Muslim Trouble making

[کیش]

People like to bring up violent verses in the Qu'ran but fail to read the verses that follow. Which promoted peace if it is an option.

Allah says in the Quran:

...So We decreed for the tribe of Israel that if someone kills another person - unless it is in retaliation for someone else or for causing corruption in the earth - it is as if he had murdered all mankind. And if anyone gives life to another person, it is as if he had given life to all mankind. Our Messengers came to them with Clear Signs but even after that many of them committed outrages in the earth. (Qur'an 5: 32)

Lastly Allahs Apostle (PBUH) said:
Allah's Messenger (PBUH) said: "The Harj (will increase)." They asked, "What is the Harj?" He replied, "(It is) killing (murdering), (it is) murdering (killing)."(Bukhari)

The world will not come to an end until a day would come to the people on which there will be general massacre and bloodshed.(Muslim)

The mass killings going on in the world was predicted by our Prophet (PBUH) 1400 years ago.

[Karachi]

People like to bring up violent verses in the Qu'ran but fail to read the verses that follow. Which promoted peace if it is an option.

Allah says in the Quran:

...So We decreed for the tribe of Israel that if someone kills another person - unless it is in retaliation for someone else or for causing corruption in the earth - it is as if he had murdered all mankind. And if anyone gives life to another person, it is as if he had given life to all mankind. Our Messengers came to them with Clear Signs but even after that many of them committed outrages in the earth. (Qur'an 5: 32)

Lastly Allahs Apostle (PBUH) said:
Allah's Messenger (PBUH) said: "The Harj (will increase)." They asked, "What is the Harj?" He replied, "(It is) killing (murdering), (it is) murdering (killing)."(Bukhari)

The world will not come to an end until a day would come to the people on which there will be general massacre and bloodshed.(Muslim)

The mass killings going on in the world was predicted by our Prophet (PBUH) 1400 years ago.

Brother there are way more violent verses then peaceful ones, also the mass killings of muslims by muslims has been going on since the time of Ali and Ayesha, both Muslims and non muslims have died in the last 1400 years, nothing is new here

[Karachi]

"..One wanders to the left, another to the right. Both are equally in error, but, are seduced by different delusions... "

Yes, but I really want to stay in the Middle, this is why I have always said, to be in the middle, but it is hard for me to ignore the so many violent and strange verses in the Quran itself, not to mention Hadiths, which are full of this stuff. I am human after all, I need to know why these things exist, have we all been lied too?

Personally I dont want to become enemy of muslims, however I want them to civilize by becoming peaceful. The problem is, extremism in the muslim world has caused extreme damage to the muslim psyche. If muslims just ignore the violent stuff in Islamic texts, put an end to political Islam and just follow Islam on spiritual basis, we will all become happy. Keep religion where it belongs, dont mix it with state matters, this is what we all liberal type want. But unfortunately many people among us who wont agree with this.

[Karachi]

You're moving on to a different topic here now. The start point of violence between Muslims and non Muslims is a hell of a lot more complicated than that. It's not a simple case of one group following Islam rigidly and declaring war on another based on expansion of their own religion. If only things were as clear cut as that.

Yes I agree it's complicated and yes definatly Christianity is very violent too, however, two wrong things dont make a right, do they?

Like I said in my previous post, if muslims just follow Islam spiritually, rather then politically, it will be great for the whole world

[Karachi]

I find it hard to beleive, but on the off chance you may be telling the truth, I would hate to think what Al-Azhar University will think when they realise something like you has passed through their system. I think your Arab teacher would hang his head in shame.

I didn't say Al Azhar University, I said a teacher from Al Azhar taught me. He lived in Canada, he was also a professor here at a Canadian college. I learned how to read Quran in proper arabic from him

[Karachi]

because you say so? Why didn't you copy and paste the annotation and citations page?

And how do you know they were cited correctly? Did you go back to the sources and check for yourself?

no, it's not because I say so, it is part of their islamic biographies, I will bring citations once I have time, but they are all over the internet, just google search on their names will give your their history and how they were killed, by muslims themselves

[Karachi]

Truly sadning for kids, even Imran Khan speaks on this (Bacha Baazi) in Pakistan, mostly Pashtuns are interviewed here:

[Karachi]

^ what image are you giving to the world, is this the fault of jews, hindus or americans too??

