Dual nationality: 278 Afghans held for possessing Pak CNICs

[Michin Khel]

PESHAWAR: The government of Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa (K-P) has sent alarm bells ringing across the province after intelligence agencies arrested 278 Afghan nationals holding fake Computerised National Identity Cards (CNICs).
The cards were acquired from NADRA offices in small towns of far-flung areas. The CNICs were not fake, but apparently, the process through which these were acquired was fraudulent.
“A number of Afghan refugees (have) managed to obtain fake CNICs from different National Database and Registration Authority(NADRA) offices, especially from Zhob, Loralai, Bhakkar, Muzafargarh,Thatta and Dera Islmail Khan,” the K-P Home and Tribal Affairs Department said in a notification.
The commissioner Dera Ismail Khan has been directed to take action against Afghan nationals carrying CNICs, along with all those who had been involved in providing CNICs to the Afghan nationals, it said.
When contacted, an official of the Home Department requesting anonymity told The Express Tribune that the department had been receiving information against Afghan nationals having fake CNICs.
“We have issued instructions to NADRA to start screening all the CNICs issued, which would help identify fake CNICs,” he said.
“Apart from CNICs, Afghan nationals, who have transferred properties andvehicles in their names, would also be netted and their properties would be auctioned or confiscated,” the official said.

http://tribune.com.pk/story/378429/dual-nationality-278-afghans-held-for-possessing-pak-cnics/

[Michin Khel]

What were these 278 high-profile-afghans-of splendid-history thinking for trying to be pakistanis. Afghans are heirs of ghaznavi, ghauri, abdali and pakistanis are just 60 year old nation with angraiz ka bacha, jinnah their father of nation. These 278 afghans should be trialed for treason in afghanistan for obtaining nationality of enemy pakistan. These kind of afghans injure "Great afghanistan movement" and make it bald.
And i am shocked and traumatized: ANP governament, who believe in loy afghanistan, lar o bar yo afghan, are arresting their afghan brothers...

[torkham]

it is happening both ways. when i was in kabul at ministry of interior, i was told that a minority of iranians and pakistanis were trying to get hold of afghan tazkara/passports. it means that afghan passport is helping these people in some ways - your guess is good as mine - i am sure it is business and money making related racket.
as a result the government has, so he claimed, toughened the procedure of issuance of tazkara - ie documented proof of afghan origin required ie father's tazkara number.
even though these proceedures are annoying, the afghan security checks are annoying, i feel it is the best for afghanistan.

[faye]

don't have the details but i heard a snippet of news about pakistanis faking it as afghans, to get into australia.

[Michin Khel]

it is happening both ways. when i was in kabul at ministry of interior, i was told that a minority of iranians and pakistanis were trying to get hold of afghan tazkara/passports. it means that afghan passport is helping these people in some ways - your guess is good as mine - i am sure it is business and money making related racket.
as a result the government has, so he claimed, toughened the procedure of issuance of tazkara - ie documented proof of afghan origin required ie father's tazkara number.
even though these proceedures are annoying, the afghan security checks are annoying, i feel it is the best for afghanistan.

In the above post i was merely throwing sarcastic arrows at those who live in fantasy world and are disgusted to see curruncy notes in jalalabad with jinnah.
On serious note: like you said every afghan in pakistan who is businessmen and of good economic status would try to get pakistani nationality so that they can enjoy uses of dual nationality. I know of a afghan family in naurang, lakki marwat, who are actually from khost and are sahibzadas. They have dual nationality and their businesses stretch between pakistan and afghanistan, they are quite wealthy. Recently one of them got admission in kmc on open seat i.e as a pakistani.
I believe there are thousands of afghans who are with fake NICs, who wants to be bullied by peshawer police?
This thread has also to do with ghorzang's topic about union between pak and afghanistan.....6 to 7 millions afghans are alreay clung to pakistan and are sucking it as if pakistan is breast of their mothers.

[Michin Khel]

@Faye
Those pakistanis are from FATA and KP. In our birth certificate our qomiat is mentioned as afghan. We pashtuns of pakistan are quick to identify ourselves as afghan in foriegn countries. In qatar i was playing cricket with my pakistani friends and that palestenian boy asked me whether we were indian, i said to him , no, i am afghan. I dont know why i said that.
Also those fakes appyling in australia might be genuine afghan refugees in pakistan, confusing for ausliatians and difficult for them to confirm their authenticity.

[Admin Khan]

Like torkham lala said, this goes both ways. Its kind of hard to not run into a Pakistani in Afghanistan, most of them possess fake Afghan tazkiras. NDS on a monthly basis captures a dozen of Pakistanis, most for as you very well know Luffy are captured for for terrorist related reasons -- something Pakistan has an international gold medal in. Dunkya ki koi bhi jaga Pakistani dehshatgaro sai khaley nahein. Not even my local subway, tsk tsk.

