Pashtun DNA is closest in similarity to Ashkenazi Jews ?

[retro]

This is from Wiki and contains contradictory material. The Y DNA study that is cited there reported that 6.3% of the sample had the J haplogroup (Semitic marker) which contradicts the theory and some other material posted there, in fact that study shows the most common haplogroup in the Pashtun sample was r1a1 which affirms the Scythian connection that this article repudiates, also Mitochondrial DNA is DNA passed on solely from the mother and would be irrelevant to patriarchal people like Pashtuns. I cannot check the sources on the diseases but it looks suspicious to me. And Ashkenazi Jews themselves are likely a mix of Turks, Jews and European peoples so this seems odd to me.

It may be possible, and is actually even likely since there is some scanty evidence for it, that the lost tribes migrated to Pashtun lands and became assimilated by Pashtuns; Pashtuns like other peoples in the region are largely mixed but to claim that Pashtuns as a people are literally the lost tribe is nonsense. For one Pashto as a language has little to no Semitic features, surely if Pashtuns as a whole were once a Semitic speaking people they would have preserved some features of something resembling Hebrew or Semitic languages in general but that isnt the case.

Who knows maybe some of the Pashtuns ancestors were Jewish silk road traders. However it's a bit of a stretch to start inferring, that Pashtuns are descended from some mythical lost Jewish tribe.

Even if once upon a time the Pashtuns ancestors where either Jews or somehow related to some of the Jews ancestors. You certainly aren't Jews now and frankly the Jews kooky myths are not only ridiculous. But more than a little bit conveniently, tailored to plant the seeds of doubt in other peoples minds.

The Jews at best are really only a ethnoreligious group at this point. Since nearly half of the Jews ancestry is Southern European (Hellenic) and Jewish admixture rates in America are around 50%.

Now merely because Pashtuns speak a Indo-Iranic language, does not necessarily that they are of Indo-Iranic origins. However it's my understanding that Pashtuns mostly have R1a1 and J2. Which does tend to support the idea of some form of Western Eurasian, silk road migration, prior to Persian and Greek rule.

The Indo-European languages are around 8,500 years old and are believed to first emerged in Black Sea region of Anatolia or somewhere in Western Asia. Much the same is true of Semitic as whilst Semitic has Afroasiatic origins. Semitic people are Western Eursians and they have Western or South Western Asian origins.

The people of the Sintashta culture are thought to have spoken Proto-Indo-Iranian and Finno-ugric languages, such as Finnish have very early Indo-Iranian loanwords. As at sometime the two spheres overlapped in the Northern Urals.

Whilst the Scythian warred with the eastern Celts and Thracians in the west. They had very similar cultural aspects and I'd say that they infuenced one other. The Alans were a Sarmatian tribe and where closely related to the Scythians.

Alani, also called Alans, an ancient nomadic pastoral people that occupied the steppe region northeast of the Black Sea. The Alani were first mentioned in Roman literature in the 1st century ad and were described later as a warlike people that specialized in horse breeding. They frequently raided the Parthian empire and the Caucasian provinces of the Roman Empire. About ad 370, however, they were overwhelmed by the Huns, and many fled westward, crossing into Gaul with the Vandals and Suebi (406).

The Scythians/Sarmatian where seemingly fairly homogeneous and although they where a Indo-Europeans steppepeoples. They where more of a Hunnic, Euroasiatic type, confederation (with the empathises on Euro) and ethncally they where not unlike the Chuvash (Bulgars) in Russia or more Asiatic eastern Slavic types.

Chuvash



Now the good thing about the Indo-Scythians is that where certainly in the right place.


Indo-Scythians

[qunduz92]

Nick, what do you mean as well as by Mullah Umar? I don't get it.

[Manzareh]

there are many muslims have jews origin.there is nothing wrong with that.
you need to know the jews and isrealistics origin.

doesnt matter if they have Jewish origin, because now they are not Jewish so the origin doesnt make a difference.

[Israelite]

Ashkenazi Jews are obviously NOT of central Asian origin.

Askenazim are not of central Asian orign, quite obviously shown by the tests. The fact that non-Ashkenazi Jews who've been largely separated from Ashkenazim, well before the Khazar situation, match Ashkenazi Jews more than anyone else, as well as Samaritans, shows that Ashkenazi Jews are of Israelite origin and so too are Pashtuns/Pathans.