[کیش]

Brother there are way more violent verses then peaceful ones, also the mass killings of muslims has been going on since day one of Islam, both Muslims and non muslims have died, nothing is new here

If you want to go there, than you can't ignore the first 10 years of the Prophets (PBUH) message in Mecca. where they were getting beaten, humiliated and robbed for believing in Islam. for 10 years they did nothing but take beatings because they were commanded not to engage in hostility. The Muslims were then thrown out of their homes to the desert, until they found Medina whose residents welcomed them.

Now you are going to bring up what happened to the Jewish tribes in Medina.

Banu Qaynuqa:

Broke treaty with the Muslims by molesting a sister in their marketplace. this led to a spite of revenge killings on both sides. Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) addressed Qaynuqa

O Jews, beware lest God bring on you the like of the retribution which he brought on Quraysh. Accept Islam, for you know that I am a prophet sent by God. You will find this in your scriptures and in God's covenant with you.

Qaynuqas response

Muhammad , do you think that we are like your people? Do not be deluded by the fact that you met a people with no knowledge of war and that you made good use of your opportunity. By God, if you fight us you will know that we are real men

That was a declaration of war on Qaynuqas part. so they were besieged and exiled.

Banu Nadir

Before the Battle of the Trench, it was revelaed that Banu Nadir planned on assassinating the Prophet (PBUH) during a meeting. That was a declaration of war. so the Nadir were also besieged and exiled.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

no, it's not because I say so, it is part of their islamic biographies, I will bring citations once I have time, but they are all over the internet, just google search on their names will give your their history and how they were killed, by muslims themselves

Islamic Biographies? Which bigrapphy, , you mean Ibn Ishaq? One which has a disclaimer by its author that he only related various claims and not affirm the veracity of the stories? THAT biography?

Alright and don't forget to show the actual sources you're citing so we can cross reference them. because we all know the sites you use DON'T do that.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Truly sadning for kids, even Imran Khan speaks on this (Bacha Baazi) in Pakistan, mostly Pashtuns are interviewed here:

And you said pederasty isn't common among Indics.

[DaZahroJaam.]

Yes, but I really want to stay in the Middle, this is why I have always said, to be in the middle, but it is hard for me to ignore the so many violent and strange verses in the Quran itself, not to mention Hadiths, which are full of this stuff. I am human after all, I need to know why these things exist, have we all been lied too?

Personally I dont want to become enemy of muslims, however I want them to civilize by becoming peaceful. The problem is, extremism in the muslim world has caused extreme damage to the muslim psyche. If muslims just ignore the violent stuff in Islamic texts, put an end to political Islam and just follow Islam on spiritual basis, we will all become happy. Keep religion where it belongs, dont mix it with state matters, this is what we all liberal type want. But unfortunately many people among us who wont agree with this.

Indifference is the ugliest word in the entire of the English dictionary. You are supposed to be passionate about your beliefs but wrapping them in a cloth of hypocrisy just because that's a popular trend amongst whoever you are in opposition with, beats the purpose of that argument.


Also, look in to perseverance. You are surrounded by a pact of dogs in this forum these days and they have gotten in to your head. Don't let them do that to you.

[Manzareh]

Ahh the comforting girlfriend is back again. Cringe.. "Don't let them do that to you" as if the guy isn't here day and night picking fights and making ridiculous threads. Khudai de dwara taba barbaad ke

[DaZahroJaam.]

zar zali, ameen.

[Manzareh]

Valid points raised by Ferdows and co, will just leave this Karachi guy to it. Just goes round in circles.

Makes false unrefrenced claims > is asked to prove it > is given a clear refutation > swiftly diverts to another topic > switches to attacking Pashtuns > acts like he wants to learn > fatty butts it > repeat from the start again.

Muslims are the most secure and happy people, in general we are very proud of being Muslim and show it to the world, all walks of life and races are tied together with Islam, Muslims are the most outspoken and confident people on earth. it hurts insecure guys like him that envy that. No matter what you do Mr.Patel it's never going to change. You will always be an insecure depressed angry guy with nowhere but this forum to vent your frustration and us? Well we'll be just fine. Astalavista