Aryan Culture and history - Ties with Today

[Tjanaparh]

Best Greetings to All members of the Pashtun Forums and best wishes of peace and health to all You and your families !
I would like to start a discussion on a little difficult theme .
I will try to start with some questions first.
Do You fel connected to Aryan culture ? Is this connection important nowadays ? Which elements and key moments of Pashtun culture would You connect to Aryan times ?
What generally do You understand under the word Aryan ?

Lets limit with this for the begining .

[amna.]

Yes well I feel like I do belong to Aryan culture ecuse according to many we Pashtuns are Aryan.

[شمله ور خراساني]

best greetings to you soo.

We are not Aryans. Aryans were a very old community that no longer exists. We are now thousands of years ahaed, we have a different language, culture and religion and we have intermixed with various other ethnicties over the course of history.

Aryans were very cruel and Barbaric people. They had no mercy to other human beings.

And the whole Aryan superiority theory is based on the work of German authors who promoted Nationalism in Germany. I have discussed the development and nature of Nationalism quite at lenght in Political Talk section of this forum.

We should not glorify our ancient past to which we have no connection what so ever.

We live in the 21 century and we should focus on understanding our current situation and try to develop ourselves and seek means to progress and prosperity.

There is absolutely no purpose in daydreaming of ancient glory of thousands of years ago. We should leave that to people who have nothing better to do.

[شمله ور خراساني]

who cares what germans did? Whats the purpose of this "brotherhood" with germans?

[ayub]

how disturbing some members here are desperate to find a link with Germans. Actually it's pretty shameful. Remember what they did to European Jews, who were much whiter than us.

Secondly lol @ the member with Alexander the gays - sig...do you realize when alex and his evil army came they raped and murdered the way here. Pls I don't need some babaric Alexander to say I'm beautiful or not.

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

@ayub, Yeah..... that's the person responsible for the forums that you're talking about. But he respects free speech and he doesn't believe in ridiculing others, perhaps you can learn from him.

Anyway, first things first. Pashtuns are not a race. For that matter, Germans aren't a race either. Here's the deal about the Aryan migration. A bunch of war-like tribes with iron weapons pushed their way inside India from northern Afghanistan in around 1500BC. Having stayed there for a bit, they moved West, going all the way from Asia Minor to northern Europe. During all those times, all the places they migrated to already had their local inhabitants. The Aryan tribes mixed in with them.

The evidence for this migration exists in our Indo-European languages (click Wiki).

Plaar
Pita
Padri
Father

Moor
Maa
Madar
Mother

Aas
Aasva
horse

Zwaan
Jawaan
Juvenile


Basically, when the British came to India and started studying the local languages, they were astonished to see common vocabulary. That's when serious work began regarding this migration theory business.

Now it must be understood that European languages have undergone many changes since the Aryan arrival - the Celts, the Romans and the influence of Latin, modern migrations (for example, the Saxons and then the Normans in Britain), etc. But still, the only reason for the existence of so many common words would have had to be the 'Aryan' migration. Genetics proves the case to a great extent.

There is also evidence in religion. For example, Odin (or Wotan) is the equivalent of Jupiter Capitalinus, who is the equivalent of Zeus, who is the equivalent of Brahma. This is an interesting page in this regard.

This is all controversial for two reasons. Firstly, Hitler and his lack of understanding of anything scientific (and military as well by the way) led him to believe that 'Aryans' were a master race. This was false. The Aryans are the same as everyone else. Secondly, the Aryans that migrated to India came to be worshiped as Gods and many say that the epic sagas of the Mahabharata and other tales of the Vedas are tales of different Aryan tribes fighting for supremacy. The Aryans were also responsible for creating the caste system. When they went further south of the Ganges, they didn't like the 'dark' people there. This is all a part of the past India doesn't want to confront.

In any case, my point was to illustrate that the Aryans are not a "pure race" of any kind. The migrations of the 'Aryan' tribes are of interest to historians and linguists but in no way or form are Pashtuns, Iranis, Germans, etc 'special' because of that. Now I myself have personal opinions about the behavior of different races or peoples but that's just some personal speculation which is not backed by any evidence. I don't have the right to call myself special based on my birth and neither does anyone else.

