally know aint bad people but majority of them left their country because under Taliban rule they had no rights whatsoever. And just to clear some minds, those Tajiks don't support NA either.

I also agree.

But roara jan, Our people are deceived so badly under the name of Taliban that ISI has made sure youth are brainwashed with saudi money and litrature into belieiving this world is nothing and we shou,dnt prrogress but do jihad jihad jihad and do it in other peoples countries etc.

[pukhtana]

There is no doubt that Kandahar plays a much larger role in politics compared to Kabul. That is a fact.

[Shayesta]

@Farhan
WOW, I can't believe you figured out my intention in just few lines while it took me pages to make others understand the same thing! Thanks a lot for actually realising what I am talking about and bringing some sense into this thread, thanks a bunch! And about my experience in CK, I will come back to that and other comments by tomorrow and glad to have you with us.