Is The Earth Flat?

[TheCongo]

this is a fabrication. He never said that.

How do you know it is a fabrication?

--Tyreese

[randolph85]

^ But the Hebrew scriptures allude to a flat Earth in many verses and sayings such as "four corners of the Earth" are common as well.

where better to ask about hebrew scriptures, which have nothing to do with the quran, than a pashtun forum full of muslims?

[torkham]

^ But the Hebrew scriptures allude to a flat Earth in many verses and sayings such as "four corners of the Earth" are common as well.

four corners??? get captain jack sparrow's compass, and you will see north, south, east and west, that's four isn't it?

[din]

YouTube - ‫سوال Ùˆ جواب ديني‬‎

[طالب]

Well, Alchemist was recently interview on Iraqi TV and this is what he had to say on the matter:

YouTube - ‪Iraqi TV Debate: Is the Earth Flat?‬‏

[TheCongo]

four corners??? get captain jack sparrow's compass, and you will see north, south, east and west, that's four isn't it?

Erm, do you even know what corner means? Direction and corner are two different things. There's never corners in a circle.

[Alchemist]

I already tried explaining this once but sufferers of delusional psychosis have it in their mind that religion is wrong and science is right and that is that.
Which is why the sabbatic goat is using mossad's memri tv as a source to disprove what is written in the Qur'an.

These fools are rehashing an age old argument and trying to fuse islam with christianity and hinduism and ancient mythologies that depicted a flat earth on the back of a tortoise which stood on top of four elephants which stood on top of some donkies or whatever.


If the question is in regards to the Qur'an then the context of flatness should be based within the premise of the Qur'an. Since the Qur'an was revealed for man, the context of it is from the perspective of man. We are not given a describtion from Allah's perspective, but from man's perspective. Logically, if you want to communicate with some other life being, you would want to relate to the experience of that being as much as possible. The experience of an eagle is different from that of an ant. From the perspective of man the curvature of the earth is Zero per mile. When calculating the curvature for a sphere of 25 k mile, that curvature than works out to be .000126 per mile, which is pretty damn near zero. so long as your 8 inches off the ground you can see a lantern sitting on the ground 1 mile away...so in case you didn't know the definition of flattness:

flat/flat/

Noun: The flat part of something.
Adjective: Smooth and even; without marked lumps or indentations


i am inclined towards an earth expansion theory, so it would make sense that in the past the earth was more "flatter" and that as the earth expanded mountains began to form and the irregularities emerged - this would be consistent with the Qur'anic references to creation of Earth.

small minded people like to think in absolute terms so when you argue with them .. ur either right or wrong.

[TheCongo]

Can you explain how the day changes to night and how seasons change globally?

[faye]

that is, if there is no mountain in the way, between the viewer and the lantern.

[شمله ور خراساني]

Bin Baz Never believed that the earth is flat. This is a lie spread by filthy kaafirs.

الصفØØ© الرئيسية | الموقع الرسمي لسماØØ© الشيخ عبدالعزيز بن باز


Is the Earth Round or Flat?

Introduction: The following letter reached the program (broadcast program) from Kenya, sent by our brother, the student, Ibraheem Muhammad Al-Awwal. The brother says, "I heard the program Nurun 'alad-Darb (A Light upon the Path) and I benefited greatly from it. Therefore, I wanted to send these questions to you all because their topics are very perplexing to me. The first is: Is the earth round or flat?"

The Shaikh: According to the people knowledge (scholars of Islaam) the earth is round, for indeed Ibn Hazim and a group of other scholars mentioned that there is a consensus (unanimous agreement, Ijmaa') among the people of knowledge that it is round. This means that all of it is connected together thus making the form of the entire planet like a ball. However, Allaah has spread out surface for us and He has placed firm mountains upon it and placed the animals and the seas upon it as a mercy for us. For this reason, Allaah said: "And (do they not look) at the Earth, how it was made FLAT (Sutihat)." [Al-Ghaashiyyah (88):20]

Therefore, it (the Earth) has been made flat for us in regards to its surface, so that people can live on it and so that people can be comfortable upon it. The fact that it is round does not prevent that its surface has been made flat. This is because something that is round and very large, if it is made flat (its surface), then its surface will become very vast or broad (i.e. having a flat appearance). Yes."

[khashayar]

if the earth was flat i globes would be like this above one.

but



they are like this


hence i conclude, the earth is not flat

[Alchemist]

that is, if there is no mountain in the way, between the viewer and the lantern.

do you know how mountains were formed?

[Alchemist]

Can you explain how the day changes to night and how seasons change globally?

THE EARTH’S ORBIT & ROTATION:
The circumference of the Earth at the equator is 25,000 miles. The Earth rotates in about 24 hours. Therefore, if you were to hang above the surface of the Earth at the equator without moving, you would see 25,000 miles pass by in 24 hours, at a speed of 25000/24 or just over 1000 miles per hour. The earth is also orbiting around the Sun at about 67,000 miles per hour; it takes the earth one year to complete its orbit around the sun. The earth tilts at different angles to the sun, as it revolves in orbit around the sun, causing the 4 seasons (spring, summer, fall, winter.) When the earth's north polar axis is tilted most toward the sun, it's summer in the northern hemisphere, tilted furthest away, winter. Verse 21:33 clearly establishes these facts:

12) SURAH 21:33 " "It is He Who created the Night and the Day, and the sun and the moon: ALL (the celestial bodies) rotate (yasbahuna), each in their orbit/celestial sphere (falak)."Yusaf Ali, M.H. Shakir

Here an essential fact is clearly stated: the existence of orbits and rotation for all celestial bodies. This clearly describes what is happening to the earth as it rotates every 24 hours while it also orbits around the sun during a year’s time.