[ayub]

Lol@ timbaktu with his Aryan blood running through him. :D

Lol @ the suggestion of an Aryan unity/economic unity...with Kurds hating Persians, baloch hate Persians, Persians hate Afghans etc etc. :D

[Nick]

Dear Arevapasht amongst many responses I think Lavanaye Zalmaye has touched on history behind the fame of "Aryan theory". With All respect to other members,

a) There is no such thing as "Aryan Blood"
b) There is no such race as "pure Race"
c) There was no such nation as "aryan nation" or Nations, therefore people of Iran, Afghanistan, North west pakistan, Kurdistan and Turkistan (Tajikistan/Uzbekistan) have no such relationships. There are many sort of people with many tribes, cultures and languages as well as many ways of traditions.
d) The whole "Aryan Theory" has faded away, simply because the European created Theory has never been proven, even worse "Aryan" is just a simple word that identifies one as "noble" and that "Aryan" or the Cultural related people of "Aryans" were not invaders of India but rather were always in the borders of India, what's even more exciting for Afghans is that "Aryans" were mainly inside Hindukush, ie today's Afghanistan was where there cultural lived.

To Lavanaye Zalmaye:
Brother Aryans did not introduced "Caste System" but rather it was creation of Brahman tribes who ruled India since Mahabahratia's Era Lets say some 3000 or 2500 years ago this tribe taken full control of Northern India. In making sure the population remains under control they pushed for a Caste system which was to be fallowed until this day Indians are stuck with a narrow minded mentality of Brahmans. The Aryans which Reg Vedas talks of were tribal, not Caste.

Division of the Caste
India, a country with a lot of traditions, culture and beauty, has a unwanted, ugly and inhuman structure called ' CASTE SYSTEM .' One cannot but feel ashamed of the caste system in India. The caste system discriminates the human persons and stratifies them into different groups. According to Manu Dharma , the Hindu religious code of conduct, divides human persons into four Varnas (Varna means color, the Caste).

In Hindu society, caste is still the most powerful factor in determining a person's dignity. The caste system is the result of the Hindu belief in 'Reincarnation and Karma'. The four castes eventually developed into a social mosaic of 3000 sub-castes, with the Untouchables at the bottom of the list and actually outside the list. Such a rigid caste system is not found anywhere in the world outside India. A person is born into a caste. Once born in that caste, his status is predetermined and immutable. Birth decides one's status and this cannot be altered by any talent the person may develop or wealth the person may accumulate. Similarly, the caste in which a person is born predetermines what vocation the person will pursue. One has no choice. Birth decides the occupation of the person in question. Here are the four major castes:

1.BRAHMINS (priest class)
2.KSHATRIYAS (nobility, administrators, rulers, soldiers class)
3.VYSIAS (merchants, traders class)
4.SUDRAS (the Servants)


MYTH AND ORIGIN OF THE CASTE SYSTEM
1. The BRAHMINS, the priestly class came from the head of God. They are eligible for learning and teaching and perform sacrifices. The others cannot teach and perform sacrifice.
2. The KSHATRIAS, the warrior class came from the shoulder of God. They are eligible for learning. Their work is to protect the people by waging war against the enemies.
3. The VYSIAS, the trading class came from the thigh of God. Their work is to trade and feed the above two classes.
4. The SUDRAS, the servants came from the feet of God and their work is to do all menial works to the above three classes. They are not entitled to learn anything.
Other sub-castes are more than 3000 in number, with the "Untouchables" or "Dalits" at the bottom and outside. They are the slaves of the above groups and they are absolutely forbidden to learn and teach.

REALITY OF DALITS
The Dalits are deprived of: 1) Education 2) Right to possess assets 3) Right to posses' weapons to protect themselves. Therefore they are owned as the property of the caste people. The code of conduct that deprives them of these rights was written three thousand years back. One may wonder why this is still in practice. The tragedy is that although untouchablity was abolished by law 1950 in India, yet the dalits experience the agony of untouchability very deeply in all walks of life: Social, Economical and Political. One cannot understand the pain of being a dalit unless he experiences it.

DALITS, THE UNTOUCHABLES
There is also other category of people who don't come under any of these above caste groups, since they are not considered as human beings. They are called the "the Outcaste or the "Untouchables," or the Unseeables. There are hundreds of codes of conduct written for them. Now these people call themselves as ' DALITS.' The word ' Dalit' means 'broken, torn, scattered and crushed.' M.Gandhi called them as ' Harijans' which means God' s Children. But the word ' Harijans' does not describe their condition adequately. Therefore, the Outcaste preferred to call themselves as ' Dalits.' The word ' Dalit' is an expression of hope to recover their self-identity.

