Egypt bans 55,000 mosque preachers in crackdown on Islamists

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Misguidance? Yeah that definitely describes them,. Apostate though? I hold back from declaring them apostates; because such a charge is extremely serious, I won't go that far. Misguided for sure though.

[DaZahroJaam.]

mosques are meant for religious congregations, not political ones. if i wanted to catch up on current affairs or obama's latest action regarding so and so, i would have stayed home and watched the television. if this is how it is in canada, i can imagine what might be going on in egypt.
therefore, good move. if they want to discuss politics, they should gather at a different location and preach each other all they want. not inside a mosque.

[Manzareh]

mosques are meant for religious congregations, not political ones.

At the time of the Prophet (pbuh) and also through the golden age of Islam mosques were meant for religious congregations as well as political ones, mosques SHOULD be used for prayers and also community centers, mosques were utilized as resting places for travelers, gatherings on social issues as well as many other things. If you think Mosques are only made for prayers then your information is distorted, a Masjid is much more than that.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Misguidance? Yeah that definitely describes them,. Apostate though? I hold back from declaring them apostates; because such a charge is extremely serious, I won't go that far. Misguided for sure though.

So Khostai is not a kaafir according to you? Splendid.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

So Khostai is not a kaafir according to you? Splendid.

why do we need to declare people kafir; isn't it sufficient just to say misguided?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

At the time of the Prophet (pbuh) and also through the golden age of Islam mosques were meant for religious congregations as well as political ones, mosques SHOULD be used for prayers and also community centers, mosques were utilized as resting places for travelers, gatherings on social issues as well as many other things. If you think Mosques are only made for prayers then your information is distorted, a Masjid is much more than that.

Correct.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

why do we need to declare people kafir; isn't it sufficient just to say misguided?

Don't you think being a Muslim is only for Muslims? Why should we allow apostates, zindeeqs etc to claim Islam for themselves?

Besides, takfeer is necessary at certain times. In a community where most members believe legislating laws contrary to Islam is okay, it is necessary to delcare those who claim so to be kaafirs.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Don't you think being a Muslim is only for Muslims? Why should we allow apostates, zindeeqs etc to claim Islam for themselves?

Besides, takfeer is necessary at certain times. In a community where most members believe legislating laws contrary to Islam is okay, it is necessary to delcare those who claim so to be kaafirs.

I'm saying that unless it is necessary; the use of takfir should be used with extreme caution and sparringly. If you think we need to takfir people to bring their ideas or behaviors into matters of social concern then saying they're misguided is sufficient enough. I just find takfir is heavily abused and I find myself reluctant to use it unless I have hard and direct affirmation that they discredit Islam entirely.

[Badlun]

Misguidance? Yeah that definitely describes them,. Apostate though? I hold back from declaring them apostates; because such a charge is extremely serious, I won't go that far. Misguided for sure though.

I may be misguided by your standards because I favor secularism but what do you think am I equally misguided when I talk about democracy, development, human rights, women rights, modern education, science and technology, rationalism, liberalism, prosperity and enlightened moderation.

On secularism I will reiterate myself that as Islam never functioned successfully as a political or economic system so I prefer not to base my state, society, culture and economy on Islam but on democracy, Pashtunwali and capitalism with socialist tendencies. Quran is more for religion than for state or economy. Fundamentals of Islam do not include politics, economy, culture and society.

[Friend]

I may be misguided by your standards because I favor secularism but what do you think am I equally misguided when I talk about democracy, development, human rights, women rights, modern education, science and technology, rationalism, liberalism, prosperity and enlightened moderation.

On secularism I will reiterate myself that as Islam never functioned successfully as a political or economic system so I prefer not to base my state, society, culture and economy on Islam but on democracy, Pashtunwali and capitalism with socialist tendencies. Quran is more for religion than for state or economy. Fundamentals of Islam do not include politics, economy, culture and society.

Parrot parrot parrot

[DaZahroJaam.]

At the time of the Prophet (pbuh) and also through the golden age of Islam mosques were meant for religious congregations as well as political ones, mosques SHOULD be used for prayers and also community centers, mosques were utilized as resting places for travelers, gatherings on social issues as well as many other things. If you think Mosques are only made for prayers then your information is distorted, a Masjid is much more than that.

alot has changed since then. suppose i lived in a place where taliban were in charge of the government and i did not want them ruling the place or country. and i went to the mosque where as we all know it, they would be preaching about blowing one's self in to pieces with out any regret in order to put obama in his place and i did not agree with it and i don't want my children exposed to that sort of nonsense. where is my voice?? where do i go to pray and where do i send my children to pray.
religion being mixed with political matters is what has left so many muslims abandoning the religion because they just can not come up to an agreement with social/political matters with anyone who happens to know how to use a prayer mat.

back then we had the prophet mohammad pbuh representing us and teaching others islam, now we are stuck with the likes of mullah omar. don't compare that era with this one.

[Badlun]

The hard reality is that mosques are now practically being used for worship purposes only. People look at their watches and arrive at mosque exactly at prayers time and then leave the mosque quickly once they finish their prayers.

Many especially Wahabis and Salafis do not offer sunna and nawafil prayers after farad(obligatory) prayers and leave the mosque immediately.

Many mosque Imams and organizers do not allow any mundane discussion in mosques and call it a sin to talk about worldly affairs in mosques. They prefer silence and worship to any conversation or discussion.

Khutbas(addresses) of the Mullahs are monologues. I have never seen any dialog or questions answer session in any Friday khutba. He comes, talks and go away. No criticism or any comment is ever accepted.

Half of the population, women, are usually out of mosques as they are told that their prayers are better in homes than in mosques.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

I may be misguided by your standards because I favor secularism but what do you think am I equally misguided when I talk about democracy, development, human rights, women rights, modern education, science and technology, rationalism, liberalism, prosperity and enlightened moderation.

On secularism I will reiterate myself that as Islam never functioned successfully as a political or economic system so I prefer not to base my state, society, culture and economy on Islam but on democracy, Pashtunwali and capitalism with socialist tendencies. Quran is more for religion than for state or economy. Fundamentals of Islam do not include politics, economy, culture and society.

These are the same claims and points that myself , randolph, BarakzaiAbdali and others have refuted and debunked many many times. This is your problem Badlum; you don't listen, you ignore any evidence that shows you are wrong.

and that's what makes you misguided. If you had solid evidence I'd have been the first to stand behind you.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

LOL at debates during khutbah. Khutbah is derived from khitaab. Meaning addressing people. Thats when the wisest man in the community addresses his flock once week. Its not a debate.

[Badlun]

These are the same claims and points that myself , randolph, BarakzaiAbdali and others have refuted and debunked many many times. This is your problem Badlum; you don't listen, you ignore any evidence that shows you are wrong.

and that's what makes you misguided. If you had solid evidence I'd have been the first to stand behind you.

What proof you need when I suggest democracy, development, human rights, science, technology for Pashtuns. My question was that you may have issues with secularism but do you have also issues with other approaches like democracy and development?

Am I also misguided when I promote democracy and development amongst Pashtuns? For SK democracy is shirk/kuffr/infidelity so I cannot expect a debate with him but I would like to know whether you favor these ideas like democracy or you are also against it.

I never recognize that you have ever debunked my claim that Islam never functioned as a successful system politically, economically and culturally. It is a perfect religion but not system. You quote only 30 years of piuous caliphs but that was an Arab rule and 30 years is not a sufficient period for calling a system successful when it did not work for 1400 years.