[Michin Khel]

ANP guys are are not dumb, they know that these 278 afghans are their brothers but are involved in suspicious activities like spying so with the help of agencies they are arresting them. In reality There are thousands of afghans with fake NICs but only these few hundreds of them have sold themeselves for spying agencies based in afghanistan and are injurious to KP and its people. But majority of afghans seek pakistani nationality for economic benefits. Similarly many pashtuns of pakistan might be working for ISI as afghans in afghanistan.

[Toramana]

No one is so much irked with Pashtuns from Afghanistan settling in KP and the rest of Pakistan as this Hindkai-Siraikai Luffy. Generally, I have observed that Hindo-speaking Kharyan, Urdu-speaking Mahajars of Karachi, and Siraiki speakers have strong resentment against Pashtuns migration and settlement in Peshawar, Karachi, Hazara, and Siraiki belt.

Lately, in Kharyan, this attitude has become weaker though because more and more of them have become bilingual due to migration of Pashtuns to cities in large numbers where they study with Pashtun kids and live along-side Pashtuns in mixed localities.

[faye]

@Faye
Those pakistanis are from FATA and KP. In our birth certificate our qomiat is mentioned as afghan. We pashtuns of pakistan are quick to identify ourselves as afghan in foriegn countries. In qatar i was playing cricket with my pakistani friends and that palestenian boy asked me whether we were indian, i said to him , no, i am afghan. I dont know why i said that.
Also those fakes appyling in australia might be genuine afghan refugees in pakistan, confusing for ausliatians and difficult for them to confirm their authenticity.

and they also might really be non afghans just faking it as afghan refugees.

[Michin Khel]

No one is so much irked with Pashtuns from Afghanistan settling in KP and the rest of Pakistan as this Hindkai-Siraikai Luffy. Generally, I have observed that Hindo-speaking Kharyan, Urdu-speaking Mahajars of Karachi, and Siraiki speakers have strong resentment against Pashtuns migration and settlement in Peshawar, Karachi, Hazara, and Siraiki belt.

Lately, in Kharyan, this attitude has become weaker though because more and more of them have become bilingual due to migration of Pashtuns to cities in large numbers where they study with Pashtun kids and live along-side Pashtuns in mixed localities.

Khaarain aka hinkowals of peshawer were never much anti-pashtun to begin with. As you dont live in peshawer so you dont know that the ones who are anti-pashtuns are usually urdu speaking indian mohajirs , who have settled in peshawer since 1947. In looks they very dark, like indians and fake themeselves as hindkowals, punjabis , kashmiris and some times as pashtuns. You would find them in peshawer with greasy long hairs, black skin , wearing pant shirt jeans and their youngsters are some times involved in street crimes..so correct your information. Surely khariyan are looked down upon pashtuns but still they were not that offensive. And they were rightly concerned about large afghan migration to peshawer as it entirely changed the demographics and culture of peshawer. Old peshawer is praised but nowdays peshawer is mess, not due to afghans but also large migrations from other parts of province.
And as for as settlements of afghans is concerned. Many have already settled as "pakistanis", the rest are trying their best like in the case of these afghans with fake NICs. I am ok with those who are permenantly settled but like every common pashtun, i would question the presence of unknown strange people whether they are afghans or punjabis or pashtuns from neighbouring districts. If you regularly reads newspapers then you must have read the news batagram in which locals were demanding expulsion of afghans because some of them had occupied lands by force...the truth behind the story might be different but if you are pashtun then you should not know that pashtuns are sensitive to strangers . I can not go to bajaur or malakand , roaming in their villages and expecting that no one would question me just because i am fellow pashtun from lakki. Pashtuns allow settling of outsiders as "hamsaya", always remember that...as a canadian you would never understand these deep things.

[tor_khan]

Luffy. Even whilst you are being sentimental about a time when there was relative peace in Peshawar, you forget that with the rise in urbanisation, there have been demographic shifts in all big cities across the world - not just Peshawar. Cities change. Karachi today is not what it used to be 50 years ago; Mumbai, London, Toronto, New York Kabul and so on have changed. Depending on how these are managed some changes at times increase slight tensions, other times these are barely noticed.

You might feel that you are right by expressing the 'truth' about people's resentment towards settlers from 'outside', but if you extend your logic to Karachi, say, for example, then you would be speaking the language of the Urdu-speaking Mohajirs because they generally argue that the arrival of Pashtuns there has had a negative effect on that city. Of course, the irony is that Urdu-speakers in Karachi too are settlers and they have tried to change a city that historically had more in common with Bombay into a version of Dehli. Even you would know that the two are very different.

And as for what Torkham and Admin Khan have already said here - again - there are significant numbers of 'Pakistanis' living and working in Afghanistan. And like Afghan nationals, there are Pakistanis who will cross borders legally, or illegally in search of opportunity.

