Mutazilah its pashtoon relevence by ScimitarXEdge

[Alchemist]

Yeah,

Like I have nothing better to do but teach you history here.

I gathered that you are not afghan but australian? white? caucasian? So its not so much a question of "analysis" as much one of attitude...

Its annoying to read Saddam as an example of muslim killing muslim given the long history of support that Saddam enjoyed from America...especially when he was coaxed into attacking Iran....and then later kuwait. People like you just don't bother to read out of laziness and treat the problem of the Third world like you treat your recycling problem... out of convienience. Your comments bared your ignorance...and if anything it reflected the general attitude that colonialst have always felt towards the 'native'...its just sickening to me ... so excuse I don't mean to be rude ...you are the problem not us.

[faye]

so what you are saying there, is that saddam was usable and coaxable, by america, to attack other muslims. well, there goes your argument right there.
i know enough about history to know that it is not just the white race that has been colonising countries, throughout history.
your article appeared to be about tactics used by ignorant, cruel humans to subjugate and control other human beings. i have read enough already about that. what i am talking about is re-establishing ones power after that. anyway bin laden agrees. wallow in the past if you like.
i think your prejudice against me is not allowing you to see what i am saying.

[Alchemist]

what nonsense are you blabbering about woman?!

first of all, yes the white have been the colonialist...daaamn...talk about prejudice...you live in a country, continent, whose indeginous population has been reduced and marginalized to living in shanty, run-over, forgotten ghettos by your white race and then you "think" your white race isn't the only one to do this ALL OVER THE PLANET? wtf kind of bubble you live in missy? What other race out there has done the same? Such blatent lies...in the name of "free market" and "free men"...in that order...the white race has contrived of all sorts of creative ways to destablize and exploit the rest of the world...and then u have the audacity to come here and make snide remarks like "hey, you people were f'd up to begin with"...gulible sheeple ... like you don't require an effort to believe to lies .. but take it up like a sponge because your own affinity for self preservence. You never questioned the fake saddam double with the crooked teeth standing trial or the supposed chared up bodies of his son...you don't know about the carol Jackals that were trained by the internationalist to build up the false hype of "islamic terror networks" the likes of which you enjoy on your tv dramas like 24 or james bond ... indeed the common white man/woman is just a docile pawn whose every reaction has been calculated for him/her.

"my article" was an excerpt from one of the great philosophers of the last century, Jean Paul Sartre...not like i expected you to know who he is... and it was the preface to one of the greatest books written on your white race's tactics of divide and rule...and the "solution"...which contrary to your delusions has nothing to do with bin laden. How foolish can you be to think you even know what bin laden thinks? LOL ...his father and 20+ brothers and 20+ children are going about their daily business all around the world ...yet you talk of him as if he is the answer to The System to which everyone he is related to is hard wired to....


Perhaps you should have a look at your own race with clear eyes before you come study ours.

[faye]

so, you are living in a third world country, are you?

[Alchemist]

if you are trying to pretend that you are smart ...you are failing.


put your ego in check sister and then maybe you could learn a thing or two about your self.

I could give you thousands of references ...but I see that you don't care that much to read or write already...so believe what you want to ...just don't regurjitate the nonsense of your leaders on a forum that is made by third world refugees.

[faye]

so, you are not.

[Alchemist]

whats your point faye?

[Baygham]

Baygham Khanaa, I do appreciate your honesty and do hope you do not take things personally. I am happy that you are not cut out of the automaton like cloth of the ANPers. Your wittiness is appreciated. However, I shall continue to answer you with much vigor.

So, one last thing before I go off and play a game of soccer:

You noted that, in your opinion, the Yusufzai were on the wrong side of history in the following instances:

1) By not supporting Khushal Khan Khattak agaisnt the Moghuls
2) By supporting Syed Ahmad Shah Barelvi

So with that track record, who is to say that they are on the right side of history this time under your, Toramana Wrorre, etc.'s banner? Per the precedent they are usually on the wrong side of history according to you.


**Caveat: I have met a few Mardaan and Swaat derived Yusufzai throughout my medical education, and none of them are as leftist as you are; I have also met some local simple folk here in Connecticut from Swabi and they also appear to be against much of what you say (so I do not want this to seem a judgement passed on all Yusufzai).**

Ahmad faraz in urdu says,,

"koon thakoo maay raha, koon jala saray ra quzar
shahar ki hawa sub charagoo ko khoob janthi haay"

translation
"who stayed indoors and who burned in the streets
the wind in the city knows each and every lamp very well"

Yusufzai will be on the right side of history, dont worry about that, worry about other less fortunate pashtoons including our zapali brothers in southern/eastern afghanistan and FATA.

[Alchemist]

Ahmad faraz in urdu says,,

"koon thakoo maay raha, koon jala saray ra quzar
shahar ki hawa sub charagoo ko khoob janthi haay"

translation
"who stayed indoors and who burned in the streets
the wind in the city knows each and every lamp very well"

Yusufzai will be on the right side of history, dont worry about that, worry about other less fortunate pashtoons including our zapali brothers in southern/eastern afghanistan and FATA.

you are sooo desi!

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Ahmad faraz in urdu says,,

"koon thakoo maay raha, koon jala saray ra quzar
shahar ki hawa sub charagoo ko khoob janthi haay"

translation
"who stayed indoors and who burned in the streets
the wind in the city knows each and every lamp very well"

Yusufzai will be on the right side of history, dont worry about that, worry about other less fortunate pashtoons including our zapali brothers in southern/eastern afghanistan and FATA.

