Fatimah Vs. Abu Bakr

[Radiant-star]

I think these issues should not be touched... These create differences and hatred among Muslims. We should rather focus on uniting Muslims so that the enemy get no chance of ridiculing us.
Most of the Muslims think that different sects in Muslims is the biggest threat to Islam and Muslims but I think its wrong. I think it is a good thing to have difference of opinion on different issues so that one sect don't go extreme in his ideologies otherwise the whole Muslim ummah would go extreme in one one thinking or ideology. If all the Muslims become a sect I would not name it, then they would start worshipping graves. Another sect would have broken the grave of prophet Muhammad peace be upon him and humiliate his grave which would be heartbreaking and against the Islamic teachings and so and so.
So these difference of opinion is for the good of the Muslims, they control each other.
Whatever Allah does is not just without wisdom. There is a great wisdom in these differences as well.

We should recognize out Biggest enemy that are the anti religious people whether they are in Muslims or non Muslims.
They are called atheists, secularists, darwinists and so and so.

[کیش]

^^

Sects are forbidden by Allah:

‘As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, thou hast no part in them in the least: their affair is with Allah: He will in the end tell them the truth of all that they did.’ Quran: 6:159

‘But people have cut off their affair (of unity), between them, into sects: each party rejoices in that which is with itself. But leave them in their confused ignorance for a time.’ Quran: 23:53-54

‘Be not like those who are divided amongst themselves and fall into disputations after receiving Clear signs; for them is a dreadful penalty.’ Quran: 3:105



‘Verily, this Brotherhood of yours is a single Brotherhood and I am your Lord and Cherisher: therefore serve Me (and no other). But cut off their affair, one from another: will they all return to Us.’ Quran: 21:92-93

[Afghanistan2010]

I cant find your Bukhari and Muslim hadiths, please provide the volume #, book # and Hadith #.


Heres how Abu Dawuds recording should not hold sway:

Abu Dawud 38:4449

Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: If anyone has sexual intercourse with an animal, kill him and kill it along with him. I (Ikrimah) said: I asked him (Ibn Abbas): What offence can be attributed to the animal, He replied: I think he (the Prophet) disapproved of its flesh being eaten when such a thing had been done to it.

Abu Dawud 38:4450


Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: There is no prescribed punishment for one who has sexual intercourse with an animal.

BTW, do you belong to a sect, or a teachings done by a scholar?

To what sect do i belong to or what makes you think that i belong to a sect when you ask this ?

Ofcourse you can't find it

Chapter No: 34, Sales and Trade
Hadith no: 267
Narrated: An-Numan bin Bashir
The Prophet said "Both legal and illegal things are obvious, and in between them are (suspicious) doubtful matters. So who-ever forsakes those doubtful things lest he may commit a sin, will definitely avoid what is clearly illegal; and who-ever indulges in these (suspicious) doubtful things bravely, is likely to commit what is clearly illegal. Sins are Allah's Hima (i.e. private pasture) and whoever pastures (his sheep) near it, is likely to get in it at any moment."
Relevance: 3.839

http://ahadith.co.uk/hadithsearchfil...t+matters&id=1


you use the right pages :

Center for Muslim-Jewish Engagement

A Partnership between the Hebrew Union College-Jewish Institute of Religion,


Omar Ibn Al Khattab Foundation, & USC Center for Religion and Civic Culture

if you know the hadith books you would have known this hadith.

[کیش]

I'm pretty secure with my knowledge level, you should work on yours. You provided that Hadith, three times, twice without the actual reference. It is only natural for me to test if you had actually read that Hadith on your own merit; without Hadith hopping for the best hadiths to read. Good job you found it.

Please explain why Abu Dawud should be considered considering those two hadiths I posted?

[Afghanistan2010]

I cant find your Bukhari and Muslim hadiths, please provide the volume #, book # and Hadith #.