[retro]

Askenazim are not of central Asian orign, quite obviously shown by the tests. The fact that non-Ashkenazi Jews who've been largely separated from Ashkenazim, well before the Khazar situation, match Ashkenazi Jews more than anyone else, as well as Samaritans, shows that Ashkenazi Jews are of Israelite origin and so too are Pashtuns/Pathans.

Pashtuns are Eurasiatic, Central Asians and the haplogroup J2 Pashtuns are most likely Persians. The Israelites are mythical people and Ashkenazi/Sephardic Jews are hardly Canaanites. Jews are merely Hellenised Kurds and 40% of the Jews ancestry is Greek. What is more in the US Jewish admixture rates are running at 75%. Hence the Jews are being Europeanized.

[Toramana]

Pashtuns are Eurasiatic, Central Asians and the haplogroup J2 Pashtuns are most likely Persians. The Israelites are mythical people and Ashkenazi/Sephardic Jews are hardly Canaanites. Jews are merely Hellenised Kurds and 40% of the Jews ancestry is Greek. What is more in the US Jewish admixture rates are running at 75%. Hence the Jews are being Europeanized.

Hi retro, welcome...What is your take on the new South Korean study on Pashtun DNA I posted into another thread in the same forum yesterday? What do you deduce from it?

I have myself tested the most common haplotypes of five Pashtun populations through three haplogroup predictors; the result is almost similar. The representative Pashtun haplogroups in my opinion are R1a1a, G2c/c*, J, and L1c (or L3) in that order.

The highest frequencies of G2c/c* occur in Afridis interestingly. I find this curious. Amongst the Afridis, you also find the R1a1a-Viking although with low probability.

Please, give your expert opinion.

In the latest South Korean study, R2a has also been reported but I would attribute that to the sampling biase relying more on samples from Peshwar valley which has become heavily mixed over the centuries with many non-Pashtuns also speaking Pashto for samples collectors to discern as not original Pashtuns.

[unknownprince]

Pashtuns are from the tribes of Israel. They converted to Islam overnight after receiving the message.

Pashtuns have similar traditions and such. Lots of study has indicated this.

Todays Jews in Europe and America were never Jews to begin with. They are mixed up with Khazar Turks and Western Europeans. Majority of them have no link to the Israelite tribes at all.

Hence, once there is a strong independent Afghanistan, then Afghans must take back their land in Palestine. This land can then be given to the Palestinians.

[Toramana]

Pashtuns are from the tribes of Israel. They converted to Islam overnight after receiving the message.

Pashtuns have similar traditions and such. Lots of study has indicated this.

Todays Jews in Europe and America were never Jews to begin with. They are mixed up with Khazar Turks and Western Europeans. Majority of them have no link to the Israelite tribes at all.

Hence, once there is a strong independent Afghanistan, then Afghans must take back their land in Palestine. This land can then be given to the Palestinians.

What you've to do with these matters of knowledge...Go away...and do something about your bigotic terrorist tendencies.

[Toramana]

So guys, that is what the DNA studies show so far...By the way, R1a1a is found in high frequency in populations from Eastern Europe to South Asia. It is a kind of Indo-European marker. G2c/c* is commonly found in Ashkenazi Jews who originated from the area near the Black see. Its other variant G2a is found in very high frequency in Caucauses e.g. in Georgians, Ossetians, etc. J is a haplogroup that is found in Southwest Asia in the populations around Miditaranian (sorry for spelling). L1c (formerly called L3) is found in high frequency in Burusho, Pashtuns, Chechens, and Kalashas. R2a is found in Pashtuns in the same frequency as in Tajaks, for example.

When this result is combined with the result from mtDNA (62% west Euroasians, 38% South Asians), the picture that emerges is, Pashtuns are more west Asians than South Asians.

[retro]

Hi retro, welcome...What is your take on the new South Korean study on Pashtun DNA I posted into another thread in the same forum yesterday? What do you deduce from it?

I have myself tested the most common haplotypes of five Pashtun populations through three haplogroup predictors; the result is almost similar. The representative Pashtun haplogroups in my opinion are R1a1a, G2c/c*, J, and L1c (or L3) in that order.