For convenience sake people may still need Pakistan identity documents, but in truth it is very tenuous and practically every educated Pashtun I know insists on shedding the 'Pakistan' label when they acquire a foreign citizenship. It's a pattern that I see over and over and especially amongst Pashtuns who feel very little cultural commonality with Lahore or Karachi. Do not be surprised if a generation of Pashtuns who originate from 'Pakistan' identify themselves as Afghan when overseas.

[Michin Khel]

Tor khan i agree with your post. The aim of my thread was to show that there is deep contrast between views presented in this forum and views held by general afghan population. Pakistanis dont look down upon afghans, those punjabis, mohajirs etc with afghan ancestors proudly mention their afghan roots. So if pakistanis fake themeselves as "afghans", afghans should take it as compliment. But numerous times afghan members here have expressed their disgust that why i identify myself as pakistani, its disgusting and filthy to be paki. I dont know from where they are getting their feelings, probably from racist enviroment in their countries. But i have explained to them that ground realities are different, afghans who were always appreciated by hindostani muslims, are nowadays destroyed and wrecked nation...millions of them living in pakistan as poor people, with very very low income, in their own countries good job are taken by pakistanis and others as they are not educated, qualified and skilled enough. The brains that fled during russian invasion to foriegn, never returned to afghanistan....the sons and daughters of those runaways brains, are members of PF and other afghan forums....there is big difference between these mummy papa afghans and those hard working afghans in pakistan who through every legal and illegal means are trying to establish themeselves in relatively stable pakistan. Now when i tell these mummy papa, burger eating afghans that pakistan is a developing country while afghanistan is backward country on level of somalia (actually somalia is ahead, it has sea), they become angry at me and act like stupids. The purpose of the thread is slap one of the reality on their faces, afghans of homeland are different from them. They are not obsessed with being rosey cheeked aryans. I mean a wagay (maize) selling afghan in abbotabad is not taking pride in his rosey cheeks compared to locals, he yearn for rupees with jinnah face...he dont hate curruncy with jinnah face, he love it.
My words would always hurt afghans because they are mostly the ones who are living in fool's paradise and should connect themeselves to ground realities. They have to sacrifice themeselves for afghanistan, i mean KP dont need toramana back from canada, as tens of thousands of capable educated pashtuns are here in KP the field in which toramana works. But afghanistan need every afghan in the west, from admin khan to randolph, every one.
But they wont. The second generation afghans are already wearing pants down to buttt-crack and utter "yo", "nigga" ,..and Some have lost their faith, many are drinking, dating etc, they are assimilating into westren society, a natural process. So little of my bitter doses are good for their health.
As for as senior people like toramana are concerned. My message to them, "you can call me kharay, hindko, seraiki for your delight, but its your children's way of life , langauge and identity that is in danger, of become de-pashtunized, not mine's"

[pashtanajan]

Luffy. Even whilst you are being sentimental about a time when there was relative peace in Peshawar, you forget that with the rise in urbanisation, there have been demographic shifts in all big cities across the world - not just Peshawar. Cities change. Karachi today is not what it used to be 50 years ago; Mumbai, London, Toronto, New York Kabul and so on have changed. Depending on how these are managed some changes at times increase slight tensions, other times these are barely noticed.

You might feel that you are right by expressing the 'truth' about people's resentment towards settlers from 'outside', but if you extend your logic to Karachi, say, for example, then you would be speaking the language of the Urdu-speaking Mohajirs because they generally argue that the arrival of Pashtuns there has had a negative effect on that city. Of course, the irony is that Urdu-speakers in Karachi too are settlers and they have tried to change a city that historically had more in common with Bombay into a version of Dehli. Even you would know that the two are very different.

And as for what Torkham and Admin Khan have already said here - again - there are significant numbers of 'Pakistanis' living and working in Afghanistan. And like Afghan nationals, there are Pakistanis who will cross borders legally, or illegally in search of opportunity.

For convenience sake people may still need Pakistan identity documents, but in truth it is very tenuous and practically every educated Pashtun I know insists on shedding the 'Pakistan' label when they acquire a foreign citizenship. It's a pattern that I see over and over and especially amongst Pashtuns who feel very little cultural commonality with Lahore or Karachi. Do not be surprised if a generation of Pashtuns who originate from 'Pakistan' identify themselves as Afghan when overseas.

I've met many fellow students here in Canada who are Pashtun who have come from Pakistan, and they refer to themselves as Afghans. Here in Canada, Pashtuns from both sides of the border can easily assimilate into the Afghan community more easily than the Pakistani one.

[Michin Khel]

I've met many fellow students here in Canada who are Pashtun who have come from Pakistan, and they refer to themselves as Afghans. Here in Canada, Pashtuns from both sides of the border can easily assimilate into the Afghan community more easily than the Pakistani one.

I can give you examples of it from PF, one of our own admin, bls is from shangla , lives in canada and identifies himself as afghan.
There also might be pashtuns from KP who would be identifying themeselves as white aryan people. In white countries, who want to be identified as brown desis? when they are related to relatively fair skinned afghans. But the fact is all of them are having dual nationalities, they are not discarding paki ones.