Heres how Abu Dawuds recording should not hold sway:

Abu Dawud 38:4449

Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: If anyone has sexual intercourse with an animal, kill him and kill it along with him. I (Ikrimah) said: I asked him (Ibn Abbas): What offence can be attributed to the animal, He replied: I think he (the Prophet) disapproved of its flesh being eaten when such a thing had been done to it.

Abu Dawud 38:4450


Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: There is no prescribed punishment for one who has sexual intercourse with an animal.

BTW, do you belong to a sect, or a teachings done by a scholar?

There is no Book 38 within Abu Dawud,but you are reffering to the Book of Punishments :

Abu Dawud - 33) Prescribed Punishments
Hadith 4450


Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas:

There is no prescribed punishment for one who has sexual intercourse with an animal.

And

Abu Dawud - 33) Prescribed Punishments Hadith 4449
Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas:

The Prophet said: If anyone has sexual intercourse with an animal, kill him and kill it along with him. I (Ikrimah) said: I asked him (Ibn Abbas): What offence can be attributed to the animal/ He replied: I think he (the Prophet) disapproved of its flesh being eaten when such a thing had been done to it.

The contradiction lies in your view ,what if one hadith is proven to be daif or fabricated ?

And i guess both of them are daif or fabricated because i have no clarifiction or any saying of the scholars if they are sahih or hasan.

[کیش]

There is no Book 38 within Abu Dawud,but you are reffering to the Book of Punishments :



And


The contradiction lies in your view ,what if one hadith is proven to be daif or fabricated ?

And i guess both of them are daif or fabricated because i have no clarifiction or any saying of the scholars if they are sahih or hasan.

So your admitting there is some fabrication within those hadiths recorded by Abu Dawud. Isn't that enough reason not to trust Abu Dawud's other hadiths, which aren't recorded by Bukhari, or even Muslim? These particular hadiths are from his book of punishment, but not in Bukhari/Muslic published versions. They also have alot of other Hadiths that are not in the other two, and that is their narrations of Imam Mahdi, Prophet Jesus, and the Dajjal (among others); Bukhari and Muslim seldom written hadiths about this events, could it be Abu Dawud has recorded from people Bukhari didn't trust, Felt were fabrications, and weren't reliable enough to be in their respected collections?

[Afghanistan2010]

Could it be that they lived during the same era ? hein ? yes indeed.

There are enough hadiths which are proven authentic from Sunan Abu Dawud and they are a huge part of islam.

Just because there are some daif (weak) hadiths does not make his whole work for nothing.

He (may Allah be pleased with him) was a human and he did the best to avoid taking daif or fabricated hadiths.

The actual Bukhari collection contains alot of daif (weak) hadiths,for example al-Adab al-mufrad collected by Imam Bukhari(rah) contains alot of daif hadiths but what is daif (weak) the scholares are agreed if there are enough daif hadiths from different routs they could be taken in an issue as evidence,except for issues of Ibada (worship) there the authentic once are the superior once.

The scholares filtered those people containing the tranmission who were unthrustworthy and therefor it is called "Sahih Al Bukhari and Sahih Al Muslim" the other four books indeed contain daif (weak) hadiths but they make them not wrong or worthless.


The one who rejects Tirmidhi (rh),Ibn Majah (rh),Abu Dawud (rh),Nisaii (rh) has failed in his imaan and has indeed rejected the saying of the Prophet (pbuh).

[کیش]

Bukhari has hadiths that are Daif? Bukhari collected well over 300,000 narrations, but only included just over 2,000. This is from Bukhari's own words:

We were with Ishaq ibn Rahoyah who said, ‘If only you would compile a book of only authentic narrations of the Prophet.’ This suggestion remained in my heart so I began compiling the Sahih.” Bukhari also said, “I saw the Prophet in a dream and it was as if I was standing in front of him. In my hand was a fan with which I was protecting him. I asked some dream interpreters, who said to me, ‘You will protect him from lies.’ This is what compelled me to produce the Sahih. (Abridged from Hady al-Sari,the introduction to Fath al-Bari, by Ibn Hajr, pg. 8–9 Dar al-Salaam edition.)

