American Muslims and their weird mentality

[Haris]

I don't see how it is racist, racism would imply that one race is greater than another. It is a fact that if there were no Arabs there would be no Islam in Afghanistan.



It was an Arab empire. It was ruled by Arabs.
Of course it had many fighters who were not Arab. That is to be expected with any empire. The people assimilate and then fight for the common cause (which in this case was Islam).


Now I am not saying Arabs are solely responsible for the spread of Islam. But what I said was a fact.





It is commonly referred to by historians as the Arabian empire. It is also referred to as the Islamic empire. The two are not mutually exclusive.

From wiki:

The Islamic conquest of Afghanistan (642–870) began in the middle of the 7th century[1] after the Islamic conquest of Persia was completed, when Arab Muslims defeated the Sassanid Empire at the battles of Walaja, al-Qādisiyyah and Nahavand.[2] The Muslim Arabs then began to move towards the lands east of Persia and in 642 captured the city, Herat.[3] By 667 AD the Afghan area was under invasion by the Arabs but in 683 Kabul revolted and completely routed the invading army which was led by the Governor of Seistan. It was not until 870 that Kabul and the Afghan area were conquered by the Arabs.[4] The complete conversion of Afghanistan to Islam was during the period of the Ghaznavids, in or about the 11th century.

The invasion of Persia was completed five years after the death of the Islamic Prophet Muhammad (SAW), and all of the Persian territories came under Arab control, though pockets of tribal resistance continued for centuries in the Afghan territories.[2][3] During the 7th century,Arab armies made their way into the region of Afghanistan from Khorasan with the new religion of Islam. At this point in time the area that is currently Afghanistan had a multi-religious population consisting of Hindus, Buddhists, Zoroastrians, Jews, and others.

Part of the region was ruled by Turkic Hindu/Buddhist dynasty called the Kabul Shahis since the 5th century AD. The Arabs were unable to succeed in converting the population of that area because of constant revolts from the mountain tribes. In 870, Ya'qub-i Laith Saffari, a local Persian[5] ruler from the Saffarid dynasty of Zaranj, conquered most of the cities of present-day Afghanistan in the name of Islam.

Arab armies carrying the banner of Islam came out of the west to defeat the Sasanians in 642 AD and then they marched with confidence to the east. On the western periphery of the Afghan area the princes of Herat and Seistan gave way to rule by Arab governors but in the east, in the mountains, cities submitted only to rise in revolt and the hastily converted returned to their old beliefs once the armies passed. The harshness and avariciousness of Arab rule produced such unrest, however, that once the waning power of the Caliphate became apparent, native rulers once again established themselves independent. Among these the Saffarids of Seistan shone briefly in the Afghan area. The fanatic founder of this dynasty, the coppersmith’s apprentice Yaqub ibn Layth Saffari, came forth from his capital at Zaranj in 870 AD and marched through Bost, Kandahar, Ghazni, Kabul, Bamyan, Balkh and Herat, conquering in the name of Islam.[6]
—Nancy Hatch Dupree, 1971

Do you seriously deny the role of Arabs?




I am sure Muslim and Non-Muslim historians acknowledge the fact that it was ruled by Arabs. Islam was initially spread by Arabs. The Arabs had the positions of power both in governance and militarily. The Arabs introduced the world to Islam (whether it was Arab traders in Indonesia or the Sahabah during the times of Muhammad SAW).

Are these statements racist too khushal?





*Just to repeat, "Now I am not saying Arabs are solely responsible for the spread of Islam."

[khushal]

I don't see how it is racist, racism would imply that one race is greater than another. It is a fact that if there were no Arabs there would be no Islam in Afghanistan.

You are confused.
So what your saying is if there were no Arabs, there would be no Islam? That Arabs invented Islam?
What I am telling you is that if there was no Islam, no one would know the Arabs. Islam transformed the Arabs just like Islam transformed the Turks, Persian, Afghans, Indic people and others in Asia, Europe and Africa. Arab culture and their polytheistic beliefs did not rule anyone. It was Islam that ruled the region and it was Muslims that served Islam.

It was an Arab empire. It was ruled by Arabs.."

It was not an Arab Empire, it was an Islamic Empire. There were Arabs at the helm, but also there were Kurds(salahudin) and turks at the helm as well. This Empire reached from Spain to India and there were a diverse ethnic people that ran this empire.
If anything it was the Turks who ruled over the Arabs. When the Arabs fought the Turks, they still couldn't rule themselves, the French and the British ruled them after that who divided them into nations who still need assistance in managing their societies.

