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  • Agnosticism

    Tell me what you think of such a concept.

    Do you think it can be applicable to established religions like Islam?

  • #2
    Welcome Roadrunner, it's been a while and good to see you back.

    Can it be applicable to Islam? Muslims do not believe it's impossible to believe in a God. We believe there is a God, Allah. The Quran and Hadith provide further guidance, and a way of life.
    Even Adobe Photoshop can't change me.

    A line[Durrand line] of hatred that raised a wall between the two brothers -Hamid Karzai

    For generations, the Hindus of India prayed for deliverance from "the venom of the cobra, the teeth of the tiger and the vengeance of the Afghan."


    The men of Kábul and Khilj also went home; and whenever they were questioned about the Musulmáns of the Kohistán (the mountains), and how matters stood there, they said, "Don't call it Kohistán, but Afghánistán; for there is nothing there but Afgháns and disturbances." Thus it is clear that for this reason the people of the country call their home in their own language Afghánistán, and themselves Afgháns. The people of India call them Patán; but the reason for this is not known. But it occurs to me, that when, under the rule of Muhammadan sovereigns, Musulmáns first came to the city of Patná, and dwelt there, the people of India (for that reason) called them Patáns—but God knows!

    -Ferishta, 1560–1620

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    • #3
      Thank you for the gracious welcome oh fiery one with two fingers.

      What is your definition of an agnostic? An agnostic can believe in the existence of God, just that he/she cannot prove it.

      Comment


      • #4
        Wait for scimitar...

        He is writing his grade 15 exam for the 2nd time so he is preoccupied.

        (Plus he is waiting for the amnesia to set in from the horrible psychological trauma I exposed him to last time he was here.)

        He identifies himself as a "theist agnostic"....I would like to now how he rationalizes that stance as well. So come back later.

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        • #5
          and the opposition you have to him calling himself this is what, exactly?

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          • #6
            agnostic people are more willing to look for the truth rather than just declaring that there is no God.

            I have had some agnostic friends and there answer to the existence of God was "I dont know". So basically they are in the middle

            Now this said, some of there arguments were more "atheist" like from what i have noticed, meaning they were probably more closer to being atheists rather than believers
            Last edited by Karachi; 12-14-2011, 10:15 PM.

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            • #7
              By a similar argument, an agnostic can be more closer to being a believer than an atheist.

              That's not the question. Can an agnostic be a believer?

              If not, why not?

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              • #8
                ^ well are you talking about believer in Islam or believer in God?

                If they believe in God than they are not agnostics I think

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                • #9
                  if they believe in God but feel they can't prove it, arent they agnostic?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by roadrunner View Post
                    Thank you for the gracious welcome oh fiery one with two fingers.

                    What is your definition of an agnostic? An agnostic can believe in the existence of God, just that he/she cannot prove it.
                    Exactly. Agnosticism/gnosticism is separate from atheism/theism.
                    -------------------------------------------------

                    "There was so much to grok, so little to grok from. "

                    "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh C'thulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn"

                    أنا آسف ، أنا لا أقرأ أو لا يتكلم اللغة العربية. وسوف تبذل جهدا لترجمة مع ترجمة جوجل. يرجى أن يكون فهم من هذا الحاجز.
                    (I'm sorry, I do not read or speak Arabic. I will make an effort to translate with Google translate. Please be understanding of this barrier.)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Alchemist View Post
                      Wait for scimitar...

                      He is writing his grade 15 exam for the 2nd time so he is preoccupied.

                      (Plus he is waiting for the amnesia to set in from the horrible psychological trauma I exposed him to last time he was here.)

                      He identifies himself as a "theist agnostic"....I would like to now how he rationalizes that stance as well. So come back later.
                      Rationalizes it? It's one of the standard 4 categorizations of religious belief.
                      -------------------------------------------------

                      "There was so much to grok, so little to grok from. "

                      "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh C'thulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn"

                      أنا آسف ، أنا لا أقرأ أو لا يتكلم اللغة العربية. وسوف تبذل جهدا لترجمة مع ترجمة جوجل. يرجى أن يكون فهم من هذا الحاجز.
                      (I'm sorry, I do not read or speak Arabic. I will make an effort to translate with Google translate. Please be understanding of this barrier.)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Karachi View Post
                        agnostic people are more willing to look for the truth rather than just declaring that there is no God.

                        I have had some agnostic friends and there answer to the existence of God was "I dont know". So basically they are in the middle

                        Now this said, some of there arguments were more "atheist" like from what i have noticed, meaning they were probably more closer to being atheists rather than believers
                        False. Agnosticism is *not* in the middle of theism, atheism. It is a measure of belief in the ability to *PROVE* your atheistic or theistic beliefs.
                        -------------------------------------------------

                        "There was so much to grok, so little to grok from. "

                        "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh C'thulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn"

                        أنا آسف ، أنا لا أقرأ أو لا يتكلم اللغة العربية. وسوف تبذل جهدا لترجمة مع ترجمة جوجل. يرجى أن يكون فهم من هذا الحاجز.
                        (I'm sorry, I do not read or speak Arabic. I will make an effort to translate with Google translate. Please be understanding of this barrier.)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by roadrunner View Post
                          By a similar argument, an agnostic can be more closer to being a believer than an atheist.

                          That's not the question. Can an agnostic be a believer?

                          If not, why not?
                          Yes they can, and most believers actually are agnostic, and just don't know it. They believe in a god, and understand that they cannot actually prove that belief to others.
                          -------------------------------------------------

                          "There was so much to grok, so little to grok from. "

                          "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh C'thulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn"

                          أنا آسف ، أنا لا أقرأ أو لا يتكلم اللغة العربية. وسوف تبذل جهدا لترجمة مع ترجمة جوجل. يرجى أن يكون فهم من هذا الحاجز.
                          (I'm sorry, I do not read or speak Arabic. I will make an effort to translate with Google translate. Please be understanding of this barrier.)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by roadrunner View Post
                            if they believe in God but feel they can't prove it, arent they agnostic?
                            Yes.
                            -------------------------------------------------

                            "There was so much to grok, so little to grok from. "

                            "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh C'thulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn"

                            أنا آسف ، أنا لا أقرأ أو لا يتكلم اللغة العربية. وسوف تبذل جهدا لترجمة مع ترجمة جوجل. يرجى أن يكون فهم من هذا الحاجز.
                            (I'm sorry, I do not read or speak Arabic. I will make an effort to translate with Google translate. Please be understanding of this barrier.)

                            Comment


                            • #15

                              Perhaps this will help. Keep in mind, that in this context 'certain' means 100% provable, and not just 'I take it as a matter of faith'.
                              -------------------------------------------------

                              "There was so much to grok, so little to grok from. "

                              "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh C'thulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn"

                              أنا آسف ، أنا لا أقرأ أو لا يتكلم اللغة العربية. وسوف تبذل جهدا لترجمة مع ترجمة جوجل. يرجى أن يكون فهم من هذا الحاجز.
                              (I'm sorry, I do not read or speak Arabic. I will make an effort to translate with Google translate. Please be understanding of this barrier.)

                              Comment

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