Death

[PFgulalai]

Its obviously win-win for me because I have faith and you don't. I could die thinking I would go to heaven. If I dont and I just die than be it.

But you, you have already gave up on Religion. Perhaps you were lazy to pray so you cursed at God to see if he can respond and he did not cause he was testing you so you decided to say look he does not exist.

Shlombay, just because you don't know about my Coelentratologhypechilontum sefyloganstanyaqrzellomioe does not mean that you are more active and I am lazy??.Anyways, I guess in my "Rojay-Mata" test, god was lazy since he did not bother to answer.How can he test me when he himself can't prove his existence? I am a free thinker, devoid of any limits. Just because we don't think the same does not make you a much better individual than me.Your belief in existence does not make you superior. After all, it is just one another belief.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Shlombay, just because you don't know about my Coelentratologhypechilontum sefyloganstanyaqrzellomioe does not mean that you are more active and I am lazy??.Anyways, I guess in my "Rojay-Mata" test, god was lazy since he did not bother to answer.How can he test me when he himself can't prove his existence? I am a free thinker, devoid of any limits. Just because we don't think the same does not make you a much better individual than me.Your belief in existence does not make you superior. After all, it is just one another belief.

Of course you are limited.

You get hungry.
You get tired.
You need to be loved.
You need money.
You need to relieve yourself.

Want me to go on?

And you will DIE....

I would say you are very limited.

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

Sholombay jan, don't be intimidated by their big words. No philosopher has been able to prove the non existance of God. The question of God is simply a matter of belief. In philosophy, philosophers have given up on trying to disprove God and other philosophers have given up trying to prove God rationally.

The teapot example is so stupid. how can somebody really believe the teapot is God? I can disprove this God by simply stepping on it and breaking it into peices. That theory will go out of the windom. On the other hand, non theists can never do that to the real God since he is not material.

hehehe you naughty boy! ;-)

Through logic and common sense, it can easily be deduced that if there really is an omnipotent and omniscient deity out there, it has yet to contact us. I mean, do you really want to believe that the great deity behind self-sufficient universal geological systems and self-replicating living organisms has to whisper his commands to people hidden in caves and on mountaintops whilst himself hiding behind bushes? And look at those commands themselves - do you really think that this deity of such colossal understanding is interested in your daily nitty gritty, how you make love or how you go to the toilet? These things just don't add up and that's why you need "faith" aka blind following to encourage yourself to perform repetitive ritual acts of worship everyday.

It also seems as though you have misunderstood Mr. Bertrand Russel (virgins be upon him)'s tea-pot theory. The purpose of the theory is to prove that the onus (burden of proof for the existence of God in that case) lies with the one who's claiming that his deity exists and not upon the one who is denying something whose existence is yet to be proven.


The Yahweh example is so stupid. how can somebody really believe the Yahweh is God? I can disprove this God by simply disproving all the 'scientific' claims in his books and breaking them (the claims) into pieces. That theory will go out of the window and into the frying pan and into the oven and into my stomach. On the other hand, theists are yet to prove their case for God except by saying, "he is, he was and he will be". Similarly, my teapot was, it is and it will be forevermore!

[Baygham]

There are many things that we don't know of, does that mean they don't exist? Everything is a mirror of God.

Things that we dont know are indeed plenty. One can deduce from available facts the possibilities of things in such. I dont know what tommorow will be like -an unknown, but my experience makes me deduce that the probability of the sun coming out even if behind clouds is close to 100%. There is also the possibility that the sun may vanish, but that does not worry me based on available data. If every day all I think of is the dooms day collapse of Sun, I will just ruin my life.

the string theorist will say well there are 20 more dimensions and on dimension 19 mwmn(momin) is considered intelligent and from our calculations gave you 1 million dollars. I have no way of peeking into dimension number 19 to confirm this, under the circumstances it is a belief. It may or may not be true.

Two days later momin shows at my door demanding 1 million dollars.
which 1 million dude.
the one i gave you in dimension number 19.
Have you been taking hallucinogenics man, get lost.
Give me my money- you non believing murtad.

And we start fighting. My neighbours get involved, Sangar shows up and i tell him. Qadianay dhey, he just snaps and bolts his klashinkow, ma khoo thi khpee oobasalee, hopefully momin is OK.

[PFgulalai]

There are many things that we don't know of, does that mean they don't exist? Everything is a mirror of God.

Yes, things that we don't know does not exist to the known world (I am talking about this REAL world, I don't know about your Alif-laila world). Once they become known, only then we approve of their existence.

You can't expect radio-waves to reveal themselves to you unless you find the right apparatus. Now clean your heart from mockery and be sincere, He will reveal Himself. Seeing is not always believing.

Pretty self-explanatory. We knew about radiowaves existed until we discovered them with our right apparatus. We can now measure and tune the required frequency. This analogy does not work in proving the existence of the God. Today we know about the existence of radio waves because they have been scientifically proven.In god's case, nothing has been proven yet.Then how does the radiowaves equation work in god's case?

It is obvious that you have been created. Worry about that first. Just because you can't comprehend some phenomenon does not mean that it is false.

