Ask an American, agnostic and atheist man pretty much anything

[Tjanaparh]

The report I read states that only Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians are protected against short term and long term imprisionment on the basis of their religious affiliation, protection from the seizure of private property and assets, the right to assemble, and various other legal protections.

The report you read shouldn't be risht.
Many of our people with our traditional belief travelled and even live in Iran. The Iranian police even helped them in situations where the police in other places would say "that'S not our job".

[Tjanaparh]

The rest of our discussion I will stop at the point we left.
Bacause any of my words You won't understand if you do not study and understand the life of a ethnic nation. The Us are not an ethnic nation but just an economic aglomeration - the moral and human You for traders is completely immoral for us.

I repeat my words once again after what all the discussion about human rights looses sense.
My friend, one of our heroes that defended our people in the war was ordered by one of your congressmen to bring him to jail when we had the zionist president L.Ter-Petrosyan.
My friend qouted that it is antinational and sick promuoving gay culture in Armenia, beacuse our nation is on the border of dying! He didn'T tell "kill the gays" - he told , treat the gays at is just - as sick people and don't promuove this way of life as normal.
You USA mixed in our national affairs without even knowing our history bringing my friend to jail for antisemitism and anti gay. Fortunately people protested and he didn't go to jail but the accuses weren'T canceled. Interestingly even the leader of the jews of Armenia told that he newer told anything against jews and that Zionist and Jew is not the same, one thing that your congressman didn'T understand.
If you want you can keep in the USA making gays to a normal type of lifestyle - but in our nation that is already in disastrous situations(actually even to some economic interests of some superpowers....) we do not want to create of what remained of our nation a sick minded comunity that will siucide itsels in some years.

And one last point - man and woman have not the same rights as they are different.
You are equal with your wife? So go and make a child, go ang give your child some milk.
IT is natural that a woman has as obligations to give life to a child , to feed and protect him in the first lifeyears and to educate him.
After the education is part of fathers obligations. While the mother is bringing up the children only the father can protect the family, that is why men are warriors. While a woman is more material(in our faith she is compared to the earth that gives life - the earth is also material) , beacuse she has to feed a child she has more materialistic thought(how to get food, what food is right....), the man is more spiritual(that is why mostly thinkers, composers, writers are men).
The best woman will become reflection of a spiritually low man! That is why almost in every nation parents are so worring about who can be the husband of their daughter.
While it is not so with men, as they are the spiritual pole of a family and a woman is a material one.
A woman has a natue giuded by feeling - she can feel the pain of other and her love is based on feelings.
A man has a nature of justice and spirit and his love is based on that aspects.
How can you tell that with that differences woman and man can have same rights?
Their rights are different - a woman shouldn'T have a mans right and a man a womans right. This destroys the society(and I have seen this destruction too much).

[ozymandias]

The rest of our discussion I will stop at the point we left.
Bacause any of my words You won't understand if you do not study and understand the life of a ethnic nation. The Us are not an ethnic nation but just an economic aglomeration - the moral and human You for traders is completely immoral for us.

I repeat my words once again after what all the discussion about human rights looses sense.
My friend, one of our heroes that defended our people in the war was ordered by one of your congressmen to bring him to jail when we had the zionist president L.Ter-Petrosyan.
My friend qouted that it is antinational and sick promuoving gay culture in Armenia, beacuse our nation is on the border of dying! He didn'T tell "kill the gays" - he told , treat the gays at is just - as sick people and don't promuove this way of life as normal.
You USA mixed in our national affairs without even knowing our history bringing my friend to jail for antisemitism and anti gay. Fortunately people protested and he didn't go to jail but the accuses weren'T canceled. Interestingly even the leader of the jews of Armenia told that he newer told anything against jews and that Zionist and Jew is not the same, one thing that your congressman didn'T understand.
If you want you can keep in the USA making gays to a normal type of lifestyle - but in our nation that is already in disastrous situations(actually even to some economic interests of some superpowers....) we do not want to create of what remained of our nation a sick minded comunity that will siucide itsels in some years.

I'm sorry -- I am not sure what you are trying to say here.

And one last point - man and woman have not the same rights as they are different.
You are equal with your wife? So go and make a child, go ang give your child some milk.

What does this have to do with the right to free speech, to vote, freedom of religion, education, or the right to be free from oppression?

IT is natural that a woman has as obligations to give life to a child , to feed and protect him in the first lifeyears and to educate him.

What does this have to do with the right to free speech, to vote, freedom of religion, education, or the right to be free from oppression?

After the education is part of fathers obligations. While the mother is bringing up the children only the father can protect the family, that is why men are warriors. While a woman is more material(in our faith she is compared to the earth that gives life - the earth is also material) , beacuse she has to feed a child she has more materialistic thought(how to get food, what food is right....),

What does this have to do with the right to free speech, to vote, freedom of religion, education, or the right to be free from oppression?

the man is more spiritual(that is why mostly thinkers, composers, writers are men).

Actually, it is far more likely that this is the result of sexist attitudes like yours preventing them from getting a fair education.

[/quote]

The best woman will become reflection of a spiritually low man! That is why almost in every nation parents are so worring about who can be the husband of their daughter.
While it is not so with men, as they are the spiritual pole of a family and a woman is a material one.

What does this have to do with the right to free speech, to vote, freedom of religion, education, or the right to be free from oppression?