[faye]

you sure know how to twist things around khushal. wasn't mohammad an arab and isn't the quran in arabic? islam appears to have been introduced through an arab, then arabs and spread from there, one way or another, no?
haris made no mention of islam being 'invented' by arabs.

[graveyardofempires]

just like they call the muslim empire ottoman empire and turks claim it was turkish empire while these empires were strictly muslim and there wasnt such things as now.
they were probably fighting against arabs so how can it be an arab empire.

at once salahudin was incharge who was a Kurd so how arab was this empire.

but again pople tend to look at history through the mentality of nowadays.

[khushal]

you sure know how to twist things around khushal. wasn't mohammad an arab and isn't the quran in arabic? islam appears to have been introduced through an arab, then arabs and spread from there, one way or another, no?
haris made no mention of islam being 'invented' by arabs.

Yes he is mentioning it. He is saying if there were no Arabs, there would be no Islam. Actually Arabs tried to kill Muhammed(pbuh) and tried to prevent the spread of Islam. Islam was against the Arab way, the Arab culture, Arab beliefs. It revolutionized the Arabs just like it revolutionized other societies. He is looking at it through distorted lenses and you Faye also have blurred vision.

[Haris]

You are confused.

No, you are being pedantic over a small point that has gone completely away from the topic and is going away from my initial point. I get the impression that you are just arguing for the sake of it or its just an attempt at being self-righteous/morally superior? Anyway let's continue..

So what your saying is if there were no Arabs, there would be no Islam? That Arabs invented Islam?

No, I have never said that. Do you really think that I believe the Arabs invented Islam?

This is what I said.

It is a fact that if there were no Arabs there would be no Islam in Afghanistan.

Islam was initially spread by Arabs.
The leadersof the early Umayyad Khalifa were Arab.
The governors were Arab.
The generals were Arab.
The Arabs led the early Islamic enlightenment.

Hence if there were no Arabs, there is no guarantee that we would have Islam in Afghanistan.


I don't know how you are interpreting this point.....

What I am telling you is that if there was no Islam, no one would know the Arabs. Islam transformed the Arabs just like Islam transformed the Turks, Persian, Afghans, Indic people and others in Asia, Europe and Africa. Arab culture and their polytheistic beliefs did not rule anyone. It was Islam that ruled the region and it was Muslims that served Islam.

It was not an Arab Empire, it was an Islamic Empire. There were Arabs at the helm, but also there were Kurds(salahudin) and turks at the helm as well. This Empire reached from Spain to India and there were a diverse ethnic people that ran this empire.
If anything it was the Turks who ruled over the Arabs. When the Arabs fought the Turks, they still couldn't rule themselves, the French and the British ruled them after that who divided them into nations who still need assistance in managing their societies.

just like they call the muslim empire ottoman empire and turks claim it was turkish empire while these empires were strictly muslim and there wasnt such things as now.
they were probably fighting against arabs so how can it be an arab empire.

at once salahudin was incharge who was a Kurd so how arab was this empire.

but again pople tend to look at history through the mentality of nowadays.

Okay you two, I will quote myself for your benefit.

"Now I am not saying Arabs are solely responsible for the spread of Islam."

"It is commonly referred to by historians as the Arabian empire. It is also referred to as the Islamic empire. The two are not mutually exclusive."

"The Arabs introduced the world to Islam (whether it was Arab traders in Indonesia or the Sahabah during the times of Muhammad SAW)."


You two are referring to the Ayyubid Khalifa (which was hundreds of years later) and then you talk about the Ottoman empire (which was like a thousand years later!). I am referring to the Umayyad Khalifa. Why? Because it was not the Ayyubids or Ottomans who spread Islam to Afghanistan (which is what the initial point was about!). It was the Umayyads. The Umayyads were Arabs. The leaders were Arab. The governors were Arab. The generals were Arab. The fighters were Arab (with others mixed in as they assimilated and fought for the common cause which was Islam). Therefore it can and is called the Arab empire (as indicated by my last post) by Muslims and Non-Muslims. It can also be called the Islamic empire. Like I said, the two are not mutually exclusive. The Ottoman empire was not an Arab empire and neither was the Ayyubid. But I am not referring to those as they concern the spread of Islam many hundreds of years later. I am talking about the early spread of Islam. Do you understand now?