I have been created from a bacteria. I have created a bacterium too. And I am also creating genetically modified dogs. I also created a new cell from scratch.I know the game of creation. What is false now?

A Creator is not limited by his creation.

So? how do you prove that?

I suppose dreams are non-existent?

Lol..Do you mean to say that god=dreams? Then let me tell you that you can now measure dreams through polysomnography. Dream is pattern of images and sounds that are experienced during REM (or sleep).To the conscious mind, dreams do exist.Your case might be different.

[PFgulalai]

Or he didn't wanna speak to you since you have been a bad girl.

You are wrong, Mr.Pious Timbaktu. I was not evil until I reached my conclusion about him.Hence he should have done anything to keep me as his faithful follower.It's another thing if he is did not like because I a PF member.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Yes, things that we don't know does not exist to the known world (I am talking about this REAL world, I don't know about your Alif-laila world). Once they become known, only then we approve of their existence.

Pretty amazing logic. I am so proud of you. Your logic is second to none.

According to your beautiful logic: Before we found gold, gold did not exist!

Pretty self-explanatory. We knew about radiowaves existed until we discovered them with our right apparatus. We can now measure and tune the required frequency. This analogy does not work in proving the existence of the God. Today we know about the existence of radio waves because they have been scientifically proven.In god's case, nothing has been proven yet.Then how does the radiowaves equation work in god's case?

The waves were always there, the same is true about His waves. Just find the right receiver in your heart.

How can you comprehend motherhood without being a mother?

I have been created from a bacteria. I have created a bacterium too. And I am also creating genetically modified dogs. I also created a new cell from scratch.I know the game of creation. What is false now?

Create something without example.

So? how do you prove that?

A bicycle is the same as a human being? It has a heart-beat?

Lol..Do you mean to say that god=dreams? Then let me tell you that you can now measure dreams through polysomnography. Dream is pattern of images and sounds that are experienced during REM (or sleep).To the conscious mind, dreams do exist.Your case might be different.

You always amaze me with your logic! Always.
Show me your dream, without explanation.

[PFgulalai]

Gulalai,
You are missing the point. Do you not feel guilty if he might indeed exists? You are arguing since I cant provide you concrete evidence he does not exist. I am arguing if you cant provide evidence that he does not exist it means you cant pass judgements either.

Great! you accepted that you can't. I guess you are more honest than others here. I already provided you the evidence.I am not responsible for you being in a chronic persistent state of denial.

Your religious knowledge does not make you a good person.

No it does.Ask MWMN, Timbaktu and Shlombay. Do not ask from Qrratugai, Baygham and Levanaye Zalmeye.

Do you mind explaining to me(if you can)what makes you so confident that he does not exist?

Perhaps you missed reading it...here is the answer to your question.
http://www.pashtunforums.com/120801-post30.html

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Funny how you side with those who say that God does not exist. Why is that? I have yet to see you side with your own Muslim brothers and sisters when it comes to Atheism vs Islam.

And, are you trying to mock us by saying that it is "faith?"

[Baygham]

Malgariya you are making Islam sound like it tells you not to think. You have said so much in your attempt of scrutinizing Islam but you have yet to actually bring forward evidence that makes Islam incompatible. Islam is something that helps us control ourselves with our modern lives. Islam does not say not to educate yourself or to learn science. In fact there is a hadith that says even travel to China to learn about education.

Lets agree that Islam does not exist we will die and that is it.
But what if Islam actually does exist than what?

Proof that Islam makes you not think:
Momin,
sangar,
shlombay

anymore needed.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Nice claim, but substantiate it.

[Baygham]

Proof that Islam makes you not think:
Momin,
sangar,
shlombay

anymore needed.

Nice claim, but substantiate it.

Just think of it (sorry to invite you to bidath).
You two are on team A, fighting team B. The irony is that your teammate 'sangar' would rather drink your and your families blood and Yet you take comfort, in some perverted way, in his logic and side with him, in your glorious quest.

ON the other hand, team B wants you to live happily, raise your family in peace and comfort, in pashtoon land, with honour and dignity. And you consider us enemies.

Is that stupid or genius.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Just think of it (sorry to invite you to bidath).
You two are on team A, fighting team B. The irony is that your teammate 'sangar' would rather drink your and your families blood and Yet you take comfort, in some perverted way, in his logic and side with him, in your glorious quest.

ON the other hand, team B wants you to live happily, raise your family in peace and comfort, in pashtoon land, with honour and dignity. And you consider us enemies.

Is that stupid or genius.

And ALL Atheists are united?

[Baygham]

And ALL Atheists are united?

where did i make that assertion.

I was just showing the stupidity of siding with mortal enemies. Just shows how the intense fear of God can impair judgement even with mortal consequences. Hence the assumption of stupidity secondary to religious beliefs.

[Baygham]

.............................
I'll ask a simple question from you, if you find a million dollars in your pocket right now. would you be satisfied if someone says it was just there. nobody put it there. it came by itself.

Not a million, but i did find some extra few thousands in my bank account. I did not jump up and down, went to the bank and told them of their mistake and gave it back. If it was a million or ten would have done the same thing. So whats your point.