DALITS AS INDIGENOUS PEOPLE
As we have already seen, Dalit means 'broken, scattered and oppressed'. So the Dalits are the broken and scattered people, the oppressed masses. This implies that they were of one community before they were broken; they were together before they were scattered; they were free people before they were oppressed. It also implies that there must have been an agent and an instrument by whom and by which this free people were subjugated and oppressed. So the starting point of Dalit history is the moment when this 'breaking', 'scattering' and 'oppression' of the Dalits began, when exactly the Dalits began to be treated as degraded human beings and when exactly the Dalits lost their identity. To understand the Dalits as an indigenous people, we need to go to their historical roots.

Archaeological Evidence
Prehistoric India was inhabited first by the Negritos. The second group that migrated in was the Australoids. The Santals and Bhils belong to the Australoids. The third group that inhabited India was the Mongoloid family. In Sanskrit books, the Mongoloid are referred as the Kiratas. To the present time the Mongoloid have maintained their distinct cultural, racial and religious identities.
The fourth and largest group that inhabited ancient India was the Dravidian. Most scholars agree that the Dravidians came into India from the Eastern Mediterranean in the third millennium B.C. By 1400 B.C., the Dravidian civilization in India extended across the entire land.

Munshi says : "The Early Dravidians, who arrived in India prior to 2000 B.C., possessed a highly developed material culture as would appear from their early speech forms and the findings in Mohenjo-daro, Harappa and Lothal". Goetz speaks of the Indus Valley Civilization as ranging from Lothal to Mohenjo-daro and from 3000 to 1400 B.C., and having cultural connections with Sumer, the earliest known cradle of human civilization.

Destruction of Ancient India civilization & society begins
The Indo-Aryans in the 2nd millennium B.C. migrated from their homeland of Eranvej (the present Russian Turkestan) via Afghanistan into India. Thus the Aryans moved eastwards, fighting the indigenous Dravidians whom they exterminated or enslaved. They overran the open country, stormed the fortified towns (pur) of the Indus Valley and slowly migrated eastwards fighting the Kiratas conquering the whole of Northern India around 1400-1000 B.C.

The Battle of the Ten Kings (dasarajna) for territory and ideology took place. It is mentioned in the Rigveda. The 7th Mandala of the Rigveda contains references to the Battle of the Ten Kings (notably hymns 18 and 83), where Aryan king Suda defeated a confederation of hostile Dasyu tribes.

Shiva Raj Shrestha wrote, "the famous war between Kirat emperor Sambara and king Divo-das of Sindhu-Saraswoti Region is described even in Rigveda. Lord Indra is highly praised in the Rig-Veda for helping King Divo-dasa in this famous war. Sage Bharadwaja was Divo-dasa's royal priest. He had ordered the King, to eliminate Kiratas and keep fighting till the time not a single Kirata is in existence in the northern frontier of Sapta Sindhu" (Jammu Kashmir and Himanchal of present day). This is how the Aryans of Early Rig-Vedic times kept on moving towards the east,fighting both with Kiratas as well as Nishadhas(Indo-austroloids).

Mishra, the archaeologist endorses this view. This coincides with the records of Wheeler, the original authority on the Indus Valley civilization. These conquests are described in numerous verses of the Rig Veda.
In the Rig Veda, the natives are described as dark-skinned, snub-nosed enemies of alien language and religion. Marshall and Cunningham who did the original archaeological excavation on Indus civilization, Yuria Knorozov who did the deciphering of the Indus pictographic writings and authorities such as Madho Sarup Vats, Dik****, N.C. Majumdar, Rapson, Wheeler, R.D. Banerjee, B.B. Lal point to the fact that the native black Dravidians were largely exterminated by the light-coloured Aryan invaders, their 'Puram' (meaning fort or town) civilization was destroyed and those who were not killed were made slaves.

When the Aryans began to spread eastward and southward from Punjab, they spread too thin. Therefore the policy of total annihilation of the Dasyus was found unnecessary as well as impossible. Instead the Dravidians were made domestic and village slaves. In earlier civilizations, slavery or extermination were the only two methods used by most of the conquering races.
Therefore the Dasyus (slaves, now known to us as the Scheduled caste) of the Rig Veda were the Dravidians living north of the Vindhya Satpura range and now enslaved by the invading Aryans. The distinguished indologist Basham says: "In the reduction to bondage of the many dasas captured in the battle, we find the origin of Indian slavery."

