Arabic names pronounced differently in Pashto

[Sarbani]

Mispronunciations are not part of a language. These names are not written the way they are pronounced by some illiterates and are not meant to be pronounced that way so there is nothing Pashto about it.

Most languages do it. Look at John/Ion/Ioannis/Johan/Ivan/Jovan or Maryam/Miriam/Mary/Maria. There are countless examples of that. Turkish does the same thing as I showed in the link on the first post. They are all one name but written/pronounced differently in different languages.

[Sarbani]

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

The Arabic name "Yousef" is not equivalent to "Esap".
When Pashtuns/Pakthuns became Muslim they changed their names to Arabic/Semitic names. "Yousef" in Arabic is derived from Hebrew.
"Aspa" is a "mare in Pashto.
"Aas" is a horse in Pashto.

"Esap" is related to "aspa". Also, "aspa" is a horse in Avestan.
"Aspi"/"aspahe" is a mare in Avestan.

Pashto/Paktho is an Iranic or Irano-Aryan language and has terms from Avestan.
"Ashva" is the Rig veda term for "horse".

Manana

Wrong. You just made that up based off your own hunch and wishful thinking. Isep is the local pronunciation since we don't have the [f] sound in Pashto. In the Arabic script, it is written as يوسفزی, which is يوسف + زی.

[Pakthun345]

Yousafzai and E

Assalamu alaykum and hello Sarbani,

Dear brother "Sarbani" you are entitled to your opinion.
Does "Isep" mean the same as "Yusaf"?
Brother Sarbani please tell me the meaning of Isep?

Manana

[Pakthun345]

Hisham being Sham

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

Brother Sarbani is right. Hisham is pronounced as Sham.
Different languages have different forms of names.
All languages are related.

Manana

[Sikandar.]

Most languages do it. Look at John/Ion/Ioannis/Johan/Ivan/Jovan or Maryam/Miriam/Mary/Maria. There are countless examples of that. Turkish does the same thing as I showed in the link on the first post. They are all one name but written/pronounced differently in different languages.

A person may call his son yousep, he will not have it as that in his documents because any literate person with the ability to read and write in that language, understands that there is no such thing out there or point to butchering a language to justify a mispronunciation which is wrong in the first place. Miriam and Mary might be variations of a same name, no person in the west is known as Mary and Miriam at the same time. If they do it, it’s because they want a shorter name, not because they figure a different way of pronouncing Miriam is Mary. Similarly, hisham is not pronounced as Sham, people deliberately change it to shorten it. It’s a thing that a person does out of personal choice, not a rule in the books of language or grammar.

[Pakthun345]

Yousafzai and Isep/esap

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

I disagree with you Sarbani.
"Yousafzai" is a name adopted by the tribe after they became Muslim.
"Esap" is related to "asp" which means horse. Its not my wishful thinking.
There is a article in the tribune newspaper supporting what I have stated.
I can get much more evidence Insha Allah too.

You are entitled to your opinion. I am entitled to mine.

Manana

[Pakthun345]

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

Brother Sikander you are right in some way. However, there are different forms in different languages and dialects. Persian: khahar, Pashto: khor. Just because in Pashto it's a shorter form does not make it incorrect.

Manana

[Sikandar.]

khuwahar is Farsi sounds like khor in Pashto? I don’t think it does but I understand where you are going with this. Ney in Farsi means no, nien in German means no and is even pronounced as the ney in Farsi. Maadar is the Farsi word for mother and mor in Pashto. At some point of time, these languages did come from the same source but eventually, they branched out to be entirely different languages that have their own characteristic.
When you look in to the authenticity of a language, you have to look at it’s roots, not the opposite end. In all the Pashto books from the past, Yosef is written as yousef and meant to be pronounced as yousef. There are lots of Pashtuns who are capable of understanding it which is why in the written form, it’s yousef. People coming from regions with different dialects, or, lack of a written reference, may pronounce it as yousep, not because I’m doing so, they are speaking authentic Pashto but because they have chosen convenience over originality which is alright, as long as no one uses that as an excuse to justify or screw up a language.
It’s like humans and other species. You are saying that all the animals that walk on two have got to be human beings because at some point, they all originated from the same genes. Yeah, but then species evolved and became totally other species that share some characterstics with other species but are very unique in their own forms.

[Pakthun345]

Sikander

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

You did not understand my point. It does not matter.

Manana

[Sarbani]

Does "Isep" mean the same as "Yusaf"?
Brother Sarbani please tell me the meaning of Isep?

Yes. They're the same thing. It's just how we pronounce Yousaf in Pashto. Many people say "Isep Alesalam" for "Yousaf 'Alayhis-salaam".

[Sarbani]

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

I disagree with you Sarbani.
"Yousafzai" is a name adopted by the tribe after they became Muslim.
"Esap" is related to "asp" which means horse. Its not my wishful thinking.
There is a article in the tribune newspaper supporting what I have stated.
I can get much more evidence Insha Allah too.

You are entitled to your opinion. I am entitled to mine.

Manana

Yousaf was the son of Omar and the brother of Mandanr. The tribe was named after him. We call the Islamic prophet "Isep" too because that's how we pronounce the name. Believe whatever conspiracy you want.

[Sarbani]

A person may call his son yousep, he will not have it as that in his documents because any literate person with the ability to read and write in that language, understands that there is no such thing out there or point to butchering a language to justify a mispronunciation which is wrong in the first place. Miriam and Mary might be variations of a same name, no person in the west is known as Mary and Miriam at the same time. If they do it, it’s because they want a shorter name, not because they figure a different way of pronouncing Miriam is Mary. Similarly, hisham is not pronounced as Sham, people deliberately change it to shorten it. It’s a thing that a person does out of personal choice, not a rule in the books of language or grammar.

People write words how they pronounce. That's why "Muhammad" is "Mehmet" in Turkish and why "John" is "Johan" (pronounced "yo-haan") in German. I don't see how my examples are different. If we were to adopt the Latin script, we would (or should) use the Pashto pronunciation like how Turkish uses the Turkish pronunciation.

[Pakthun345]

Yousafzai

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

Dear brother Sarbani I agree with you regarding Yousafzai being Pashtun and Yousafzai, Mandanr, etc being the genealogical names. It is just the name "Isap" is related to "aspa" ie. horse. I am not saying it to win an argument or because of ego.

Some of the Pashtun/Pakthun tribes adopted Muslim names after accepting Islam.
In the book, "The Invasion of India by Alexander the great" it states that the "Aspasioi" of Strabo being also "Hippasioi". Then it states these people being equivalent to "Ashvaka" of the Maharabharata. Then it states "Ashvaka" being a cavalier from "Ashva" ie horse.

Then in the book it states that the Greek "Hippasioi is more distinctly preserved in Asip or Isap, the Puktho name of this tribe called by Mohammedans the"Yusufzai." See page 333, 334.

The full title of the book is:The Invasion of India by Alexander the great as described by Arrian, Q.Curtius, Diodorus, Plutarch, and Justin. Alexander's campaigns in Afghanistan, the Panjab, Sindh, Gedrosia and Karmania. It is by J. W.McCrindle.

Hippos means horse in Greek. Ashva is horse in the Rigveda, ie. Vedic language.

Manana

[Pakthun345]

Yousafzai and Isep

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

Dear brother Sarbani I dnt deny that you pronounce "Yusaf" as "Isep".
It was just about the origin of the term "Isep".

Thank you

Manana