The highest frequencies of G2c/c* occur in Afridis interestingly. I find this curious. Amongst the Afridis, you also find the R1a1a-Viking although with low probability.

Please, give your expert opinion.

In the latest South Korean study, R2a has also been reported but I would attribute that to the sampling biase relying more on samples from Peshwar valley which has become heavily mixed over the centuries with many non-Pashtuns also speaking Pashto for samples collectors to discern as not original Pashtuns.

Haplogroup R1* and R2* likely originated somewhere in southern Central Asia between the Caspian and the Hindu Kush.

Whilst it's hard to draw conclusions about the Western Eurasian mtDNA in the region. Since the region has long been a crossroads. Which is why Andronovo culture and later cultures, such the Kushans had both Indo-Aryan and Hunnic aspects. I'd say that Pashtuns and Tajikis for the most part they are descended from Eurasiatic Indo-European peoples. Who have admixed to some extent with Indic, Near Eastern and Turkic peoples.

It's also worth noting that the Turks in the region i.e. the Hazara, Turkmen, Uzbeks and Uyghurs are on the whole mixed, 'Turko-Persian' peoples. Rather than outright Asiatic Siberian/Uralic/Mongol northern Eurasian types.

[Karachi]

So guys, that is what the DNA studies show so far...By the way, R1a1a is found in high frequency in populations from Eastern Europe to South Asia. It is a kind of Indo-European marker. G2c/c* is commonly found in Ashkenazi Jews who originated from the area near the Black see. Its other variant G2a is found in very high frequency in Caucauses e.g. in Georgians, Ossetians, etc. J is a haplogroup that is found in Southwest Asia in the populations around Miditaranian (sorry for spelling). L1c (formerly called L3) is found in high frequency in Burusho, Pashtuns, Chechens, and Kalashas. R2a is found in Pashtuns in the same frequency as in Tajaks, for example.

When this result is combined with the result from mtDNA (62% west Euroasians, 38% South Asians), the picture that emerges is, Pashtuns are more west Asians than South Asians.

this is true, but one thing about the south asian (dna) that the studies are based upon is ancestral south asian dna, Overall the northwest part of south asia is hybrid between west eurasian and ancestoral south asian dna, while pashtuns ofcourse will have much more greater amounts of west eurasian dna and much less ancestral south asian dna. if you look at places like south india(Tamil nade, kerala) their Dna is almost completly south asian, with very little components of west eurasian in them.

[Manzareh]

I dunno about you but no ancestor ov mine was a Jew.

[Toramana]

Here we go. I wrote to one of the researchers who recently recently published his paper about Y-DNA profile of Pashtuns and he gave me the following reply (in quotes). The reply clearly indicates that of 36 Pashtuns tested, 4 had the following haplotype suggesting this may be one of the most prevalent haplotypes in FATA Pashtuns.

The haplotype belongs to haplogroup G2c/c*, the same haplogroup found at higher frequencies in Ashkenazis jews. It is highly likely that these samples were taken from Afridis.

"The most common Y-STR haplotype among 36 FATA Pathans was indicated as below:

DYS19 389I 389II 390 391 392 393 385 437 438 439 448 456 458 635 H4.1 388 446 447 449 464
16 13 30 23 11 11 13 13,16 16 10 11 21 16 20 24 21 12 17 24 28 13,15

It was observed four times among 36 FATA Pathans."

The alliele value at (285a,285b)=(13,16) is typical G2c/c* marker.


Comment?

[pashtunprincess]

We pashtun are lost tribe of israel its true and im proud of it all prophets came from bani israel we are not related 2 persains or any others we are ancient israelis

[pashtunprincess]

Askenazim are not of central Asian orign, quite obviously shown by the tests. The fact that non-Ashkenazi Jews who've been largely separated from Ashkenazim, well before the Khazar situation, match Ashkenazi Jews more than anyone else, as well as Samaritans, shows that Ashkenazi Jews are of Israelite origin and so too are Pashtuns/Pathans.

I agree with ya i believe we pashtuns are israelities we have smilar names and customs and tribes 4 example shinwari = shimon lewan = levi yusef zai = children of joseph daftali=eftali afridi=ephraim khattak= manaseh or manish somethin like that and there is many more i dont remember all of it