Literary Evidence
Here are a few of the earliest literary sources available to us. In all these sources, we find the Dalits, Das, Chandala, Avarna, Panchama were reduced by their oppressors to a non-human level, with no identity or dignity.
(a) Rigvedas : (1500-1000 B.C. ) The earliest available literary source is the Rigveda. Its Purusa sukta hymn talks about the origin of the four Varnas, Brahmanas, Kashartries, Vaisias and Sutras. The Dalits find no place in it under this name: they are referred as Avarna, Dasa and Dasyus. (6th and 10th Mandala)

(b) Upanishads : (800-600 B.C) By the time the Upanishad texts came into existence, the problem of the Dalits was becoming deeper and clearer. For example, the famous Chandogys Upanishad not only refers to the first three upper castes, but also compares Chandala (Outcaste) with a dog and a swine. (ref. Chandogya Upanisad. Khanda 10, verse 7)

(c) Ramayana : In the time of Lord Rama's rule, only the upper three castes were allowed to do 'tapasya' (penance and meditation). Now it so happened that one of low caste, a Sudhra, undertook penance in order to attain divinity (dignity). As soon as Lord Rama heard this, he killed the Sudhra for such presumption. If this happened to a Sudhra, we can imagine what would have happend to a Dalit , so much lower in status.

(d) Mahabharata : It describes the degraded state of the Dalits. It is the story of Ekalabya, an indigenous boy, who has to lose the thumb of his right hand because he has learnt archery and has come to be no less skilled than Arjuna in this art.

Survival of the Caste System
The caste system survived for centuries because the religious leaders transmitted the Hindu Scriptures to the common people and attributed the caste system to divine ordinance. Any breaking of this system, individually or collectively, was tantamount to breaking the divine law. Painstakingly, every dimension of the divine ordinance of caste was included in the Scriptures. We see this, for example, in the Bhagavad Gita, which is regarded as the noblest of all the Scriptures. The caste system having thus become sanctioned by Scripture, it came to be accepted even by the outcastes themselves.

In the words of Dr. Ambedkar, another ploy to make caste acceptable to all was the strategy of introducing an extensive system of 'graded inferiority', providing everyone with an inferior grade immediately beneath him. Thus, so long as the Brahmin was at the top, with no other caste above him, his superiority over all was secured. Below him the Brahmin had the Kshathriya - and below him was the Vaisya and below him the Sudra - and the Sudras had the untouchables beneath them. Thus each caste had at least one group beneath them. This compensated for the humiliation of having someone above them. This 'graded inferiority' made the entire system tolerable.

India's caste system is perhaps the world's longest surviving social hierarchy. A defining feature of Hinduism, caste encompasses a complex ordering of social groups on the basis of ritual purity. A person is considered a member of the caste into which he or she is born and remains within that caste until death, although the particular ranking of that caste may vary among regions and over time. Differences in status are traditionally justified by the religious doctrine of karma, a belief that one's place in life is determined by one's deeds in previous lifetimes. Traditional scholarship has described this more than 2,000-year-old system within the context of the four principal varnas, or large caste categories.

In order of precedence these are the Brahmins (priests and teachers), the Ksyatriyas (rulers and soldiers), the Vaisyas (merchants and traders), and the Shudras (laborers and artisans). A fifth category falls outside the varna system and consists of those known as "untouchables" or Dalits; they are often assigned tasks too ritually polluting to merit inclusion within the traditional varna system. Within the four principal castes, there are thousands of sub-castes, also called jatis, endogamous groups that are further divided along occupational, sectarian, regional and linguistic lines. Collectively all of these are sometimes referred to as "caste Hindus" or those falling within the caste system.

The Dalits are described as varna-sankara: they are "outside the system"—so inferior to other castes that they are deemed polluting and therefore "untouchable." Even as outcasts, they themselves are divided into further sub-castes. Although "untouchability" was abolished under Article 17 of the Indian constitution, the practice continues to determine the socio-economic and religious standing of those at the bottom of the caste hierarchy. Whereas the first four varnas are free to choose and change their occupation, Dalits have generally been confined to the occupational structures into which they are born.

