Women Rights in Pashtunwali

[unknownprince]

I hope you ladies do not turn out like those Arab Women waving their children in the air with their bodies attached to plastic immitation explosives.

MI6, you are the exact same person.

[Shehbaz Khan]

If we can please get back to the topic

[roadrunner]

Prosperity has nothing to do with women's rights. The Khasis, Nairs, and Bunt of India are matriarchal castes but are dirt poor. Saudis are filthy rich, but every one knows what kind of rights their women have.

What a stupid thing to say. The Khasis might be matriarchial but they are an estranged small segment of Indian society. Indian society is very patriarchial, more so than any other society in the world.

[roadrunner]

[/B]
Really? How do you determine HOW patriarchal a society is relative to other societies?

And the fact that India HAS a matriarchal society in it is enough to make one think. I think India is no less or more patriarchal than any other society in the world.

Various factors. One would be polygamy.

[Manzareh]

No Pashtun practices Pashtunwali, if they did they wouldnt tolarate the evil Pakistani Army and the Tajik Mercenaries who have killed innocent Pashtuns. No Pashtun practices Pashtunwali, if they did they would have taught Taliban a big lesson and stop the influx of Punjabi Jihadis into the region in the name of Islam.

M16, Your officially the most ridiculous, idiotic, stupid simpleton that i have ever come accross. what an obsurd statement. some advise for the future, try to control your emotions and hate as your posts are riddled with ignorance and this only means that NOBODY WILL TAKE YOU SERIOUS..specially here.

[roadrunner]

Really? How do you determine HOW patriarchal a society is relative to other societies?

And the fact that India HAS a matriarchal society in it is enough to make one think. I think India is no less or more patriarchal than any other society in the world because some practices that may be prevalent in the Indian society may NOT be prevalent in most others, but what's prevalent in other societies may be news to India. Female circumcision, for example. Does it occur in India? What about footbinding? These are blatant signs of extreme patriarchy. And to what extent? What about in other societies? There are million ways to tell whether a society is patriarchal or matriarchal, and we shouldn't assume that Practice X is more common in one part of the world and therefore that part of the worst is MORE patriarchal than any other.

you added a bit. Well circumcision isn't only for females, is it? We could argue Islam is a matriarchial religion because only men tend to be circumcized. I'll need to look up footbinding.

[roadrunner]

Are you doing good, Qruttugai?

[roadrunner]

I'm doing very well, Roadrunner! Manana for asking. Akhtar mo umbarak shai!



Circumcision is for males and females, correct. But is it performed for the same reason for both genders? No. The reason it's done for females is to ensure that she remains chaste until marriage (becuase to be physically involved in someone is too excruciating then); the reason it's done for men is because 1) religion commands it, and 2) it's argued to contribute to male hygiene and prevention from certain diseases.

So both genders sacrifice something if these are the reasons. The woman's chastity is maintained, the man is ensured to be hygienic and disease free. This sounds fair. Usually women aren't required to do it. I do believe there's a connection between socio-economic status and patriarchy. The better off a society is the less patriarchial and the more rights women have. You can find exceptions to this though.

[Manzareh]

Excuse me but i call "Pashtunwali doesnt exist" extremly naive. actually i found the whole post to be stupid, its my opinion, to you it might have been otherwise. I wasnt arguing i was expressing my view. Personally i didnt give any support to my opinion as i didnt want to waste my time iv always been taught never to argue with the ignorant.

and i dont have ANY respect for anybody thats speaks in the manner of "I hope you ladies do not turn out like those Arab Women waving their children in the air with their bodies attached to plastic immitation explosives"

He doesnt deserve a documented reply from me or anyone. you give what you get

[roadrunner]

Yay! Now we're on the right track... though remember that polygamy CAN be good for women IF its only purpose is to serve orphans and widows and divorced women who are shunned by society. Otherwise, it creates more harm than good for the society as one unit.

What do you think are other elements of a patriarchal system?

hmm. Will need to think more about this one. Off the top of my head I would say things that give men more independence than women. Which could be a lot of things from money to religion. But in unsafe places you will find patriarchy rules. This is a basic rule of nature and is a product of the environment.

[drona]

What a stupid thing to say. The Khasis might be matriarchial but they are an estranged small segment of Indian society. Indian society is very patriarchial, more so than any other society in the world.

Troll Runner,

Though your ignorance about India is laughable, I don't want to dwell on it as it is not the topic of discussion here.

So you were telling us how prosperity and women's rights are directly related. Saudis are wealthy , are their women liberated ?

[Wrayun]

Drona, Saudi women enjoy more freedom, power and rights compared to Muslim women of poorer nations and in status. For example, Yemeni or Afghan women. The condition of Saudi women is much better than that of Yemeni or Afghan women when it comes to access to education and facilities. Saudi is unique, it's a close knit community, and the laws are there to protect the honor of the few (royals), unfortunately the rest of the masses can't escape them. Non-Saudi women enjoy more freedom and rights compared to Saudi in Saudi Arabia, because Saudi are not bothered with their "honor", only Saudi women, particularly the royalty.

Women freedom/rights have everything to do with prosperity, but also how that prosperity comes about. The prosperity in Saudi Arabia is not due to natural economic evolution, rather a family that won a jackpot, that never had to work for the wealth they have acquired, and so things remained as they were. As I stated, once the oil runs out, much of these laws that this royal family have, will be abolished to sustain the state due to which women "rights" will naturally come about.

This is the same in every country, even in India, where the lower castes and women are now given more rights today, compared to past, only because they now play a greater economical role.

Economics = Dependence = Rights!

[afridi_iphone]

Respect, ezzat, support her because she will be looking for only one guy (her husband) help her in house work. Its undebatable to talk about this topic because everyone is born differently but the most important task is give her respect and ezzat have a positive feelings for her.

[Wrayun]

MI6,

1) Saudi Women Cant drive a car, if so they would be punished by the law.

They are fined. Most Saudis are rich enough to have drivers. The whole driving thing has to do with protecting their twisted concept of "honor". It's not based on discrimination against the female gender. You know, women are stupid, can't drive, shouldn't be. That sort of stuff. For example we don't allow our women in our Hujras, because of honor/pardah. That doesn't mean we discriminate against our women.

2) Saudi Women cant marry non Saudi Arabs.

It's a patriarchal society. They don't want to share royalties. Make senses.

3) Saudi Women are punished if they are found by a unrelated male by lashing or death.

You mean if they are found with an unrelated male, not found by unrelated male...right?
That depends on the situation i.e. what they were doing. In that case both male and female are punished.

4) Saudi Women if raped and do not produce a three male witnesses would be lashed 300 times.

^lul what?

5) A women cant vote or participate in the running of the country.

It's an effing MONARCHY DUDE!

6)treated as third class citizens with their usual bedion Arab mentality.
Saudi Women and freedom is a absolutely a oxy moron.

Saudi women are treated much better than non-Saudi males and females in Saudi. They might be second to their males, but far from third class citizens. Many "FREE" men and women envy their status and life styles. It's not as black and white as people put it. Otherwise California blondes wouldn't be chasing Arab Sheikhs.

BTW, if you want to know about Saudi women, try getting to know a few. They are as proud of their heritage and nation as anyone else. In fact sometime they come off very arrogant due to their pride and status.

Don't just subscribe to whats in Western tabloids.

[roadrunner]

I think the point Wrayun was making is that Saudi women have more rights than for example Yemeni/Afghan women, but this is due to their vast oil wealth. It is correct because with money comes education, with education comes liberalism etc. With money comes security, with security comes more rights for everyone. But Saudi should be much more forward thinking than it is for the amount of money it has.