THE DEFINITION OF THE ARABIC WORD "FALAK":
The Arabic word falak has often been translated as 'orbit' or 'sphere' depending on the context of the verse. Si Hamza Boubekeur in his translation of the Quran cites the diversity of interpretations given to it: "A sort of axle, like an iron rod, that a mill turns around; a celestial sphere, orbit, sign of the zodiac, speed, wave . . .", but he adds the following observation made by Tabari, the famous Tenth century commentator: "It is our duty to keep silent when we do not know." (XVII, 15). This shows just how incapable men were of understanding this concept of the Sun's and Moon's orbit or rotation. These concepts were not to be explained until centuries later. (Bucaille)

There are two very important verses that use the word "Falak."
Two Possible Translations:

1) --Sura 21, verse 33:
"(God is) the One Who created the night, the day, the sun and the moon. All the celestial bodies rotate with their own motion (yasbahuna) as they travel in their own orbit/sphere (falak)."
In the above verse the word "falak" can be translated as "celestial sphere" (M.H. Shakir); this would mean that all celestial bodies rotate in their own "sphere." The word "falak" in this verse could also be translated as "orbit;" this would mean that all celestial bodies rotate as they travel in their own orbits. It is up to the reader to decide how to translate "falak."
In the following verse the word "falak" most likely should be translated as "orbit" (Yusaf Ali). This is because verse 36:40 states that the sun must not "catch" (Yusaf Ali) or "overtake" (M.H. Shakir) the moon. This clearly refers to the sun and moon traveling in their own orbits; there will never be a collision between the sun and the moon.

2)--Sura 36, verse 40:
"The sun must not catch up the moon, nor does the night outstrip the day. Each one is rotating with its own motion (yasbahuna) as they travel in their own orbit (falak)."
These 2 verses clearly state the existence of the Sun's and Moon's orbit and rotation (36:40), plus a reference is made to the travelling of ALL celestial bodies in space with their own motion: i.e. rotation (yasbahuna ) as they travel in a "falak" celestial sphere/orbit (21:33).

THE DEFINITION OF THE ARABIC WORD "YASBAHUNA":
The Arabic word referring to a movement with a self-propelled motion is the verb sabaha (yasbahuna in the text of the above two verses). All the senses of the verb imply a movement that is associated with a motion that comes from the body in question. If the movement takes place in water, it is 'to swim'; it is 'to move by the action of one's own legs' if it takes place on land. For a movement that occurs in space, it is difficult to see how else this meaning implied in the word could be rendered other than by employing its original sense, i.e. ROTATION. (Bucaille)

[faye]

do you know how mountains were formed?

they evolved didn't they? or are they a force of nature?

[طالب]

memri tv

Whatever the political goals of Memri TV, the footage they used is actual footage from an Iraqi TV debate.

If the question is in regards to the Qur'an then the context of flatness should be based within the premise of the Qur'an. Since the Qur'an was revealed for man, the context of it is from the perspective of man. We are not given a describtion from Allah's perspective, but from man's perspective. Logically, if you want to communicate with some other life being, you would want to relate to the experience of that being as much as possible. The experience of an eagle is different from that of an ant. From the perspective of man the curvature of the earth is Zero per mile.

So basically you've made a 180 degree turn on the issue and now believe what every sane Muslim knew all along, that the Earth is round.

It's a bloody miracle.

i am inclined towards an earth expansion theory

LMAO, this guy cracks me up.

It's always one step forward and three steps back with you, isn't it Alchemist? This hypothesis is a relic. It was rejected 40 years ago yet here you are, parading it around as if the issue is currently being debated and the Expanding Earth hypothesis is perfectly valid and substantiated.

40 years behind. This really is symptomatic of you Alchemist. Completely ignorant of scientific developments, spouting falsehoods and pseudoscience that you've picked up from some Harun Yahya pamphlet.

Anyway, to anyone interested here is why the Expanding Earth hypothesis is bogus:

Scientific consensus
Generally, the Scientific community finds no evidence to support the expansion of the Earth theory, and uses the following arguments to dismiss it:

• Measurements with modern high-precision geodetic techniques show that the Earth is not currently increasing in size, and there is no source of energy to power expansion. This in contrast to plate tectonics, which is supported by a large range of geological and geophysical measurements, including direct measurements of plate motions by geodesy and of subduction at plate boundaries.[13][14][15]

• Mass accretion on a scale required to change the Earth's radius is contradicted by the current accretion rate of the Earth, and by the Earth's average internal temperature: any accretion releases a lot of energy, which would warm the planet's interior. Expanding Earth models based on thermal expansion contradict most modern principles from rheology, and fail to provide an acceptable explanation for the proposed melting and phase transitions.

• Paleomagnetic data has been used to calculate that the radius of the Earth 400 million years ago was 102 ± 2.8% of today's radius.[16][17]

• Examinations of data from the Paleozoic and Earth's moment of inertia suggest that there has been no significant change of earth's radius in the last 620 million years.[18]