When did the caste system arrive in Nepal?
Now in the [The Vishnu Purana, 2.37], it is mentioned that the chatur-varna or four class social system was absent among the Kiratas in Kiratdesa in the east and the Yavanas and Kambojas, etc. in the pashchima or west.
The Kiratdesa has been identified to be Nepal and the surrounding Himalayas region. Yavanas are associated with Greeks and Kambojas are Afghans, both whom are situated in paschima or west of India.
This clearly shows that Kiratdesa(Nepal) did not have any vedic culture up to this point. The chatur-varna that ultimately resulted in caste discrimination entered Nepal after the arrival of Vedic Aryan (Lichchhavi) from northern India in around 300 AD.

[KhalsaWarrior]

Historically, its never been proven who the Aryans were, where they came from (apart from approximations) and (this is important) how they looked. Somebody quoted the Aryan invasion theory. Well AIT is still unproven. Many later historians refer to the Aryan entry into the Indian subcontinent as a mixing or assimilation of two cultures - Harrappan and Aryan rather than an invasion. Currently there are two schools of thought amongst historians in India, both subscribing to either of the above scenarios.

I was fortunate to be acquainted with Ms. Romila Thapar, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romila_Thapar the eminent Indian historian. Her books on Ancient India are a prerequisite to understanding India and its connection to the Aryans. She mentions that the Vedas, Upanishads and the Puranas, supposedly the earliest written records of the Aryans offer no insight into their physical appearances. They dont mention whether they were tall, blue eyed or fair. All they talk about is their rituals, daily happenings, poems and hymns. So the German or North European characteristic as the defining Aryan appearance is highly misleading. We have no way of determining if the current appearance of the Germans is due to the original Aryan appearance or due to the mixing with later tribes/ethnicities.

[KhalsaWarrior]

Hey I thought my post would be controversial! So nobody disagrees with me?

[KhalsaWarrior]

Didn't the Aryan civilization take place in Central Asia?

Yes and no. If you mean their origin, then very probable. Many sources claim the river Oxus (the Amu Darya in modern day Iran, I believe) to be the origin of the Aryans. But the problem is that names of rivers and mountains keep changing with time, so its very difficult to prescribe a definite geography.

I said no because, even though the Aryans might have originated in Central Asia, we cant call it a civilization untill they settled down in the sub-continent. Before that they were hunter-gatherer tribes/hordes. Their settling down into agriculture along river banks gave them the economic and political stability to develop a civilization.

[KhalsaWarrior]

Dear Arevapasht amongst many responses I think Lavanaye Zalmaye has touched on history behind the fame of "Aryan theory". With All respect to other members,

a) There is no such thing as "Aryan Blood"
b) There is no such race as "pure Race"
c) There was no such nation as "aryan nation" or Nations, therefore people of Iran, Afghanistan, North west pakistan, Kurdistan and Turkistan (Tajikistan/Uzbekistan) have no such relationships. There are many sort of people with many tribes, cultures and languages as well as many ways of traditions.
d) The whole "Aryan Theory" has faded away, simply because the European created Theory has never been proven, even worse "Aryan" is just a simple word that identifies one as "noble" and that "Aryan" or the Cultural related people of "Aryans" were not invaders of India but rather were always in the borders of India, what's even more exciting for Afghans is that "Aryans" were mainly inside Hindukush, ie today's Afghanistan was where there cultural lived.

To Lavanaye Zalmaye:
Brother Aryans did not introduced "Caste System" but rather it was creation of Brahman tribes who ruled India since Mahabahratia's Era Lets say some 3000 or 2500 years ago this tribe taken full control of Northern India. In making sure the population remains under control they pushed for a Caste system which was to be fallowed until this day Indians are stuck with a narrow minded mentality of Brahmans. The Aryans which Reg Vedas talks of were tribal, not Caste.

Agree with the rest of your post but not the bolded part -

Brahman wasnt a tribe. Its a caste. And the rulers/warriors during Mahabharata werent Brahmans but Kshatriyas. SO how did Kshatriyas end up setting up a system led by Brahmans?

The truth is that the caste system was already in place when the Mahabharata epic or the original Battle of the 10 Kings (on which the epic is based, albeit a bit dramatized)was fought. That is why you only find the Kshatriyas, the designated warrior caste fighting the battles and not any other caste.

And you are right about the fact that Brahmans had a major role in setting up the caste system. Since they were the priestly caste they wanted to keep their control and hence placed themselves and the Kshatriyas at the top.

Btw, your argument about current Indian narrow Brahman mentality seems right out of a Pakistani textbook.

[Nick]

Agree with the rest of your post but not the bolded part -

Brahman wasnt a tribe. Its a caste. And the rulers/warriors during Mahabharata werent Brahmans but Kshatriyas. SO how did Kshatriyas end up setting up a system led by Brahmans?

