Rally against reconciliation/compromise with Taliban

[khyaal]

They need to be reconcilled and then disarmed and then made to participate through legitimate democratics means in the national politics. If they carry on with their zombietoon and being then they should be made evaporised with some good chemicals being droped from above.

You witnessed what happened to Mula Beradar. They have to take this decision collectively.

[Nokia_Apridy]

awo da hem wakhlay........

YouTube - Govt Opposition Warn of Taking to Streets-05-05-2011-TOLOnews.com

[ComradePashtun]

But Pakistan still possesses enough control on them that is why Pakis so arrogantly claim that any agreement without Pakistan will be a failure. Pakis had already sabotaged the Geneva accord after the USSR withdrawl.

Oh the irony. Cry me a river bro. I don't give a monkey about what Pakis claim or do to serve their interest, we need to reconcile with our own Afghans and be able to trust each other so a Pakis is not an arbitrator. It is a fact and reality one way or the other we need to get out of the situation.

[Azmal]

With due respect guys, I absolutely respect what Saleh is doing, and the chants of death to Punjabis and Taliban are great,but its a dissapointing reality that Pashtuns do not have the gutts to do something similar, as they fear a ISI reprisal.

Secondly, we must remember, who Ahmad Shah Masood was, he was the guy who was trained by Bhutto, armed to the teeth by Pakistans ISI and sent to overthrow the Afghan government in Panshir, even Hameed gul stated he was too involved in the uprising in Pansjir.

These Pansjiri are opportunists just like the Punjabis are and the Pashtun elements of Taliban, these guys are the same people who based their movement under the name of Jamiet Islami in Peshawer and complained about how Secular and unislamic the Afghanistan governemnt is, they are just as Radical as Taliban.

However, I am impressed by their protest agaisnt Pakistan but their intentions are Questionable.

Gulabo, these same Minorities were the first to join hands with Pakistans ISI to limit the influence of Pashtuns, to be honest I couldnt care less what they say.

Well said…but lets not forgetAhmad Shah Massoud was a devout Islamist(Ikhwani) and supporter of an Islamic regime in Afghanistan. His and Golbodin Hakmatyar training by Pakistan were more in line with their Ikhwani ideology then their ethnic-centrism.

[ScimitarXEdge]

i don't know who this person is and what his agenda is, but i know for a fact that there are many who oppose this reconciliation with taliban... mainly the Dari speaking people and of course some pashtoons as well.. the ones who oppose this simply give me one reason... taliban are backed by pakistan and if we have any taliban influence in our country (Afghanistan), they will take any measure to serve their masters (pakistan).

let's face it... many saw taliban as an enemy when taliban were in power back in mid 90s to 2000. minorities in afghanistan were specially very intimidated by their presence. i am not talking about politicians, rather the common man. now the politicians, knowing this, are taking full of advantage of the situation.

Under no circumstance, will the minorities accept the taliban as their government, and if any such event occurs in Afghanistan, another episode of civil war is for sure.

every Afghan citizen wants the government to represent him, and the taliban 'government' didn't represent every afghan... nor did they care about every afghan citizen. they operated in a way, as if they were instructed to alianate minorities in Afghanistan (probably by their masters in Pakistan)

This is true, but it's also true about every other Afghan government represented pretty much the same thing.

Massoud represented Russian/Indian/Iranian interests

Taliban, Pakistani

Hizbe Wahdat, Iranian

Najib Russian interests

and now even Karzai (American/Western interests)

what makes any of these any worse than the other really? It seems the real issue isn't foreign power, but how brown or light skinned the foreign power is.

[Alchemist]

This is true, but it's also true about every other Afghan government represented pretty much the same thing.

Massoud represented Russian/Indian/Iranian interests

Taliban, Pakistani

Hizbe Wahdat, Iranian

Najib Russian interests

and now even Karzai (American/Western interests)

what makes any of these any worse than the other really? It seems the real issue isn't foreign power, but how brown or light skinned the foreign power is.

the same can be said about you too

whose interests are you representing?

[ScimitarXEdge]

Comrade, I agree.

However, I know about the University of Nebraska producing Jihadi Pamplets for Afghan orphans to fight the Soviets, I know the dirty tactics of the West to use our people as Instruments to give the Soviets their vietname, however, Pakistan was much more devious in this case, as they both stole the aid and kept the weapons for their own Favourites I.E Hekmatyar and co.

Khyaal, Northern alliance are just as Islamist as Taliban, except they are more protective of their own races and region while on the other hand our Pashtuns spend most of their time bickering with eachother instead of doing some serious political work.

Mark my words, if a Pashtun government does arise, you will see this same northern alliance join hands with Pakistan.

How can I support bigot traitors and betrayers who left Najibullah to the hands of the ISI?

Remmeber, a Pashtun never forgets his enemies.

who cares Najib killed more Pashtuns than the Taliban ever has; and he had Russian hands up his backside moving him around as a puppeter, even Russian Intelligence officers confirm that Najib used to take orders directly from the Spetznaz and no, that's not some Pakistani fabrication, do some reading. All these former Soviets all testify about Najib being basically a Russian Errand boy.