This is what Bukhari did, before accepting a persons narration of a Hadith; three step:

Quality and soundness of the chain of narrators of the selected Hadith. Imam Bukhari has followed two principle criteria for selecting sound narratives. First, the lifetime of a narrator should overlap with the lifetime of the authority from whom he narrates. Second, it should be verifiable that narrators have met with their source persons. They should also expressly state that they obtained the narrative from these authorities. This is a stricter criterion than that set by Imam Muslim.

Imam Bukhari accepted the narratives from only those who, according to his knowledge, not only believed in Islam but practiced its teachings. Thus, he has not accepted narratives from the Murjites.

The particular arrangement and ordering of chapters. This expresses the profound knowledge of the author and his understanding of the religion.

(Mabadi Tadabbur-i-Hadith, Amin Ahsan Islahi)

Whoever told you Bukhari has dais hadiths is a liar, do not listen to these people. This is what makes Imam Muslim's collection Sahih:

Imam Muslim recorded only such narratives as were reported by two reliable successors from two Companions which subsequently travelled through two independent unbroken isnads consisting of sound narrators. Imām Bukhārī has not followed such a strict criterion.

Scientific arrangement of themes and chapters. The author, for example, selects a proper place for the narrative and, next to it, puts all its versions. Imam Bukhari has not followed this method (he scatters different versions of a narrative and the related material in different chapters). Consequently, in the exercise of understanding ahādīth, Sahīh of Imām Muslim offers the best material to the students.

The Imam informs us whose wordings among the narrators he has used. For example he says: haddathanā fulān wa fulān wallafz lifulān (A and B has narrated this hadīth to us and the wording used here is by A). Similarly he mentions whether, in a particular hadīth, the narrators have differed over the wordings even over a single letter of zero semantic significance. He also informs the readers if narrators have differed over a specific quality, surname, relation or any other fact about a narrator in the chain.

(Mabadi Tadabbur-i-Hadith, Amin Ahsan Islahi, 1989)

Abu Dawud, Tirmidhi, and others did not go in great Lenghts like Bukhari and Muslim has done to make sure what they are writing is the truth.

[Afghanistan2010]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/16768064/W...-Adab-AlMufrad

http://en.islamtoday.net/quesshow-63-773.htm

Explained that Al Adab al Mufrad contains weak narrations.

Sahih Al Bukhari is not the only collection of Imam Bukhari shows your weakness of knowledge.

You do not know Abu Dawud,Imam Tirmidhi and Ibn Majah and Nisai ( may Allah be pleased with them) thats why you have these arguments.

You do not know the hadith collections of Imam Malik (rah) you do not know the hadith collections of Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal (rah) and you do not know the other collections yet you talk about bukhari and muslim,but there are enough other collections.


Indeed Bukhari is the greatest Book after the Quran.

[کیش]

Whoah buddy calm down.

"you do not know" like 8 times, I know psychology pretty well and repeating it that much means "you do not know." instead of me not knowing, try DEBUNKING me and stop exposing your hazy relationship with Allah and his Messenger(PBUH).

[Afghanistan2010]

you belittel yourself,and you beset yourself,and if i ask you to show me where to place the hands in prayer is this mentioned in bukhari ?

is it mentioned in bukhari if one can touch quran without wudu ?

there is no hadith in bukhari and alot of other topics.

[کیش]

First, there was no official copy of Quran, during the life of the Prophet(PBUH)

Second,

Sahih Bukhari

Volume 1, Book 12, Number 771:

Narrated ‘Abdullah bin Malik bin Buhaina:

Whenever the Prophet used to offer prayer he used to keep arms away (from the body) so that the whiteness of his armpits was visible.

Sahih Muslim

Book 004, Number 0792:

Wa’il b. Hujr reported: He saw the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) raising his hands at the time of beginning the prayer and reciting takbir, and according to Hammam (the narrator), the hands were lifted opposite to ears. He (the Holy Prophet) then wrapped his hands in his cloth and placed his right hand over his left hand. And when he was about to bow down, he brought out his hands from the cloth, and then lifted them, and then recited takbir and bowed down and when (he came back to the erect position) he recited:” Allah listened to him who praised Him.” And when prostrates. He prostrated between the two palms.