The truth is that the caste system was already in place when the Mahabharata epic or the original Battle of the 10 Kings (on which the epic is based, albeit a bit dramatized)was fought. That is why you only find the Kshatriyas, the designated warrior caste fighting the battles and not any other caste.

And you are right about the fact that Brahmans had a major role in setting up the caste system. Since they were the priestly caste they wanted to keep their control and hence placed themselves and the Kshatriyas at the top.

Btw, your argument about current Indian narrow Brahman mentality seems right out of a Pakistani textbook.

Thanks for the responds, you made a good point yes prove of previous "Caste system" has been found in India as well as in Western Iran (ie Elamid civilization 3000 BCE-900 BCE)) which until Medes ere Iranians were all Caste and upon their invasion Caste system was somewhat destroyed but many believes Sussianians brought it back. Anyways a Different subject regarding Iran we will come to that.

However we may have different believes we may have atleast or you at atl last agreed that Brahmans did play a role in making sure the Caste System still lives.

[KhalsaWarrior]

Thanks for the responds, you made a good point yes prove of previous "Caste system" has been found in India as well as in Western Iran (ie Elamid civilization 3000 BCE-900 BCE)) which until Medes ere Iranians were all Caste and upon their invasion Caste system was somewhat destroyed but many believes Sussianians brought it back. Anyways a Different subject regarding Iran we will come to that.

However we may have different believes we may have atleast or you at atl last agreed that Brahmans did play a role in making sure the Caste System still lives.

It would be interesting to know about caste system in Iran. From what I had read, Indian sub-continent was the only place where the Aryans practiced the caste system. And a group of scholars even use this 'fact' to argue that the the Caste System was already prevalent in India, in the Harappan culture that is before the Aryans arrived. Otherwise how is it that the Aryans only practiced it in India although their offshoots spread far and wide? But then again, I could be wrong. So please open a thread if you can and post links as well. Look forward to it.

A discussion on the proclaimed (mostly Pakistani) Brahman mentality of India is fit for another thread! If we start on it, we would go on in a different direction. And funnily enough, Pakistanis cant decide whether its India's Brahman or the Baniya mentality that they despise. I have heard both the names.

[Nick]

Yes and no. If you mean their origin, then very probable. Many sources claim the river Oxus (the Amu Darya in modern day Iran, I believe) to be the origin of the Aryans. But the problem is that names of rivers and mountains keep changing with time, so its very difficult to prescribe a definite geography.

I said no because, even though the Aryans might have originated in Central Asia, we cant call it a civilization untill they settled down in the sub-continent. Before that they were hunter-gatherer tribes/hordes. Their settling down into agriculture along river banks gave them the economic and political stability to develop a civilization.

If you mean their origin, then very probable. Many sources claim the river Oxus (the Amu Darya in modern day Iran, I believe) to be the origin of the Aryans. But the problem is that names of rivers and mountains keep changing with time, so its very difficult to prescribe a definite geography.

Are you serious? Amo Darya? its water is collected mainly from Hindukush mountains 90% from inside Afghanistan, and it goes north making a border between Uzbekistan and Turkmanistan falls right into Aral Sea. So How is Amu Darya in modern day Iran?
My Dear its not even close to Modern Day Iran. After Islamic period it was sometimes during shia kingdoms of Khawarizm and Safivads, Buywads, Al Khanates and Qajar. During sunni Era it was only during Nader Shah's time. Therefore I don't know of any recent account of Persian invasion, so how is it in modern day Iran?

I said no because, even though the Aryans might have originated in Central Asia, we cant call it a civilization untill they settled down in the sub-continent

Afghanistan had many Civilizations and it does not mean they were Aryan or non-Aryan. The Fact that before 2002 a theory was developed and ended with the word "Complex" yes I am talking of BMAC. That included much of Afghanistan as far as Turkmenistan ie Arial Sea but aside from afghan border regions and city of Merv no prove was found outside Afghanistan, or outside boundaries of ancient Merv. Aside from BMAC we knew of no-civilization, but since then they found 3 civilizations and as many as 12,000 archealogical sites that dates back as far as from 2000 BCE-3500 BCE Let me know if you want details.

Before that they were hunter-gatherer tribes/hordes. Their settling down into agriculture along river banks gave them the economic and political stability to develop a civilization.

Which "River Banks" are you talking about? Sub-continent?