Tweet
Originally posted by khushal
View Post
-
Why dont you quote the verses of Quran stipulating the conditions of Shura? If you are so sure, you must know the answer.Originally posted by Firdousi -
you and khorosani don't really know what democracy is. Why don't you answer the question, every time I ask you this, you seem to dance around it.Originally posted by Shamlawar Khurasani View PostComment
-
You never read the Quran.Originally posted by FirdousiComment
-
are you afraid to answer it?
plus walay goman ka way, goman ka wal gonah na de?Last edited by khushal; 10-03-2013, 09:31 PM.Comment
-
Goman is not a sin but your love for shirk is.Originally posted by FirdousiComment
-
For Muslims it is simple. The Holy Quo'ran is the law.Comment
-
This is a forum, i can be all over the place if i want.Originally posted by khushal View Post
Shura is to consult one another to reach to a decision on various matters. The people of shura are chosen by the leaders and are based on their knowledge of deen and dunya and the people who chooses them in my opinion are the scholars and the leaders.
ps. at the same time i'm a lay man, and therefore my answer is limited to the amount of knowledge i have. However the bases of people being part of a shura is for them to have knowledge of the sharia and knowledge in the matters of the dunya so a proper decision can be made on how to handle an issue ect ect.Last edited by Khorosani; 10-05-2013, 06:31 AM.Comment
-
Yes, and according to Quran, democracy is shirk and Shura is a council of scholars and knowledgeable people.Originally posted by asad71 View Post
But the proponents of democracy believe Quran is wrong and their shallow understanding is correct.Originally posted by FirdousiComment
-
Democracy has come to mean various things to various people. Can we find democracy - as claimed by them, anywhere? DPRK? Old GDR? USA? UK? Where ? nowhere. Society needs a system where people can be safe, free, happy and able to work and raise family. And the answer lies in Islam.Originally posted by Shamlawar Khurasani View PostComment
-
It is quite simple: rule of the people by the people for the people.Originally posted by asad71 View Post
In essence, democracy is where people decide what is permissible and what is not permissble.
ٱتَّخَذُوٓاْ أَحۡبَارَهُمۡ وَرُهۡبَـٰنَهُمۡ أَرۡبَابً۬ا مِّن دُونِ ٱللَّهِ وَٱلۡمَسِيحَ ٱبۡنَ مَرۡيَمَ وَمَآ أُمِرُوٓاْ إِلَّا لِيَعۡبُدُوٓاْ إِلَـٰهً۬ا وَٲحِدً۬ا*ۖ لَّآ إِلَـٰهَ إِلَّا هُوَ*ۚ سُبۡحَـٰنَهُ ۥ عَمَّا يُشۡرِڪُونَ
Surah Al-Tawba
They (Jews and Christians) took their rabbis and their monks to be their lords besides Allâh (by obeying them in things which they made lawful or unlawful according to their own desires without being ordered by Allâh), and (they also took as their Lord) Messiah, son of Maryam (Mary), while they (Jews and Christians) were commanded [in the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)) to worship none but One Ilâh (God - Allâh) Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He)[]. Praise and glory is to Him, (far above is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him)." (31)Last edited by Shamlawar Khurasani; 10-05-2013, 07:33 AM.Originally posted by FirdousiComment
-
That's really a jargon to fool people.In real terms, democarcy boils down to rule by the goons for the previlaged exploiting the masses. There is no instance in human history where/when democracy as defined has been practiced.Originally posted by Shamlawar Khurasani View PostComment
-
Then there is no debate; as long as the objectives of Shari'ah are met. There is no conflict with democracy and Islam. This is your own admission!.Originally posted by Khorosani View Post
Similarly people being NOT able to choose their leaders can cause more harm and benefit. Remember Allah says the condition of the people is not changed unless they change themselves. If they want to be lead bad then this is their decision. Not someone else choosing it for them.At the same time, are the people able to chose there leaders? It depends on the society, in some places using democracy in an society or a community to pick your leaders may lead to more harm than benefit, this is due to people being easy to manipulate and influence.