Sahih Bukhari


Volume 1, Book 12, Number 704:

Narrated Abu Qilaba:

I saw Malik bin Huwairith saying Takbir and raising both his hands (on starting the prayers and raising his hands on bowing and also on raising his head after bowing. Malik bin Huwairith said, “Allah’s Apostle did the same.”

Volume 1, Book 12, Number 705:

Narrated ‘Abdullah bin ‘Umar:

I saw Allah’s Apostle opening the prayer with the Takbir and raising his hands to the level of his shoulders at the time of saying the Takbir, and on saying the Takbir for bowing he did the same; and when he said, “Sami a-l-lahu Liman hamida “, he did the same and then said, “Rabbana wa laka-l-hamd.” But he did not do the same on prostrating and on lifting the head from it.”

Volume 1, Book 12, Number 706:

Narrated Nafi’:

Whenever Ibn ‘Umar started the prayer with Takbir, he used to raise his hands: whenever he bowed, he used to raise his hands (before bowing) and also used to raise his hands on saying, “Sami a-l-lahu Liman hamida”, and he used to do the same on rising from the second Rak’a (for the 3rd Rak’a). Ibn ‘Umar said: “The Prophet used to do the same.”

Sahih Muslim

Book 004, Number 0759:

Ibn Umar reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him), when he stood up for prayer, used to raise his hands apposite the shoulders and then recited takbir (Allah-o-Akbar), and when he was about to bow he again did like it and when he raised himself from the ruku’ (bowing posture) he again did like it, but he did not do it at the time of raising his head from prostration.

Book 004, Number 0762:

Malik b. Huwairith reported: The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) raised his hands apposite his ears at the time of reciting the takbir (i. e. at the time of beginning the prayer) and then again raised his hands apposite the ears at the time of bowing and when he lifted his head after bowing he said: Allah listened to him who praised Him, and did like it (raised his hands up to the ears).

[Afghanistan2010]

Where did he (peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) place the hands in prayer ?
This has nothing to do with takbir but at standing position where did he place them ?

The Quran was written during the life time of the Prophet (pbuh).

And there are enough authentic hadiths about touching the Quran but not in Bukhari ...

[کیش]

You must be talking about this Abu Dawud Hadith:

Abu Dawood

Book 3, Number 0756:

Narrated Ali ibn AbuTalib:

Jarir ad-Dabbi reported: I saw Ali (Allah be pleased with him) catching hold of his left hand) by his right hand on the wrist above the navel.

Book 3, Number 0758:

Narrated Tawus:

The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) used to place his right hand on his left hand, then he folded them strictly on his chest in prayer.

Notice yet another contradiction: the first one said place hands on Naval (belly-button), while the other said STRICTLY on his chest.

The Quran were recorded individually, but not an official copy until Abu Bakr agreed to start writing it down; shortly after the Battle of Yamamah, where alot of the Qurrah had Been martyred.

[کیش]

You must also belief in these hadiths, which happened to skip Bukhari and Muslim, but made it to Ibn Majah and Tirmidhi magically


Abu Umama narrated: "The Messenger of God said, 'Everyone that God admits into paradise will be married to 72 wives; two of them are houris and seventy of his inheritance of the [female] dwellers of hell. All of them will have libidinous sex organs and he will have an ever-erect penis.' "
Sunan Ibn Majah, Zuhd (Book of Abstinence) 39


It was mentioned by Daraj Ibn Abi Hatim, that Abu al-Haytham 'Adullah Ibn Wahb narrated from Abu Sa'id al-Khudhri, who heard the Prophet Muhammad PBUH saying, 'The smallest reward for the people of Heaven is an abode where there are eighty thousand servants and seventy-two houri, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine and ruby, as wide as the distance from al-Jabiyyah to San'a.
Al-Tirmidhi, Vol. 4, Ch. 21, No. 2687