Support shuttlecock burqa

[faye]

i haven't been able to find much information about afghanistan dress codes, pre islam. where did you find your information, roadrunner.
i did see a sketch of an afghan woman with a shawl and something coming down her forehead, to cover her nose, but don't know from what era.

[roadrunner]

uncle roadrunner, a society picks up on what it considers sophistication whenever it's introduced to a new means of it. in order for something to become a part of a culture, it does not have to be 100000 years old.
it doesn't matter how long the veil has been around for. muslims value the purpose that it serves to different degrees therefore they will define/put it to use as they please.

sophistication may induce a society to adopt a new cultural element. That is true DaZahrojaam.

However, may is the important word here. Society MAY also find itself changed by foreign forces attacking the country which MAY force society to adopt foreign elements to its culture that happen to be to its advantage.

This does not make these new traditions. They are foreign traditions. They should eventually be dispensed when society returns to its normal self.

PS. I'm not that old, I think.

[roadrunner]

i haven't been able to find much information about afghanistan dress codes, pre islam. where did you find your information, roadrunner.
i did see a sketch of an afghan woman with a shawl and something coming down her forehead, to cover her nose, but don't know from what era.

A lot is deliberately covered up and hushed away. But there's very solid references, not mere opinion. I gave one reference regarding the veil not being a Pashtun tradition before.

[IamDZJ]

sophistication may induce a society to adopt a new cultural element. That is true DaZahrojaam.

However, may is the important word here. Society MAY also find itself changed by foreign forces attacking the country which MAY force society to adopt foreign elements to its culture that happen to be to its advantage. well, it hasn't. so why should we ignore what it has done and talk about what it hasn't done??

This does not make these new traditions. they do They are foreign <---search the definition of that word for yourself traditions. They should eventually be dispensed when society returns to its normal self.there is no such thing as a normal society or a return to a form of one that has been previously...
PS. I'm not that old, I think.

[roadrunner]

sophistication may induce a society to adopt a new cultural element. That is true DaZahrojaam.

However, may is the important word here. Society MAY also find itself changed by foreign forces attacking the country which MAY force society to adopt foreign elements to its culture that happen to be to its advantage. well, it hasn't. so why should we ignore what it has done and talk about what it hasn't done??

You know the history of Afghanistan over the last 2 or 3 centuries? Warfare has been a constant part of it. Would you say this is a true statement?

If so, how is it normal? Is warfare normal?

This does not make these new traditions. they do They are foreign <---search the definition of that word for yourself traditions. They should eventually be dispensed when society returns to its normal self.there is no such thing as a normal society or a return to a form of one that has been previously...
PS. I'm not that old, I think.

It makes them foreign traditions I should have said. They are not indigenous traditions.

In the bigger scheme of pashtun history, which is many millenia old, the last 2 or 3 centuries are irrelevant and cannot constitute the norm of Pashtun society.

You cannot take new cultural elements that have come about through an ill and incorporate them into your culture/traditions. That would be like taking medicine when you have no flu.

[IamDZJ]

You know the history of Afghanistan over the last 2 or 3 centuries? Warfare has been a constant part of it. Would you say this is a true statement?

If so, how is it normal? Is warfare normal? what do you define normal as? war is a consequence of the shortcomings of a society. society is always either in a state of developing or declining. normal can't define something that is not predictable at the least.
It makes them foreign traditions I should have said. They are not indigenous traditions. ufff, do you not know what "adopt" means? 15 minutes ago you agreed with me that society adopts to new traditions.

In the bigger scheme of pashtun history, which is many millenia old, the last 2 or 3 centuries are irrelevant and cannot constitute the norm of Pashtun society. see now you going in to circles..

You cannot take new cultural elements that have come about through an ill and incorporate them into your culture/traditions. That would be like taking medicine when you have no flu.

[kakargirl]

Since you havn't provided no facts nothing your posts hold no ground, i'm going to just say one thing zoroastrian religion was strong in the region ,even pashtun word comes from persian language , so the veil was there due to the religion, theres loads of very old histroy books in afghanistan on zoroastrianism.

[roadrunner]

Since you havn't provided no facts nothing your posts hold no ground, i'm going to just say one thing zoroastrian religion was strong in the region ,even pashtun word comes from persian language , so the veil was there due to the religion, theres loads of very old histroy books in afghanistan on zoroastrianism.

I've provided sufficient evidence (though there's a lot lot more). See my reference before for example.

(Afghan women did not, however, veil their faces like the Chinese, nor the Arabs to the West - who wore veils for practical reasons and to fend off blistering desert sandstorms.)

Zoroastrianism wasn't hugely practised by Pashtuns. The Persians did take to it.

Arabic loan words are also used in the Pashto language. It doesn't mean anything.

Pashto and Persian are two seperate languages with a seperate history of evolution.

[roadrunner]

You know the history of Afghanistan over the last 2 or 3 centuries? Warfare has been a constant part of it. Would you say this is a true statement?

If so, how is it normal? Is warfare normal? what do you define normal as? war is a consequence of the shortcomings of a society. society is always either in a state of developing or declining. normal can't define something that is not predictable at the least.

