Salamuna

[Golden]

History of Pashtuns is from Marwat parts of Pakistan, he knows a lot about hamsaya system when it came applied to Punjabis

[MENTION=18842]History of Pashtuns[/MENTION]

can you tell us more about hamsaya system worked? ...Tilla jogian is confused and thinks it just means being a manual laborer

it's doing specific jobs for land owners in small towns. These people are known as kammi as is the case with afghani pathans. Nothing really wrong with it but people look down because that's how society is in rural areas.

I have read this so called hamsaya system on PF once, its 100% similar to punjab kammi system with different name. Landless people working for landowners in return for food and place to live. What is so complicated here?

Unless hamsaya system mean slave bonded labour which you imply in your posts then it's indeed different then one found in Punjab. But we both know this isn't the case so why waste our time with semantics. Not sure why you call every kammi pathan punjabi. Punjabis are found in central punjab not in KPK. lol

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

it's doing specific jobs for land owners in small towns. These people are known as kammi as is the case with afghani pathans. Nothing really wrong with it but people look down because that's how society is in rural areas.

I have read this so called hamsaya system on PF once, its 100% similar to punjab kammi system with different name. Landless people working for landowners in return for food and place to live. What is so complicated here?

Unless hamsaya system mean slave bonded labour which you imply in your posts then it's indeed different then one found in Punjab. But we both know this isn't the case so why waste our time with semantics. Not sure why you call every kammi pathan punjabi. Punjabis are found in central punjab not in KPK. lol

Still not the same thing; being forced to be a servant and having the freedom to choose cannot be compared. Also, Pashtuns did it to Punjabis on their own turf. Same never happened to Pashtuns.

History of Pashtuns can explain it better for you.

[Golden]

You're basically just copying what I wrote and trying to apply it on me; it doesn't work both ways unfortunately. the fact you're trying to deflect my words shows there's truth to what I wrote.

And I never insulted anyone; if you feel I insulted you, that's your inferiority complex talking.

Even dimwitted members can see you write in insulting and condensing tone towards us.You never let go oportunity to brag and insult us. You are not fooling anyone here. Plus you never forget to write "inferiority complex" once in your posts which is quite ironic coming from afghani pathans don't you think? I mean wake up for god sake, stop living in lala land. World have moved on but you refuse to accept reality.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Even dimwitted members can see you write in insulting and condensing tone towards us.You never let go oportunity to brag and insult us. You are not fooling anyone here. Plus you never forget to write "inferiority complex" once in your posts which is quite ironic coming from afghani pathans don't you think? I mean wake up for god sake, stop living in lala land. World have moved on but you refuse to accept reality.

That's your personal insecurity talking. It's not ironic at all; most of your counter remarks have no clear documentation, they seem more reaction. Where as we can see by posts by HoP, there's historical references that acknowledge that Pashtuns subjugated and made Punjabis indentured servants.

This isn't bragging this is reality vs. fantasy.

[Golden]

Still not the same thing; being forced to be a servant and having the freedom to choose cannot be compared. Also, Pashtuns did it to Punjabis on their own turf. Same never happened to Pashtuns.

History of Pashtuns can explain it better for you.

Men you are delusional, I told you your worth in punjab and you're still braging like mad dog. You're also purposely confusing slave bonded labour with hamasaya system to feel better.

In either case this apply to pashto speaking nationalist anti-punjabi pathans like Toramana in KPK and not proper punjabis as you wished.

Calling KPK pathans a punjabi will not change status of real afghani pathans in punjab.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Calling KPK pathans a punjabi will not change status of real afghani pathans in punjab.

You're right, because one is documented in historical annals as detailed by History of Pashtun's threads, while the other is just something you pulled from the air as a defense mechanism.

[Golden]

You're right, because one is documented in historical annals as detailed by History of Pashtun's threads, while the other is just something you pulled from the air as a defense mechanism.

One is happening right in front of our eyes, other is for people with inferiority complex to take refuge in distant past with questionable sources. Not to forget that majority of Paki pathans are pashtunized punjabis and bonded labour according to Iblis historian. lol

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

One is happening right in front of our eyes, other is for people with inferiority complex to take refuge in distant past with questionable sources. Not to forget that majority of Paki pathans are pashtunized punjabis and bonded labour according to Iblis historian. lol

Something that lacks documentation would be more questionable than a documented source. So in such a case the latter is more reliable.

And by the way never said the last part. I said the Pakistani Pashtuns were the Pashtuns that conquered the Punjabis; so I don't get why you're upset with Afghan Pashtuns, but are silent about the Pashtuns that made you hamsaya. Seems deliberate.

[skully Lewa]

warka dang

[Golden]

Something that lacks documentation would be more questionable than a documented source. So in such a case the latter is more reliable.

And by the way never said the last part. I said the Pakistani Pashtuns were the Pashtuns that conquered the Punjabis; so I don't get why you're upset with Afghan Pashtuns, but are silent about the Pashtuns that made you hamsaya. Seems deliberate.

What documentation? 99% neutral sources posted on this forum are from British era. And there is nothing in them like you suggest. You mean people living in KPK, FATA were punjabis before pathans conquered them and made them bonded labour. And then you talk about documentationa and historical facts how about using common sense for a change?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

What documentation? 99% neutral sources posted on this forum are from British era. And there is nothing in them like you suggest. You mean people living in KPK, FATA were punjabis before pathans conquered them and made them bonded labour. And then you talk about documentationa and historical facts how about using common sense for a change?

Read the posts by History of Pashtun; These sources are clearly neutral because if they weren't Briitish would not have created Pakistan and we know this since its first administrators were British.

what I mean is that Pashtun tribes moved into the area and besieged the local population and subjugated them. Some of them retreated further into Punjab, others had to suffer as hamsaya. you just affirmed the documentation in British sources, so that's all there needs to be.

[Golden]

Read the posts by History of Pashtun; These sources are clearly neutral because if they weren't Briitish would not have created Pakistan and we know this since its first administrators were British.

what I mean is that Pashtun tribes moved into the area and besieged the local population and subjugated them. Some of them retreated further into Punjab, others had to suffer as hamsaya. you just affirmed the documentation in British sources, so that's all there needs to be.

Ok let's say you're right, what these ancient indigenous people of KPK/FATA who now all speak pashto and identify as pathans have anything to do with punjabis?

Do you mean before pathans from Sulaiman range came, people in FATA/KPK regions spoke punjabi?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Ok let's say you're right, what these ancient indigenous people of KPK/FATA who now all speak pashto and identify as pathans have anything to do with punjabis?

Do you mean before pathans from Sulaiman range came, people in FATA/KPK regions spoke punjabi?

Their origins are Punjabi is my point and up until very recently considered hamsaya. Now they want to pass as Pashtun, but even though they speak Pashto, we know their actual origins by their names. This happens in Afghanistan too with some Tajiks and Hazaras

To be honest; History of Pashtuns is a better source for the details than I am.

[Golden]

Their origins are Punjabi .

hahahahahahhahahahahah

LMFAO

[Azmal]

Where are all our buddies?

Welcome back bro!



Golden,

There is no such a thing as Pakistani Pashtun or Afghani Pashton, these division are foreign imposed and artificial. Two nation theories was based on religion-as Jenah try to explain it…thus reason for separation of Punjab, Bangal and Sind was religion what was the reason for separation of Pashtuns from Afghanistan? We in Afghanistan are not greedy we simply want what is rightfully ours.