I don't see why anyone would feel sad for Najib, even most Ahmadzi hate Najib, and he was an Ahmadzi. He was one of the biggest Pashtun enemies there was.

It's weird how you selectively manipulate and exploit Pashtun ideals and customs

a Pashtun would cut you to piece for suggesting it is acceptable for girls to wear bikinis, but somehow this is acceptable but you'll try to draw upon Pashtun's sense of vengeance.

and save your usual counter response; it's weak

[ScimitarXEdge]

the same can be said about you too

whose interests are you representing?

God Almighty

[Alchemist]

God Almighty

How do you know what the interest of God Almighty is?

He talks to you?

[ScimitarXEdge]

How do you know what the interest of God Almighty is?

He talks to you?

Nature reveals all to those who are keen on understanding it. Nature is the physical manifestation of the Qur'an.

[Azmal]

Abdullah2X is a thug and this rally is more a US pressure tactic against Karzia until the inking of joint forces agreement…but I to think reconciliation with Pakistani trained militia aka Taliban…is a treason for following reasons.

1- Reconciliation will further weaken the central gov, it will allocated south and eastern Afghanistan to Taliban(Read Pakistan), and will creature two opposing powers with constant hostility…NA thugs vs Talibi thugs. We all know a weak central government is far more vulnerable to foreign intervention and ultimate breakup, a strong central government is not. Afghanistan is unstable and has been unstable precisely because the central government has always been weak vis-à-vis the regional powers -- this has ALWAYS been the case for the past 250 years. That was not true in Iran where you had a strong administrative central state, not true in Pakistan under British rule, and not true in the north with Soviet rule over the "stans". All those neighbors were subject to strong central control. Even Pakistan today, for all practical purposes, is under strong central control, with exception of a few border areas, which are horrific problems for Pakistan and only liked by the wacko Islamists in the Pakistani elite.

2- Taliban, NA and other factions could care less about Afghan national interest, central power, democracy, Islam, or anything else. They only cared about being an effective proxy for their bosses so they could get more financing. Look what happened to Hekmatyar. As soon as Pakistan dumped his a$$ for the Talibs and his money source ran dry, he started talking about "moderation" and "compromise". When Massod/Rabbani was corned in hole of Punjshir..they start talking about “broad base gov” and “compromise”… THAT was the ultimate source of the civil war.

The fact that Afghans exist who are/were willing to pimp everything to a foreign power for money and power was not new. What was new was that due to the Communists' destruction of both the state and civil society in Afghanistan, there was not a credible INTERNAL power source that could stand up to these foreign-funded proxy armies. And yes, the main reason for this was the lack of a strong central government.

3- Reconciliation with dogmatic wahabi/Dewbani group like Taliban will take us tens of years back from our goal of establishing a secular social democracy where religion is a private matter…and I don’t mean secularism like that of communist societies where religion is forbidden, but a secular constitution that guarantees each citizen's right to freely practice their religion, much like the United States. Some of you may object to this, but I tell you when I went to Afghanistan in 2003 and went into a masjid, it was completely devoid of any happiness or spirituality. It felt completely dead. Yet, miraculously, in the United States, in the land of "kafirs", the muslims here are the most religious in the whole muslim world. The same is true for Christians and other religious people. Only when people are completely free to practice as they choose will their religious devotion be truly authentic…and this is why I think this is closer to the Islamic ideal.

[ghundal]

You mean your goal of establishing secularism which will not fall through??

Tribes have rejected all agreements. Afghans have rejected the foreigners.

[ScimitarXEdge]

Azmal is the mouthpiece of the American CIA and wants to impose American ways on Afghans.

read it yourself; he admits it right there

.....will take us tens of years back from our goal of establishing a secular social democracy where religion is a private matter…and I don’t mean secularism like that of communist societies where religion is forbidden, but a secular constitution that guarantees each citizen's right to freely practice their religion, much like the United States

Making a country much like the United States is the United States goals; this is why people who Hijack the name of Nationalism are always deceitful, they use this Jargon of National Interests for Afghanistan, to promote the National Interests of Western Imperialists.

Read between the lines at how these frauds expose themselves.

[Alchemist]

Nature reveals all to those who are keen on understanding it. Nature is the physical manifestation of the Qur'an.

???

Pantheism is the view that the Universe (Nature) and God are identical.[1] Pantheists thus do not believe in a personal, anthropomorphic or creator god. The word derives from the Ancient Greek: πᾶν (pan) meaning "all" and θεός (theos) meaning "God". As such, Pantheism denotes the idea that "God" is best seen as a way of relating to the Universe.[2] Although there are divergences within Pantheism, the central ideas found in almost all versions are the Cosmos as an all-encompassing unity and the sacredness of Nature.

You do realize you are committing shirk?

[Alchemist]

Azmal is the mouthpiece of the American CIA and wants to impose American ways on Afghans.

read it yourself; he admits it right there



Making a country much like the United States is the United States goals; this is why people who Hijack the name of Nationalism are always deceitful, they use this Jargon of National Interests for Afghanistan, to promote the National Interests of Western Imperialists.

Read between the lines at how these frauds expose themselves.

OK

not secular nationalism.

Not Taliban's Theocratic "barbarism"...

What is your alternate solution?