Warfare can occur because society fails. But it can also occur because a foreign force just invades (which also causes society to fail). So it's not normal.

If a human is ill, is it normal, no? Normal is when the human is healthy, same for society.

It makes them foreign traditions I should have said. They are not indigenous traditions. ufff, do you not know what "adopt" means? 15 minutes ago you agreed with me that society adopts to new traditions.

Societies do adopt elements of other cultures when it can be seen as advantageous to their particular society at that time. This does not make them traditions. Traditions are long established. The veil is a transient cultural element that has been adopted until foreign forces decide to stop meddling in Pashtun lands.

In the bigger scheme of pashtun history, which is many millenia old, the last 2 or 3 centuries are irrelevant and cannot constitute the norm of Pashtun society. see now you going in to circles..

You cannot take new cultural elements that have come about through an ill and incorporate them into your culture/traditions. That would be like taking medicine when you have no flu.

What's wrong with such a description?

[IamDZJ]

Warfare can occur because society fails. But it can also occur because a foreign force just invades (which also causes society to fail). So it's not normal. i m going to say this for the last time. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A NORMAL SOCIETY.

If a human is ill, is it normal, no? Normal is when the human is healthy, same for society.
I WILL NOT REPEAT MYSELF AGAIN.


Societies do adopt elements of other cultures when it can be seen as advantageous to their particular society at that time. This does not make them traditions. Traditions are long established. The veil is a transient cultural element that has been adopted until foreign forces decide to stop meddling in Pashtun lands.
THE ENTIRE POINT OF ADOPTING TO SOMETHING IS MAKING IT BECOME A PART OF YOU. SO IF YOU ADOPT TO SOMETHING, IT'S NO LONGER FOREIGN.

What's wrong with such a description? YOU ARE MAKING ME DIZZY BY GOING IN TO CIRCLES.

I M GOING TO FIND ME A NICE LITTLE DEPRESSING MOVIE AND HAVE ME FUN WATCHING IT. GOOD NIGHT.

[kakargirl]

I've provided sufficient evidence (though there's a lot lot more). See my reference before for example.

(Afghan women did not, however, veil their faces like the Chinese, nor the Arabs to the West - who wore veils for practical reasons and to fend off blistering desert sandstorms.)

Zoroastrianism wasn't hugely practised by Pashtuns. The Persians did take to it.

Arabic loan words are also used in the Pashto language. It doesn't mean anything.

Pashto and Persian are two seperate languages with a seperate history of evolution.

no wonder you didnt answer my pm ,your a indian lol i think enough said none of your posts, hold no ground as one line is not enough that dosn't show nothing that just says they didnt wear the veil like the chinese or the arabs nothing else , theres no concrete proof whiles zoroastrian was a very big religion back then good night .

[roadrunner]

Warfare can occur because society fails. But it can also occur because a foreign force just invades (which also causes society to fail). So it's not normal. i m going to say this for the last time. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A NORMAL SOCIETY.

If a human is ill, is it normal, no? Normal is when the human is healthy, same for society.
I WILL NOT REPEAT MYSELF AGAIN.

I didn't understand what you said before. Surely warfare is not the sign of a healthy society?

If you would argue that Pashtun lands have always been in war, I'd say not. Only in recent history has there been a constant struggle for its resources and other things.

Societies do adopt elements of other cultures when it can be seen as advantageous to their particular society at that time. This does not make them traditions. Traditions are long established. The veil is a transient cultural element that has been adopted until foreign forces decide to stop meddling in Pashtun lands.
THE ENTIRE POINT OF ADOPTING TO SOMETHING IS MAKING IT BECOME A PART OF YOU. SO IF YOU ADOPT TO SOMETHING, IT'S NO LONGER FOREIGN.

Its origins would be foreign, and therefore not an indigenous tradition.

What's wrong with such a description? YOU ARE MAKING ME DIZZY BY GOING IN TO CIRCLES.

I M GOING TO FIND ME A NICE LITTLE DEPRESSING MOVIE AND HAVE ME FUN WATCHING IT. GOOD NIGHT.

[roadrunner]

no wonder you didnt answer my pm ,your a indian lol i think enough said none of your posts, hold no ground as one line is not enough that dosn't show nothing that just says they didnt wear the veil like the chinese or the arabs nothing else , theres no concrete proof whiles zoroastrian was a very big religion back then good night .

it's a reference. Why isn't it good enough? Did the author, Mrs Hse, make it up?

I'm pretty sure you have the incorrect end of the stick with this Indian thing. You wouldnt be the first. I've had quite a few other descriptions also.

[Catya Sher]

Good for kakargirl, I hope roadrunner runs right back to his home
in Chandigarh or somewhere.

[IamDZJ]

Good for kakargirl, I hope roadrunner runs right back to his home
in Chandigarh or somewhere.
aunty, there is nothing wrong with chandigrah.
roadrunner is only discussing something here with us.
just because he doesn't have amazing tales of how he personally interviewed so and so from the list of famous warlords in afghanistan doesn't mean he is not welcome here.