A woman has a natue giuded by feeling - she can feel the pain of other and her love is based on feelings.
A man has a nature of justice and spirit and his love is based on that aspects.
How can you tell that with that differences woman and man can have same rights?
Their rights are different - a woman shouldn'T have a mans right and a man a womans right. This destroys the society(and I have seen this destruction too much).[/QUOTE]

No, you have not. Name one place where equal rights destroyed society.

[ozymandias]

The report I read states that only Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians are protected against short term and long term imprisionment on the basis of their religious affiliation, protection from the seizure of private property and assets, the right to assemble, and various other legal protections.

The report you read shouldn't be risht.
Many of our people with our traditional belief travelled and even live in Iran. The Iranian police even helped them in situations where the police in other places would say "that'S not our job".

What does risht mean?

I may be wrong about Iranian laws -- but I honestly have not looked into it too much to read the specifics. It was an example used up above, and that is all.

[Tjanaparh]

right - excuse me ! Sometimes I am not typing very well.

[ozymandias]

right - excuse me ! Sometimes I am not typing very well.

Fair enough. I assumed that it was a non-English word, sorry about that.

[Alchemist]

Basically ozy basis his belief in gravity on blind faith in a science which he himself doesn't understand. He didn't need to be convinced that gravity is a force, but he has to be convinced that God created him.

He either deliberately doesn't want to understand Pascal's wager, or his subconcious mind cannot accept that the wager only applies to One God, and not many gods. If he can't even bother to know the difference between polytheism and monotheism, and how the wager only applies to one and not the other, then why bother with such self deceptive laziness?

So I googled = belief + choice and a whole list of references to atheist sites popped up. It appears that it is a central tenant of atheism to believe that "belief is not a choice". Of course, years of psycho babble and aggressive marketing by the pharmaceutical companies has everyone in the west convinced that their depression is not their choice, and not as a result of their way of thinking. They have us convinced that we are by nature irrational beings and so we act on baser impulses. The most archaic of which is the belief that ozy is himself a demi god of a sort - which is why he believes that in his company a whole number of demi gods work towards a defined objective and succeed - I suppose success here is quantified by montary compensation - I forgot how zues paid posidon or apollo.

I will say this in passing, the human rights commission here in canada is an absolute failure. The supreme court has now allowed for the opening of heroine shooting galleries in vancouver. Soon they will even supply the drugs for the addicts - because they have the right to life, liberty and security.

[kakargirl]

Thank you for your honest best wishes. I do have one correction, though -- there is no 'back' for me. I have never been religious.

There is back as all babies are born believers ,what they become is up to themselves, so ozy there is a back i hope one day you do find your way back.


“Allah chooses for Himself whom He pleases, and guides to Himself those who turn (to Him) [42:13].”“Allah knows best where He places His message [6:124].”

[IamDZJ]

There is back as all babies are born believers ,what they become is up to themselves, so ozy there is a back i hope one day you do find your way back.


“Allah chooses for Himself whom He pleases, and guides to Himself those who turn (to Him) [42:13].”“Allah knows best where He places His message [6:124].”

all babies are born believers?! where?!

[randolph85]

well recently its been proven by studies that belief in a higher power is an inherent human trait. its disbelief that is unnatural to human beings.

[IamDZJ]

kakargirl don't avoid me. I want to know how and where babies are born believers.

[kakargirl]

all babies are born believers?! where?!

Quran uses the word FITRAH(PURE NATURE)SO CHILDREN ARE BORN CLEAN PURE BELIEVERS.

[IamDZJ]

Quran uses the word FITRAH(PURE NATURE)SO CHILDREN ARE BORN CLEAN PURE BELIEVERS.

children are born pure and innocent but they are not believers. You can't be a believer prior to having knowledge of something. It's plain common sense. I am not going to ask you to prove it because I m pretty sure there is no such thing in quraan regarding this silly claim of yours.

[kakargirl]

children are born pure and innocent but they are not believers. You can't be a believer prior to having knowledge of something. It's plain common sense. I am not going to ask you to prove it because I m pretty sure there is no such thing in quraan regarding this silly claim of yours.

Narrated Abu Hurairah (ra): The Messenger of Allah (sa) said:
مَا مِنْ مَوْلُودٍ يُولَدُ إِلَّا عَلَى الْفِطْرَةِ فَأَبَوَاهُ يُهَوِّدَانِهِ أَوْ يُنَصِّرَانِهِ أَوْ يُمَجِّسَانِهِ،كَمَا تُنْتَجُ الْبَهِيمَةُ بَهِيمَةً جَمْعَاءَ، هَلْ تُحِسُّونَ فِيهَا مِنْ جَدْعَاءَ؟
“No child is born except in a state of Fitrah (instinct), then his parents make him a Jew or a Christian or a Zoroastrian, just as each animal produces a perfect animal like itself -- do you see any among them that are born mutilated?”
Then Abu Hurairah (ra) recited the verse:
فِطْرَةَ اللَّهِ الَّتِى فَطَرَ النَّاسَ عَلَيْهَا لاَ تَبْدِيلَ لِخَلْقِ اللَّهِ ذَلِكَ الدِّينُ الْقَيِّمُ
“[Adhere to] the fitrah of Allah upon which He has created [all] people. No change should there be in the creation of Allah. That is the correct religion...”
[Surat Ar-Rum 30:30;

[kakargirl]

Biggest proof is surah al imran , where Isa salam pbuh spoke as a newborn to protect him mother.