Thank goodness I dont know a word of urdu... otherwise my motto might not have been: Baygham Khan is wrong whether indoors or in the streets.

[khushal]

do you mean faced by or created by, the colonisers? there has to be a point whereyou stop blaming the colonisers for all the things that are done by muslims and take responsibility. look what saddam did to people in his country, look what some of your own have done in afghanistan. you have quoted malalai a couple of times and she is dissed from the govt in afghanistan for speaking the truth. i have also read about the issues between sunni and shia throughout history. i read about that because i was wondering why the muslims were not supporting each other.

The kind of social evolution that your talking about happens naturally in any human society unless interfered by outside force. When the British and French broke the ottoman empire and the moghul empire, they intentionally left those places in a condition where unity and self interest poliicies are prevented to take hold. If something happens where there is a chance of unity to spring, there will be interference from outside to nip it in the bud.

If you read carl marx work, he predicted that societies will evolve from feudal to capitalism to socialism. He was wrong about that but what he wasnt wrong about was that societies naturally unite into fererations or unions for self interest. If you look at the European Union and you look at the Arabs. Carl Marx would have predicted that the Arabs would have a unoin before the europeans just because the arabs have one language, one religion and similar culture. Commonality forces societies to from unions much faster. The europeans would take much longer because of too many differences although it would happen. Today Turkey is begging the Europeans to join their union because they realize their are too many obsticles for some union to occur in the middle East.

Now these protest happening in the Middle East might change that, but the west is going to work hard to interfere because it is not in their interest for arab unity, muslim unity, south asian unity, southeast asian unity or any unity that is not the west. Because if that were to occur their power and consumption of resources would be marginalized.

[faye]

well capitalism doesn't seem to be working all that well with being controlled by the billionaires, maybe we will still end up at socialism in the future.
from what i read there is a conflict between shia and sunni, so that can't be blamed on the west, or can it? but we will never know if it is not attempted, for the muslims to unite. it is looking as though the saudis are against iran becoming too powerful and from what i can gather there is a sunni, shia clash there. hazaras are coming to australia claiming mistreatment from other afghans. young people are complaining on here about the prejudices between differing tribal groups or if one is living in pakistan or afghanistan.
why is saudi arabia so supportive of america? michael moore claimed that the saudis are keeping america afloat with their investment in the usa.
why hasn't karzai gone to a muslim country to do business deals? (possibly because he wants weapons from russia) yes, i am aware of the manipulating and division creating activities of colonisers and those interested in stealing from the muslim lands. (contrary to some peoples opinion of my capacity to think) i have seen how israel attacks another country like lebanon when it is developing and blows their latest developmants to smithereens, that america imposed atrocious rules in iraq and got them to sign up overseas companies on long term lease at low rates. i would love to see muslims get it together for themselves! i guess that is it basically.

[Alchemist]

[QUOTE-faye]from what i read there is a conflict between shia and sunni, so that can't be blamed on the west, or can it? but we will never know if it is not attempted, for the muslims to unite. it is looking as though the saudis are against iran becoming too powerful and from what i can gather there is a sunni, shia clash there.[/QUOTE]

The sunni shia rift is not the same as the Protestant and Catholic "conflict" or other christain sectarian differences that were blamed for the hundred year war of europe. If it's a question of unity, look at lebanon where shias and sunnies have no choice but to cooperate with each other. Still half of bahrain, lebanon, yemen and iraq is shia, a third of kuwait and a fifth of Afghanistan and Pakistan and Turkey. Even though in total shias make up only a tenth of the Muslim population they are free to practice their religion...shias and sunnies have a lot more in common that protestants and catholics do...the differences in their creed is only in or two major points but the scholars of Islam, sunni or shia, all adhere to the Qur'an as the final source of revelation.
The Saudis and the UAE princes have agreed to sell their oil in dollars only and upon receiving the cash they are expected to invest it back into the US economy. It's only 5 million of 20 Million Saudis that are wallowing in riches without any care...the rest eat the crumbs of the floor. Even though a saudi Prince may have substantial shares in, say, foxnews, he has no sway over the opinions of Murdoch. Didn't you hear about the last deal between the us and the saudies? $60 billion worth of military hardware sold to the saudies....the princes bought a few dozen white elephants for which more money would have to be spent for its maintenance. The Saudis family came to power after defeating the Shareef of Hejaz, whose sons were the amir of what used to be transjordon and also iraq...the Shareef had made agreements with Lawerance's superior that the British would allow the Palestinians to have their land after they drive out the Ottomon forces. Britain also made another deal with Rothschild, the Balfour declaration, promising to give palestine to the jews. So you can see why the big sheikh of the house saud made deals with the british...that they would aid the Israelis...so that tradition has carried on since a hundred years. Oil has peaked, some say it peaked 10 years ago...so in the near future the fight for resources are bound to intensify.

[faye]

thanks, alchemist. some of that i knew but i do need to do more study of the middle east history re the europeans. since i wrote my first comment, here about muslims or pashtuns organising to have peaceful protests, i have read how the american govt are now trying to frame the organisers of peaceful protests to make them look bad. the more i know, the more i don't want to know. it is depressing.
i am also reading about my own governments being influenced by jews, here.