In the current day, MOST of the Ulama have even less of a clue; they're stuck in a static mindframe where beard length is more important than ending poverty.The People don't understand the dynamics of how complex politics and the society work mostly because they are working on the ground while the politicians and leaders are more aware of the reality of how societies are affected and so forth.
You don't "think so" is not Islam says so. If anything THIS IS EXACTLY why people picking their leaders is crucial in Afghanistan or Pakistan because all you're doing is maintaining a vicious cycle of ignorance and social irresponsibility and maintaining the dictatorial climate that exists in both societies.So is it necessary for the people to vote in lets say Afghanistan or Pakistan? I don't think so.
How else do you pick leaders then? Some guy who thinks women have no role in society, that they don't need to learn to read or work or should be discriminated because she wanted to leave an abusive marriage....these types of men should be our leaders?We don't need democracy to help us pick our leaders but if a society wants to do so without contradicting the sharia even a little than that is there choice.
How and who determines who is qualified to be elected in a shura?I believe issues can be solved through the islamic solution that Allah sanctioned and recommended for us which is shura. We need council of scholars and pious people who are skilled in the affairs of the akhira and with the book of Allah and at the same time are leaders and in tuned with the world and how it works. We don't need foreign methods of dealing with our affairs when Allah has given us shura.
This is false, execution is not the penalty for leaving prayers Burning the house of someone for leaving prayers was abrogated since they did not do it except that one time.On the topic of tolerance in an islamic dawlah, there should be no problem with hanafi, maliki, shafi or hanbali courts. The laws and hadds in some situations can change if one goes to one court over another for instance in a hanafi court the one who doesn't pray will be killed and buried with the Muslims while in the hanbali masjid he will be killed and not be buried with the Muslims because the Hanabila hold the opinion the one who leaves salah is a kafir and a murtad.[QUOTE=Afghanistan2010;658085][B]He is no different [COLOR="Red"]than us[/COLOR][/B],[B]he[COLOR="Red"] blindly believes [/COLOR]in the words [COLOR="Red"]of other men[/COLOR][/B],:[/QUOTE]
2010 Admitting he's a blind believer not in God, but what other men says.Comment
-
That's not democracy, that's Oligarchy. Minute something becomes Oligarchy it is no longer democracy.Originally posted by asad71 View Post[QUOTE=Afghanistan2010;658085][B]He is no different [COLOR="Red"]than us[/COLOR][/B],[B]he[COLOR="Red"] blindly believes [/COLOR]in the words [COLOR="Red"]of other men[/COLOR][/B],:[/QUOTE]
2010 Admitting he's a blind believer not in God, but what other men says.Comment
-
Originally posted by Shamlawar Khurasani View Post
That's not what democracy is and this is probably the MOST IRRELEVANT verse to cite to demonstrate that. Look at who it mentions Rabbi and Monks, These are THEIR ULAMA, this verse is talking about ULAMA who out of their own interprettaion determine what is halal and harram.
This is one of the most BLATANT examples of irony; because this verse is exactly against the type of Government where Mullahs decide what is Lawful and Permissible on their own accord.
In most democracies , murder, rape and other crimes were not determined by the masses but were in place because these were inalienable. the Qur'an's laws are inalienable .[QUOTE=Afghanistan2010;658085][B]He is no different [COLOR="Red"]than us[/COLOR][/B],[B]he[COLOR="Red"] blindly believes [/COLOR]in the words [COLOR="Red"]of other men[/COLOR][/B],:[/QUOTE]
2010 Admitting he's a blind believer not in God, but what other men says.Comment
-
There's nothing in the Qur'an that says or even implies democracy is shirkOriginally posted by Shamlawar Khurasani View Post
It is just the interpretation of the Rabbis and Monks who think they understand God better than God does.[QUOTE=Afghanistan2010;658085][B]He is no different [COLOR="Red"]than us[/COLOR][/B],[B]he[COLOR="Red"] blindly believes [/COLOR]in the words [COLOR="Red"]of other men[/COLOR][/B],:[/QUOTE]
2010 Admitting he's a blind believer not in God, but what other men says.Comment
Comment